Offering Support to Jewish Friends

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree and i also find it strange how the media seems to be only showcasing the stories of murdered Israelites when there are so many murdered Palestinians. There have been very strange reactions to this and I think many dont even know how to react or what to do

I've seen lots of media about murdered and injured Palestinians. Check out CBS news - excellent empathetic coverage of the toll on innocent people on both sides. Last week Norah O'Donnell was in tears reporting about twin Israeli babies who were orphaned in the initial Hamas attack. Today, they covered a Palestinian doctor who found out while he was on shift that his wife and children were injured and one of his sons didn't make it. The whole thing is just awful. (And also Hamas is a terrorist organization that should be condemned).

I have, too - I think you're not looking, if you're not seeing those stories. Yesterday's episode of The Daily was all about voices from Gaza, too.

And my gd that child in Chicago. I read someplace that he thought the man who killed him was going to give him a hug, before he started stabbing.

[Anonymous]

Hamas has offered a hostage exchange for all the Israeli Palestinian prisoners.

(I personally hope they microchip GPS trackers first to make sure the prisoners cannot hurt anyone else.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Jew here. My non-Jewish friends and family didn't reach out to me after Pittsburgh or so far related to Israel, even though I work in a Jewish institution and regularly attend synagogue. My take after Pittsburgh was that, of course, everyone was appalled by what had happened, so I didn't really need anyone to specifically check on me, because I could assume they weren't supportive of massacring people. Would it have been nice for someone to ask me how I was doing after Pittsburgh? Absolutely. But I wasn't really hurt that nobody did, because there was no doubt in my mind that they were horrified.

The difference I feel with regard to the current situation in Israel is that not only has nobody checked in to see how I'm feeling about the situation or how my friends and coworkers who live there are doing, but that so many of my non-Jewish friends (and honestly some of my lefty/DSA Jewish friends) are offering up "nuanced" takes on the violence, as if there can be any justification for Hamas' slaughter. SO MANY of them are posting about oppression in Gaza without a WORD of sympathy for behe@ded Israeli babies or r@ped Israeli women or mut!lated Israeli grandparents. And saying "oh, Hamas is doing this because of XYZ Israeli policy" is f*ing excuses and victim blaming. There is NO excuse.

We can talk about Israeli policy toward Gaza and we can talk about US and international aid and we can talk about what Palestinian freedom without terrorism would/could possibly look like (not now, because I don't have the space in my heart for it), but we need to also talk about Jewish and Israeli pain. You want to add nuance to this war? Let's talk about the complicated relationship between Israel and the Jewish Diaspora. Let's talk about the balance between security and freedom. Let's talk about how we didn't want to be judged by President Trump and maybe Israel doesn't want to be judged by Bibi. Let's talk about how I have so many liberal Jewish friends (myself included) who support human rights and don't like the right wing government in Israel and also need Israel to exist, because of the Holocaust and because of Charlottesville and because of Pittsburgh. And I have so many liberal Jewish friends who have to bury their Jewishness in certain liberal spaces in order to advocate for others, because Jewish = Israel in those spaces and intersectionality is great, unless it's Jewish. It's HARD to want ALL THE THINGS at once, but here we are.

So, yes, I think the non-Jews need to say something and check in.

Well said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree and i also find it strange how the media seems to be only showcasing the stories of murdered Israelites when there are so many murdered Palestinians. There have been very strange reactions to this and I think many dont even know how to react or what to do

I've seen lots of media about murdered and injured Palestinians. Check out CBS news - excellent empathetic coverage of the toll on innocent people on both sides. Last week Norah O'Donnell was in tears reporting about twin Israeli babies who were orphaned in the initial Hamas attack. Today, they covered a Palestinian doctor who found out while he was on shift that his wife and children were injured and one of his sons didn't make it. The whole thing is just awful. (And also Hamas is a terrorist organization that should be condemned).

I have, too - I think you're not looking, if you're not seeing those stories. Yesterday's episode of The Daily was all about voices from Gaza, too.

