Question about re zoning elementary schools in S. Arlington

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:20 years ago this conflict didnt exist. As the area got wealthier some umc moved to SA to save a few bucks knowing that the achools suck.Those are the people causing these issues and stirring up people. No one feels guilty in NA and its not our fault that you made the decision that you did. Dont try to get schools equivalent to those in NA housing price point. You get what you pay for.

It's a public education, so we pay the same and are supposed to get the same. You're hoarding resources by resisting boundary changes. It is your fault. Not everyone can afford to live in north Arlington and there aren't enough houses anyway.

Shame on you for choosing poorly while paying the "same".

I shoulda chosen to be rich, you're right

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:20 years ago this conflict didnt exist. As the area got wealthier some umc moved to SA to save a few bucks knowing that the achools suck.Those are the people causing these issues and stirring up people. No one feels guilty in NA and its not our fault that you made the decision that you did. Dont try to get schools equivalent to those in NA housing price point. You get what you pay for.

It's a public education, so we pay the same and are supposed to get the same. You're hoarding resources by resisting boundary changes. It is your fault. Not everyone can afford to live in north Arlington and there aren't enough houses anyway.

Shame on you for choosing poorly while paying the "same".

I shoulda chosen to be rich, you're right

You are rich. You paid the "same".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:20 years ago this conflict didnt exist. As the area got wealthier some umc moved to SA to save a few bucks knowing that the achools suck.Those are the people causing these issues and stirring up people. No one feels guilty in NA and its not our fault that you made the decision that you did. Dont try to get schools equivalent to those in NA housing price point. You get what you pay for.

It's a public education, so we pay the same and are supposed to get the same. You're hoarding resources by resisting boundary changes. It is your fault. Not everyone can afford to live in north Arlington and there aren't enough houses anyway.

Shame on you for choosing poorly while paying the "same".

I shoulda chosen to be rich, you're right

You are rich. You paid the "same".

Dp- catch 22. They get the “good” north arlignton schools, but they also get people
Like you for neighbors. It’s hard to know if the it’s worth the sacrifice, ya know?

[Anonymous]

If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sometimes these post crack me up and infuriate me at the same time.

The idea that SA schools are horrible is laughable. Here are some things that make schools horrible

- being closed due to mold
- Schools where kids can't focus because the heat or AC doesn't work
- unsafe drinking water
- rampant pest infestation
- high levels of violence
- text books that haven't been updated for 20 years
- Schools where the state can only afford to keep them open for 4 days
- schools were teachers are paid 20K a year
- schools where the state only spend 5K per yr per student
- you know schools that look like this
http://ktar.com/story/2017614/teachers-share-photos-of-disturbing-classroom-conditions/



What doesn't make schools horrible?

Schools that perform slightly worse than other schools, a difference that is further reduced when looking at students with similar profiles in both schools.

If the schools were as comparable as you say, why are people paying hundreds of thousands in housing premiums and commute times instead of attending SA schools? Seems to me those thousands of people know something you don't. But actually, I bet you live in NA and this explanation is your way of pretending the differences don't exist or need to be addressed.

No, I live in SA and send my kid to a school in SA. I am not saying there aren't differences or that those differences don't need to be addressed. I am saying that those differences aren't because of teaching or school quality. They are issues that can't be addressed by just the school. Schools full of rich white kids score well on standardized tests designed by rich white people to be taken by rich white people. That really isn't that surprising. It doesn't mean that kids in SA are getting some horrible education that will not prepare them for the world.

There are schools in this country were the majority of the population is graduating without being able to read proficiently. Where the majority has no hope at college. Where the majority is dropping out. Where violence permeates that classroom and hallways. These are NOT problems in SA Arlington schools. Schools with kids are scoring in the 80th percentile are not horrible when we have schools across this nation where kids routinely score in the 30th percentile. For example, the HS my husband went to. 28% of students are proficient in English, The average . At Wakefield? 85% for English. Washington-Lee 89% for English and Yorktown 95% (these may be from last yr, I just nabbed them off GS). You can not sit here and seriously tell me that a school is objectively horrible by scoring 10% less than the school people pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for when there are schools in this country were only 28% of the pop I English proficient on testing!

Do SA schools have legitimate issues? Yes. Are there inadequacies that need to be addressed? Sure. Are they horrible? No. Most of these country would be lucky to go to a school as good as a school in SA.

We're talking about elementary schools in Arlington. Stop telling me to be to just be happy to have a pot to p1ss in. I don't lack perspective and I've sacrificed to get where I am so save the lecture. When less than half the school passes a proficiency test, and another has a pass rate above 90 percent, and they are 3 miles apart, yes, we do have a problem.

I am not saying there aren't issues. I am just saying that the issues ARE not because of school teaching quality. This becomes obvious to me when you break down the scores by race. To address the issues in test scores you are going to have to address fundamental inequalities in this country and systematic racism and none of it is made better by folks on this message board calling all S. Arlington schools horrible or degrading parents who choose to send their kids to S. Arlington schools.

Every single school in APS is fully accredited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

Totally agree with this, and it can be done in neighborhood schools without impacting anyone in NA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

Totally agree with this, and it can’t be done in neighborhood schools without impacting anyone in NA.

