5th Grade CogAT : Number Correct

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, for whatever reason they used the age normed, not the grade normed, which disadvantaged somewhat the kids with fall birthdays (and the red-shirted kids), and advantaged the younger kids in the grade. Since it's an achievement test and not an IQ test, I think it was wildly inappropriate to use the age norms and not the grade norms, as you would not normally think a 5th grader should be compared to a 6th grader in achievement (unless you were prepping that kid outside of school).
I don't care that much, as I didn't want my kid to go to one of those schools, but I just think it's an example of MCPS being sort of irrational about much of this.

How could it not all be scored with reference to fifth graders? Fifth graders are the only ones taking the test, aren’t they?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This thread is cracking me up--it's so much like College Confidential around the time college decisions are released, down to checking UPS notifications to see what kind of package will be arriving.

Here are my kid's stats:

Cogat raw scores V55, Q47, NV 39 (the lowest I've seen on here), which translates to MCPS V97%, Q93%, NV79%, and national 99%, 99%, and 93% for a 99% composite (VQN).
Fall Map-M 249, Map-R 238.
5s on PARCC
All As

Recommended for both Eastern and TPMS.

White boy, high SES (Whitman feeder) ES, not CES. No prepping. Didn't realize he took the Cogat, and, in fact, never heard of it before we got the letter in the mail yesterday. Had not considered the possibility of magnets, so this is all a surprise.

You know what's funny? A lot of us will likely be at one open house or the other. Should we have a secret DCUM sign, or would you prefer to pretend you've never even heard of this site?

My child also got a markedly lower NV (lower than your child's) and was accepted to one. I think it suits him, but it is wild, right?

[Anonymous]

PP from the Whitman cluster makes me wonder how big of a component PARCC scores were, as my kid's scores were pretty similar except I think had 4's on the 4th grade PARCC (had 5s on the 3rd grade) because the kid had a book kid preferred to read instead of doing the PARCC (as reported by child when I asked how PARCC went).
I'm only really following this thread because MCPS is so deliberately opaque about the whole thing that it makes me really curious about what the process is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, for whatever reason they used the age normed, not the grade normed, which disadvantaged somewhat the kids with fall birthdays (and the red-shirted kids), and advantaged the younger kids in the grade. Since it's an achievement test and not an IQ test, I think it was wildly inappropriate to use the age norms and not the grade norms, as you would not normally think a 5th grader should be compared to a 6th grader in achievement (unless you were prepping that kid outside of school).
I don't care that much, as I didn't want my kid to go to one of those schools, but I just think it's an example of MCPS being sort of irrational about much of this.

I disagree, perhaps because my kid didn’t turn 10 until September. He’s essentially a year younger than some of his peers. Now we could hold him back a whole year to increase his chances (craziness) or his age could be factored in. I’m glad it was. Otherwise I’d bet most of the accepted kids would be the older ones. It does still make a difference at age 10.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP from the Whitman cluster makes me wonder how big of a component PARCC scores were, as my kid's scores were pretty similar except I think had 4's on the 4th grade PARCC (had 5s on the 3rd grade) because the kid had a book kid preferred to read instead of doing the PARCC (as reported by child when I asked how PARCC went).
I'm only really following this thread because MCPS is so deliberately opaque about the whole thing that it makes me really curious about what the process is.

Yeah, I have no clue about any of this. I'll see if I can find his actual PARCC scores to post. They don't show up on the MyMCPS portal, do they?

On the non-verbal score, from what I read on the Cogat profile, it sounds like kids who do well on that measure are visual learners/kids with good spatial awareness. That's definitely not my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread is cracking me up--it's so much like College Confidential around the time college decisions are released, down to checking UPS notifications to see what kind of package will be arriving.

Here are my kid's stats:

Cogat raw scores V55, Q47, NV 39 (the lowest I've seen on here), which translates to MCPS V97%, Q93%, NV79%, and national 99%, 99%, and 93% for a 99% composite (VQN).
Fall Map-M 249, Map-R 238.
5s on PARCC
All As

Recommended for both Eastern and TPMS.

White boy, high SES (Whitman feeder) ES, not CES. No prepping. Didn't realize he took the Cogat, and, in fact, never heard of it before we got the letter in the mail yesterday. Had not considered the possibility of magnets, so this is all a surprise.

You know what's funny? A lot of us will likely be at one open house or the other. Should we have a secret DCUM sign, or would you prefer to pretend you've never even heard of this site?

My child also got a markedly lower NV (lower than your child's) and was accepted to one. I think it suits him, but it is wild, right?