And my gd that child in Chicago. I read someplace that he thought the man who killed him was going to give him a hug, before he started stabbing.

I saw that too. Apparently the family had a great relationship with him right up until he attacked them. That poor family!

[Anonymous]

As a Non-Jew, it is so confusing. You have some Jews who don't want to be assumed as connected to the wars like the original poster, you have others that do appreciate it, and you have some that are upset when they don't see support.

To the those who do not like people reaching out, I wish you would see the good intentions in people and not look for an issue to complain about. You are LUCKY you have friends that support you IF you needed the support. If you don't, move on.

I will continue to live my life doing what I feel is best without the worry of those needing to analyze my actions. That is ON YOU, not me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jew here. My non-Jewish friends and family didn't reach out to me after Pittsburgh or so far related to Israel, even though I work in a Jewish institution and regularly attend synagogue. My take after Pittsburgh was that, of course, everyone was appalled by what had happened, so I didn't really need anyone to specifically check on me, because I could assume they weren't supportive of massacring people. Would it have been nice for someone to ask me how I was doing after Pittsburgh? Absolutely. But I wasn't really hurt that nobody did, because there was no doubt in my mind that they were horrified.

The difference I feel with regard to the current situation in Israel is that not only has nobody checked in to see how I'm feeling about the situation or how my friends and coworkers who live there are doing, but that so many of my non-Jewish friends (and honestly some of my lefty/DSA Jewish friends) are offering up "nuanced" takes on the violence, as if there can be any justification for Hamas' slaughter. SO MANY of them are posting about oppression in Gaza without a WORD of sympathy for behe@ded Israeli babies or r@ped Israeli women or mut!lated Israeli grandparents. And saying "oh, Hamas is doing this because of XYZ Israeli policy" is f*ing excuses and victim blaming. There is NO excuse.

We can talk about Israeli policy toward Gaza and we can talk about US and international aid and we can talk about what Palestinian freedom without terrorism would/could possibly look like (not now, because I don't have the space in my heart for it), but we need to also talk about Jewish and Israeli pain. You want to add nuance to this war? Let's talk about the complicated relationship between Israel and the Jewish Diaspora. Let's talk about the balance between security and freedom. Let's talk about how we didn't want to be judged by President Trump and maybe Israel doesn't want to be judged by Bibi. Let's talk about how I have so many liberal Jewish friends (myself included) who support human rights and don't like the right wing government in Israel and also need Israel to exist, because of the Holocaust and because of Charlottesville and because of Pittsburgh. And I have so many liberal Jewish friends who have to bury their Jewishness in certain liberal spaces in order to advocate for others, because Jewish = Israel in those spaces and intersectionality is great, unless it's Jewish. It's HARD to want ALL THE THINGS at once, but here we are.

So, yes, I think the non-Jews need to say something and check in.

Well said.

As a liberal non-Jew, we did not have time to grieve for the Jewish people because the Israeli govt started bombing and killing thousands of innocent Palestinian civilians. That is why the focus and outrage is on the genocide of the Palestinian people because it is STILL going on 12 days after the original attack. We need a ceasefire and negotiations to return the kidnapped people. We need to care for those displaced and injured on both sides.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's something I can't really discuss in real life.

Over the past few days, I've seen a lot of social media offering support to Jewish friends and posts from Jewish friends suggesting people offer support. People have reached out to me in light of what is happening in Israel that never did during say, the synagogue attacks in the United States or other events that felt much more connected to me as a Jew in the United States. I get the good instinct, which is why I'd never say anything other than thank you. But does this make anyone else uncomfortable? I get that religion and politics are inexorably intertwined in Israel; however, there is something I really don't like about the assumption that, as a Jew, I have a special connection to the country of Israel, any more than I would, Ukraine, for example, where my grandparents actually came from. It seems a really short distance from the dual loyalty trope.