Fixed it for ya!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

Totally agree with this, and it can be done in neighborhood schools without impacting anyone in NA.

Agree as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

Totally agree with this, and it can be done in neighborhood schools without impacting anyone in NA.

Agree as well.

There are multiple reasons to have more balanced diversity within each school. But setting that aside, there must be things schools can do to better serve the various student groups. Systematic segregation within the school is just not politically correct, even though a segregated school system doesn't bother the SB or CB.

One of the biggest obstacles to closing achievement gaps is the language barrier. APS has stated that once a student becomes proficient enough in English, they quickly catch-up with their higher-performing peers. So, why do we have to insist on the same K-12 system for kids who need to acquire that proficiency? Why not "track" them into a high intensity English acquisition program and forget about trying to hold them to the current expectations for each grade level until they are ready and able to start learning and truly achieving in their English-taught schools? So what if you're 7 in 1st grade instead of 6. Or 15 in 9th instead of 13. Considering the segregation of our neighborhoods and schools, and APS' refusal to implement economically diverse boundaries, those 7 and 15 year olds will have plenty of peers so that they don't stand out like sore thumbs or don't have classmates of comparable maturity. Or, just put them in a separate intensified training school/program until they are strongly on grade level and can shift over with everyone else.

Yes, I know, what a horrible person I must be for even suggesting such a thing. But if it can better serve them, and allow schools to meet the needs of students who are not behind, as long as grades and test scores take precedence over social development and interaction (which is what APS has been saying by refusing to acknowledge the differences or to create demographically balanced schools), why not?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If that’s the question I am happy to live in S Arlington. The N Arlington folks thinking they deserve more are just a holes.

But the SA folks who want to bus NA kids to SA to whiten up their neighborhood school and validate their real estate investment....those folks are just peachy.

I'm UMC and not white. We just want schools that are high quality and serve all the students. Maybe that means carve outs for students not learning English, so they can be challenged.

Totally agree with this, and it can be done in neighborhood schools without impacting anyone in NA.

Agree as well.

There are multiple reasons to have more balanced diversity within each school. But setting that aside, there must be things schools can do to better serve the various student groups. Systematic segregation within the school is just not politically correct, even though a segregated school system doesn't bother the SB or CB.

One of the biggest obstacles to closing achievement gaps is the language barrier. APS has stated that once a student becomes proficient enough in English, they quickly catch-up with their higher-performing peers. So, why do we have to insist on the same K-12 system for kids who need to acquire that proficiency? Why not "track" them into a high intensity English acquisition program and forget about trying to hold them to the current expectations for each grade level until they are ready and able to start learning and truly achieving in their English-taught schools? So what if you're 7 in 1st grade instead of 6. Or 15 in 9th instead of 13. Considering the segregation of our neighborhoods and schools, and APS' refusal to implement economically diverse boundaries, those 7 and 15 year olds will have plenty of peers so that they don't stand out like sore thumbs or don't have classmates of comparable maturity. Or, just put them in a separate intensified training school/program until they are strongly on grade level and can shift over with everyone else.

Yes, I know, what a horrible person I must be for even suggesting such a thing. But if it can better serve them, and allow schools to meet the needs of students who are not behind, as long as grades and test scores take precedence over social development and interaction (which is what APS has been saying by refusing to acknowledge the differences or to create demographically balanced schools), why not?

Same poster here. I'll add that there are classes that can be integrated within such a program, so the kids are still interacting with each other - art, music, PE, FLES. So I guess it's about relaxing the push on the core subjects until the language has been sufficiently mastered.

[Anonymous]

APS doesn’t get to tell the state what kids can and can’t take sols. They don’t get to opt the immigrant kids out to a different ESL program. That’s just not how the system works.
You’re 8?
You are in second grade and they are responsible for having you master second grade material.
That’s it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:APS doesn’t get to tell the state what kids can and can’t take sols. They don’t get to opt the immigrant kids out to a different ESL program. That’s just not how the system works.
You’re 8?
You are in second grade and they are responsible for having you master second grade material.
That’s it.

That's not 100% true. Kids can be held back and repeat years. Not uncommon for teachers to recommend a kindergartner repeat kindergarten, or even first graders repeat first grade. If you don't have enough credits, you're not a senior; and you're not a high school graduate because you're 18. You have to be 5 to be eligible to enter kindergarten; but you don't have to go. The State mandates being in school by age 6. It does not mandate going into first grade when you are 6. Society may pressure teachers not to recommend holding kids back, or parents to not follow teacher recommendations.

Nevertheless, the point was made that it's not politically correct; but it might be worth considering if there is an alternative structure that could actually address the achievement gaps. Continually forcing kids who are significantly behind to follow along with the kids who aren't is not necessarily in their best interest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:APS doesn’t get to tell the state what kids can and can’t take sols. They don’t get to opt the immigrant kids out to a different ESL program. That’s just not how the system works.
You’re 8?
You are in second grade and they are responsible for having you master second grade material.
That’s it.

No, they're responsible for having you meet minimal standards. No one is required to actually master the grade level curriculum.