I’m definitely going to be pretending I’ve never heard of this site!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, for whatever reason they used the age normed, not the grade normed, which disadvantaged somewhat the kids with fall birthdays (and the red-shirted kids), and advantaged the younger kids in the grade. Since it's an achievement test and not an IQ test, I think it was wildly inappropriate to use the age norms and not the grade norms, as you would not normally think a 5th grader should be compared to a 6th grader in achievement (unless you were prepping that kid outside of school).
I don't care that much, as I didn't want my kid to go to one of those schools, but I just think it's an example of MCPS being sort of irrational about much of this.

How could it not all be scored with reference to fifth graders? Fifth graders are the only ones taking the test, aren’t they?

Kids who have been red shirted might be compared with kids who are in sixth grade. And do they should be!

[Anonymous]

They are not. They are compared with 5th graders in the same age category.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This thread is cracking me up--it's so much like College Confidential around the time college decisions are released, down to checking UPS notifications to see what kind of package will be arriving.

Here are my kid's stats:

Cogat raw scores V55, Q47, NV 39 (the lowest I've seen on here), which translates to MCPS V97%, Q93%, NV79%, and national 99%, 99%, and 93% for a 99% composite (VQN).
Fall Map-M 249, Map-R 238.
5s on PARCC
All As

Recommended for both Eastern and TPMS.

White boy, high SES (Whitman feeder) ES, not CES. No prepping. Didn't realize he took the Cogat, and, in fact, never heard of it before we got the letter in the mail yesterday. Had not considered the possibility of magnets, so this is all a surprise.

You know what's funny? A lot of us will likely be at one open house or the other. Should we have a secret DCUM sign, or would you prefer to pretend you've never even heard of this site?

There are so many layers of the admissions process (local norming, peer group, etc.) that I think everyone forgets that MCPS consciously has been trying to make sure there's representation from each ES. In practice that means usually at least the 2 top scorers at a school will get in no matter how they compare with others in their SES band or peer cohort. The elementary schools where few people go to the CES are the most competitive. The elementary schools where many of the top kids go to the CES may be easier some years. I know at our CES there are some elementary schools that only sent 2-3 kids but others that sent 10 kids!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They are not. They are compared with 5th graders in the same age category.

No they are compared with kids the same age. My 10y1m is compared to other kids who are 10y1m. Some of them might be in 4th grade. A redshirted kid who is 11y1m or older is compared to kids the same age.

[Anonymous]

According to DD, exactly 2 kids seem to have gotten in to each magnet from our ES.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are not. They are compared with 5th graders in the same age category.

No they are compared with kids the same age. My 10y1m is compared to other kids who are 10y1m. Some of them might be in 4th grade. A redshirted kid who is 11y1m or older is compared to kids the same age.

You are incorrect about this. They are compared to 5TH GRADERS who are the same age. Look up the documentation please.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are not. They are compared with 5th graders in the same age category.

No they are compared with kids the same age. My 10y1m is compared to other kids who are 10y1m. Some of them might be in 4th grade. A redshirted kid who is 11y1m or older is compared to kids the same age.

The age norming only compares kids within the same grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread is cracking me up--it's so much like College Confidential around the time college decisions are released, down to checking UPS notifications to see what kind of package will be arriving.

Here are my kid's stats:

Cogat raw scores V55, Q47, NV 39 (the lowest I've seen on here), which translates to MCPS V97%, Q93%, NV79%, and national 99%, 99%, and 93% for a 99% composite (VQN).
Fall Map-M 249, Map-R 238.
5s on PARCC
All As

Recommended for both Eastern and TPMS.

White boy, high SES (Whitman feeder) ES, not CES. No prepping. Didn't realize he took the Cogat, and, in fact, never heard of it before we got the letter in the mail yesterday. Had not considered the possibility of magnets, so this is all a surprise.

You know what's funny? A lot of us will likely be at one open house or the other. Should we have a secret DCUM sign, or would you prefer to pretend you've never even heard of this site?

There are so many layers of the admissions process (local norming, peer group, etc.) that I think everyone forgets that MCPS consciously has been trying to make sure there's representation from each ES. In practice that means usually at least the 2 top scorers at a school will get in no matter how they compare with others in their SES band or peer cohort. The elementary schools where few people go to the CES are the most competitive. The elementary schools where many of the top kids go to the CES may be easier some years. I know at our CES there are some elementary schools that only sent 2-3 kids but others that sent 10 kids!

I could probably guess the school in the Whitman cluster this PP's child attends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They are not. They are compared with 5th graders in the same age category.

No they are compared with kids the same age. My 10y1m is compared to other kids who are 10y1m. Some of them might be in 4th grade. A redshirted kid who is 11y1m or older is compared to kids the same age.

You are incorrect about this. They are compared to 5TH GRADERS who are the same age. Look up the documentation please.

I have looked up the documentation and that is what it told me. If you have documentation that says differently, please point me in that direction.