In case this is too vague, I've had texts, for example, from people I've haven't spoken to in months, offering "support to my family in this difficult time."

So you want people to reach out for every tragedy, but not for the single biggest tragedy of your lifetime. I don't get it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a Non-Jew, it is so confusing. You have some Jews who don't want to be assumed as connected to the wars like the original poster, you have others that do appreciate it, and you have some that are upset when they don't see support.

To the those who do not like people reaching out, I wish you would see the good intentions in people and not look for an issue to complain about. You are LUCKY you have friends that support you IF you needed the support. If you don't, move on.

I will continue to live my life doing what I feel is best without the worry of those needing to analyze my actions. That is ON YOU, not me.

well maybe the key is to actually know your friends instead of hyperfocusing on gestures that are primarily meant for you and not the recipient?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jew here. My non-Jewish friends and family didn't reach out to me after Pittsburgh or so far related to Israel, even though I work in a Jewish institution and regularly attend synagogue. My take after Pittsburgh was that, of course, everyone was appalled by what had happened, so I didn't really need anyone to specifically check on me, because I could assume they weren't supportive of massacring people. Would it have been nice for someone to ask me how I was doing after Pittsburgh? Absolutely. But I wasn't really hurt that nobody did, because there was no doubt in my mind that they were horrified.

The difference I feel with regard to the current situation in Israel is that not only has nobody checked in to see how I'm feeling about the situation or how my friends and coworkers who live there are doing, but that so many of my non-Jewish friends (and honestly some of my lefty/DSA Jewish friends) are offering up "nuanced" takes on the violence, as if there can be any justification for Hamas' slaughter. SO MANY of them are posting about oppression in Gaza without a WORD of sympathy for behe@ded Israeli babies or r@ped Israeli women or mut!lated Israeli grandparents. And saying "oh, Hamas is doing this because of XYZ Israeli policy" is f*ing excuses and victim blaming. There is NO excuse.

We can talk about Israeli policy toward Gaza and we can talk about US and international aid and we can talk about what Palestinian freedom without terrorism would/could possibly look like (not now, because I don't have the space in my heart for it), but we need to also talk about Jewish and Israeli pain. You want to add nuance to this war? Let's talk about the complicated relationship between Israel and the Jewish Diaspora. Let's talk about the balance between security and freedom. Let's talk about how we didn't want to be judged by President Trump and maybe Israel doesn't want to be judged by Bibi. Let's talk about how I have so many liberal Jewish friends (myself included) who support human rights and don't like the right wing government in Israel and also need Israel to exist, because of the Holocaust and because of Charlottesville and because of Pittsburgh. And I have so many liberal Jewish friends who have to bury their Jewishness in certain liberal spaces in order to advocate for others, because Jewish = Israel in those spaces and intersectionality is great, unless it's Jewish. It's HARD to want ALL THE THINGS at once, but here we are.

So, yes, I think the non-Jews need to say something and check in.

Well said.

As a liberal non-Jew, we did not have time to grieve for the Jewish people because the Israeli govt started bombing and killing thousands of innocent Palestinian civilians. That is why the focus and outrage is on the genocide of the Palestinian people because it is STILL going on 12 days after the original attack. We need a ceasefire and negotiations to return the kidnapped people. We need to care for those displaced and injured on both sides.

Jewish woman here, with family in Israel. I agree with you 100% that the outrage and grief and focus right now must be on the genocide of Palestinians in Gaza, killings and arrests in the West Bank, first of all. Because the catastrophe they are experiencing is a dire emergency. If nobody reaches out to me because they're too upset about what's happening to the innocent, then I am grateful and right there with them.

[Anonymous]

The focus should totally be on the victims of Hamas’s genocide and ethnic cleansing, return of all hostages, and support for the women and children raped and tortured by this evil regime. Bring them home!

