The Cass Review Final Report

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

What civil rights are people trying to remove for your child?

Seriously? Do you know how many anti trans bills were passed just last year? It’s literally illegal for my kid to pee in the right bathroom in Florida. She looks just like an average teenage girl and they want her in the men’s bathroom. Look for yourself if you want to pretend you actually care.

https://www.advocate.com/politics/anti-trans-laws-by-state

Let’s say it again for those in the back of the room.

Calling for open, evidence-based inquiry into how to treat gender questioning kids is NOT the same as right-wing band.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

conversion therapy is actually when gender nonconforming kids are pushed into a binary through medical intervention.

I think you can google conversion therapy. It’s well known what it is and that it fails and has hurt many people.

Being gender non conforming is not the same thing as being transgender. So you’re showing your lack of knowledge here. My child was always allowed to express gender any way she wanted to. Her dysphoria was not related to how she was allowed to act but by her actual body, which did not align with her perception of herself. There was no one pushing her into the binary. If anything, there was a lot of questioning and reflection which she had spent several years doing alone and then months of therapy and many many many conversations.

What you’re saying are just typical anti trans tropes meant to scare people. The reality is much more banal.

That’s how it worked for YOUR kid. The whole issue is kids being pushed much more quickly into irreversible choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

When it has to do with research and policy, no, it is not about any individual.

And since almost all kids who take puberty blockers go on to cross-sex hormones, that is indeed transitioning.

Since your child is trans you should be more adamant about solid research and protocols; not less.

Of course policy affects individuals. Look at Arizona? You’re going to deny that government affects individuals? That’s the entire point of laws.

No. It is not transitioning any more than using puberty blockers for precocious puberty is transitioning. What you’re objecting to is the idea that the blockers themselves are somehow causing the transitioning? Then why don’t they do that for kid with precocious puberty? Why aren’t all kids with precocious puberty who are treated with blockers trans? No. You’re objecting to the idea that the parents of these kids are validating their kids feelings and you think they should be putting kids in conversion therapy instead. I would never deny that there are situations where kids shouldn’t rush into blockers or HRT but those decisions should be made by individual families —not random people.

I am very interested in research, and I did more than my share. But I’m not interested in bias and bad faith arguments. And frankly, we made our choices and they were the right ones. I don’t need to second guess when I see my child thriving.

Well, it’s been lost in the debate, but I think that puberty blockers are understudied for precocious puberty, and I also think early normal puberty is being pathologized as “precocious,” almost exclusively in girls.

For gender questioning kids, puberty blockers are absolutely the first step in transition because they are intended to stop normal puberty and almost inevitably lead to cross-sex hormones.

Anyway, your just being dishonest when you claim that there was open debate and the Cass Report is a biased interloper. There was NO debate allowed in the US establishment until the news started to come out of Europe - just look at what happened to Dr Littman.

I never said anything about this report because I never read it. It was obvious to me from the first post here that this was just another person who is weirdly obsessed with transgender people and their supportive parents.

You literally ignored what I said when I said that if puberty blockers lead to transitioning is it most likely because families are supportive of those decisions. If it’s not your kid, it’s not your business.

I don’t have a kid with precocious puberty so why would I have an opinion about what parents do in those situations? You really must not have any problems of your own.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

conversion therapy is actually when gender nonconforming kids are pushed into a binary through medical intervention.

I think you can google conversion therapy. It’s well known what it is and that it fails and has hurt many people.

Being gender non conforming is not the same thing as being transgender. So you’re showing your lack of knowledge here. My child was always allowed to express gender any way she wanted to. Her dysphoria was not related to how she was allowed to act but by her actual body, which did not align with her perception of herself. There was no one pushing her into the binary. If anything, there was a lot of questioning and reflection which she had spent several years doing alone and then months of therapy and many many many conversations.

What you’re saying are just typical anti trans tropes meant to scare people. The reality is much more banal.

That’s how it worked for YOUR kid. The whole issue is kids being pushed much more quickly into irreversible choices.

Why do you think my kid and our family are so different from other kids in the same situation and their families?

Why would you assume we are so different?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

What civil rights are people trying to remove for your child?

Seriously? Do you know how many anti trans bills were passed just last year? It’s literally illegal for my kid to pee in the right bathroom in Florida. She looks just like an average teenage girl and they want her in the men’s bathroom. Look for yourself if you want to pretend you actually care.

https://www.advocate.com/politics/anti-trans-laws-by-state

Average teenage girls don’t have pen!53s, unlike your child.

But you know it’s just because you CARE so much. You’re just such CARING individuals. The poor children! We must think of the children.

Not because you’re bigots. Right?

I don’t want this to get lost. This is what you align yourself with. Don’t forget it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

What civil rights are people trying to remove for your child?

Seriously? Do you know how many anti trans bills were passed just last year? It’s literally illegal for my kid to pee in the right bathroom in Florida. She looks just like an average teenage girl and they want her in the men’s bathroom. Look for yourself if you want to pretend you actually care.

https://www.advocate.com/politics/anti-trans-laws-by-state

Let’s say it again for those in the back of the room.

Calling for open, evidence-based inquiry into how to treat gender questioning kids is NOT the same as right-wing band.

Unfortunately, the culture wars have made it almost impossible for this to be discussed in any way in open forums that would actually be helpful to parents of trans kids. That’s why we discuss these issues away from people like most of you where we can share our concerns without trolls and bigots.

Sure. In theory this is great. But in practice anything that CAN be weaponized against trans people currently is.

[Anonymous]

Many thanks to the fellow parents of trans kids who are trying to explain that we all consulted heavily with doctors, mental health professionals, and our children for years before proceeding with any decisions about transitioning. We all know that none of us rushed into this -- and those of us who have kids who are thriving as a result of this private health care decision-making process are all so fortunate. We don't want to see other families deprived of their right to make private family decisions with their doctors. Bad faith armchair quarterbacks -- like many of the people on this thread, invoking CPS and lobotomies -- and political groups trying to shut down the civil rights of trans people and interfere with private medical & parenting decisions won't sway us from being what we absolutely at the end of the day need to be -- supportive of our children. My heart goes out to all the other families of trans kids & adults. We have a lot of work to do to make the world safer for our loved ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

What civil rights are people trying to remove for your child?

Seriously? Do you know how many anti trans bills were passed just last year? It’s literally illegal for my kid to pee in the right bathroom in Florida. She looks just like an average teenage girl and they want her in the men’s bathroom. Look for yourself if you want to pretend you actually care.

https://www.advocate.com/politics/anti-trans-laws-by-state

Let’s say it again for those in the back of the room.

Calling for open, evidence-based** inquiry into how to treat gender questioning kids is NOT the same as right-wing band.

** but only evidence that supports our views.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

When it has to do with research and policy, no, it is not about any individual.

And since almost all kids who take puberty blockers go on to cross-sex hormones, that is indeed transitioning.

Since your child is trans you should be more adamant about solid research and protocols; not less.

Of course policy affects individuals. Look at Arizona? You’re going to deny that government affects individuals? That’s the entire point of laws.

No. It is not transitioning any more than using puberty blockers for precocious puberty is transitioning. What you’re objecting to is the idea that the blockers themselves are somehow causing the transitioning? Then why don’t they do that for kid with precocious puberty? Why aren’t all kids with precocious puberty who are treated with blockers trans? No. You’re objecting to the idea that the parents of these kids are validating their kids feelings and you think they should be putting kids in conversion therapy instead. I would never deny that there are situations where kids shouldn’t rush into blockers or HRT but those decisions should be made by individual families —not random people.

I am very interested in research, and I did more than my share. But I’m not interested in bias and bad faith arguments. And frankly, we made our choices and they were the right ones. I don’t need to second guess when I see my child thriving.

Well, it’s been lost in the debate, but I think that puberty blockers are understudied for precocious puberty, and I also think early normal puberty is being pathologized as “precocious,” almost exclusively in girls.

For gender questioning kids, puberty blockers are absolutely the first step in transition because they are intended to stop normal puberty and almost inevitably lead to cross-sex hormones.

Anyway, your just being dishonest when you claim that there was open debate and the Cass Report is a biased interloper. There was NO debate allowed in the US establishment until the news started to come out of Europe - just look at what happened to Dr Littman.

I never said anything about this report because I never read it. It was obvious to me from the first post here that this was just another person who is weirdly obsessed with transgender people and their supportive parents.

You literally ignored what I said when I said that if puberty blockers lead to transitioning is it most likely because families are supportive of those decisions. If it’s not your kid, it’s not your business.

I don’t have a kid with precocious puberty so why would I have an opinion about what parents do in those situations? You really must not have any problems of your own.

Parents don’t decide these things in a vacuum. They decide based on what doctors say, and what insurance will cover. The activist community has absolutely been brutally piling on anyone who researched the issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

Your SON - a male - is on female birth control hormones.

If I really have to explain to you what’s wrong with that you are beyond help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

I have an older teen trans kid who was miserable and transitioned several years ago and is now thriving and happy, going to an excellent college. We banked sperm should she ever want kids, which she says she does not. There has been no surgery and I don't know if there will ever be. She came out after most of puberty, so we didn't have to make any decisions about blockers, but looking back I think it would have been the right thing to do since she does have a few male characteristics, such as a deeper voice, which she has had to train to try and sound more feminine. If she had not gone through any male puberty she would be indistinguishable from cis female peers. However, because she was not THAT far through puberty she almost always passes, which will make life a lot easier for her. She was not a "child" when she came out, but she was under 18. Children are not being given HRT OR surgeries. Older teens are given HRT and sometimes (pretty rarely) surgeries, obviously with parents' permissions.

The people who are obsessed with this are the same people who will then call trans women predators who are trying to "invade women's spaces." And "take over" women's sports. They want it both ways--to deny trans people the ability to pass and then harass and vilify them when they don't. There is no winning. They want trans people to suffer. There is no legitimate reason for concern about what a tiny minority of people regarding these medical decisions unless you are the parent of a trans kid.

These arguments are never in good faith. They never come from a place of genuine concern. You can see right from the beginning of this thread the OP just wanted to talk about how bad it is to give minors HRT and used this study as a way to do it. Honestly, it's weird. It's a weird obsession.

I don't have to read that study because this is my life and my kid's life. It wasn't an easy decision to make and it wasn't made lightly. I feel angry when I see people trying to act like this matters to them when they have no skin in the game. It would be like me telling a bunch of people whose kids have an eating disorder that everything they're doing is wrong when my kid has never had an eating disorder. But I don't feel defensive--I feel annoyed and angry and just wish people would live their own lives and stay. out of our family's choices. It doesn't feel very different to me than people trying to take away abortion rights and get into people's reproductive freedoms.

We made the right decision for our kid. Thankfully we live in a state that has not just used this as a culture war issue to gin up votes.

Again this is about silencing alternative viewpoints, not your kid transitioning post-puberty.

That’s ridiculous. Of course it’s about my child. “Alternative viewpoints” are the exact things that are leading to anti trans laws around the county. “Alternative viewpoints” have real repercussions for real people and real families. I’m so sorry that your desire to talk about things that don’t actually impact you at all is being inconvenienced by my desire for my child to have civil rights.

No child medically transitions PRE puberty. That’s what blockers are used for. They delay puberty.

What civil rights are people trying to remove for your child?

Seriously? Do you know how many anti trans bills were passed just last year? It’s literally illegal for my kid to pee in the right bathroom in Florida. She looks just like an average teenage girl and they want her in the men’s bathroom. Look for yourself if you want to pretend you actually care.

https://www.advocate.com/politics/anti-trans-laws-by-state

Average teenage girls don’t have pen!53s, unlike your child.

But you know it’s just because you CARE so much. You’re just such CARING individuals. The poor children! We must think of the children.

Not because you’re bigots. Right?

I don’t want this to get lost. This is what you align yourself with. Don’t forget it.

Thanks for bumping that up. I must have missed it earlier.

PP is 100% accurate.

Transgender haters aren’t generally obsessing over other types of medical treatments for teens, fighting for gender equality in sports, or advocating for prison reform. Only when a transgender person is involved is there some big problem for them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

Your SON - a male - is on female birth control hormones.

If I really have to explain to you what’s wrong with that you are beyond help.

No one GAF what the bigots think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

Your SON - a male - is on female birth control hormones.

If I really have to explain to you what’s wrong with that you are beyond help.

No one GAF what the bigots think.

And there you have it, ladies and gentlemen.

Name calling and hostility is all they have left when confronted with the truth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many thanks to the fellow parents of trans kids who are trying to explain that we all consulted heavily with doctors, mental health professionals, and our children for years before proceeding with any decisions about transitioning. We all know that none of us rushed into this -- and those of us who have kids who are thriving as a result of this private health care decision-making process are all so fortunate. We don't want to see other families deprived of their right to make private family decisions with their doctors. Bad faith armchair quarterbacks -- like many of the people on this thread, invoking CPS and lobotomies -- and political groups trying to shut down the civil rights of trans people and interfere with private medical & parenting decisions won't sway us from being what we absolutely at the end of the day need to be -- supportive of our children. My heart goes out to all the other families of trans kids & adults. We have a lot of work to do to make the world safer for our loved ones.

[phone]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, I didn’t read it because I’m not obsessed about what other families choose to do with their medical decisions—especially ones approved by the American Association of Pediatrics.

Did you know that vaccines cause autism? I read it somewhere. It must be true.

So just because a family approves of a certain treatment for gender dysphoria, we all have to shut up, regardless of the harm it may cause? What about faith healing parents who deny their children medical care because it's "against their religion"? Should they be excused?

If it's not YOUR kid, shut up. There are a lot of things I disagree with other parents about. It's not your business and ask yourself why you're so obsessed with this instead of the thousand other medical decisions parents make for and with their children.

Children are taken from homes and sent into foster care for less. The bottom line is that children cannot consent to life altering surgery and drugs.

And there you have it.

They want to make it illegal to support transgender kids.

.

What exactly does “support” trans kids mean to you?

To me, it means helping them sort through their gender issues and helping them align with their thinking with their physical body, thus avoiding a lifetime of treatment as a medical patient

1. You do realize this was exactly the misguided idea behind conversion therapy that never worked and just caused trauma to gay people?

2. You do realize that most people have a “lifetime of treatment as a medical patient” as you describe it? Have you been on birth control? If so, you’ve basically been on what my kid is on. So where is the outcry over teens and older women on birth control or using HRT for perimenopause and menopause? And while we’re at it, better take away anti depressants, heart medication, diabetes, ADHD, etc….all the medications that people take throughout their lives.

Your SON - a male - is on female birth control hormones.

If I really have to explain to you what’s wrong with that you are beyond help.

I understand you don’t like trans people. You think they’re crazy? What…confused? Degenerate? Who knows. Violating god’s norms?

At least you’re honest about it—unlike the OP? Or maybe you ARE the OP and you just waited to say what you really think.