[Anonymous]

Posting because I just need a venue to get this out. I’m struggling right now. I’m Jewish but don’t consider myself a Zionist. I have some distant family in Israel, who have been there since 1915 or so escaping the pograms in Russia so we’ll before the establishment of Israel. I think the current Israeli government is trash. But the attacks on the 7th were just shocking to the system and the reaction that Israel deserved it just hits me at my core.

But I also don’t feel as connected to what’s going on as some of my other Jewish colleagues who have been actively pushing our leadership to say something about the Hamas attack. Of course that is only met with calls about how the plight of the Gazans is worse. Why does this have to be the battle of the oppressed? But alas that’s what it feels like and the inability for us to acknowledge the greatest loss of Jewish life since the Holocaust is leading to calls of antisemitism.

I’m just emotionally tired from all of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Posting because I just need a venue to get this out. I’m struggling right now. I’m Jewish but don’t consider myself a Zionist. I have some distant family in Israel, who have been there since 1915 or so escaping the pograms in Russia so we’ll before the establishment of Israel. I think the current Israeli government is trash. But the attacks on the 7th were just shocking to the system and the reaction that Israel deserved it just hits me at my core.

But I also don’t feel as connected to what’s going on as some of my other Jewish colleagues who have been actively pushing our leadership to say something about the Hamas attack. Of course that is only met with calls about how the plight of the Gazans is worse. Why does this have to be the battle of the oppressed? But alas that’s what it feels like and the inability for us to acknowledge the greatest loss of Jewish life since the Holocaust is leading to calls of antisemitism.

I’m just emotionally tired from all of this.

It’s gaslighting. It’s people “being over” Jewish trauma of the Holocaust and expecting us to have moved on. It’s more of the same that we have had to deal with for two millennia. Really didn’t think I’d see this in my lifetime. I see you…and I’m exhausted, too. But if I’m going to be pushed into a corner and denied the ability to hold two truths simultaneously, I’m going to choose Israel. And I’m learning to be ok with that. Hugs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not a Jew but I have had a number of Jewish friends over the years and I really don't get the OP.

I'm well versed in the history of the Jewish people and even studied with a consideration toward conversion a couple of decades ago - I instead ended up becoming an atheist. I nevertheless maintain great affinity and sympathy for the Jewish people and the millennia of persecution they have endured.

I'm really surprised that there are Jews who don't give a hoot about the massacre of other Jews anywhere in the world, and who are so frustrated by the sympathy shown them by friends that they feel compelled to complain about that sympathy on an internet board.

I can't help but wonder if OP is a troll.

OP here. It's not that I don't "give a hoot" about the massacre of Jews. IF you are that well versed in Jewish culture, I'm sure you are aware of the dual loyalty trope. I'm not uncomfortable with people expressing their shock and dismay with what is going on in the middle east, I'm uneasy when they assume, as a Jew, I have a special connection to Israel and Israelis that is really different than their connection, which is to react on a purely human level. And yes, in real life I say thank you and move on. But I don't think it's a bad thing to put out there that that this is a very complicated issue, and your message of support may not land well with everyone. Like some other posters have alluded to, there's no one good answer or response to this situation, so perhaps blanket facebook messages (at least ones that are telling other people what to do or feel... and aren't about your own feelings) or texts to people you aren't that close to (but happen to be Jewish) isn't the best approach.

So it's just the Israel thing? If hundreds of Jews had been massacred in some other location, condolences would be welcomed?

Your attempts to police how Jews feel about this issue is really creepy. Maybe just STFU?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Posting because I just need a venue to get this out. I’m struggling right now. I’m Jewish but don’t consider myself a Zionist. I have some distant family in Israel, who have been there since 1915 or so escaping the pograms in Russia so we’ll before the establishment of Israel. I think the current Israeli government is trash. But the attacks on the 7th were just shocking to the system and the reaction that Israel deserved it just hits me at my core.

But I also don’t feel as connected to what’s going on as some of my other Jewish colleagues who have been actively pushing our leadership to say something about the Hamas attack. Of course that is only met with calls about how the plight of the Gazans is worse. Why does this have to be the battle of the oppressed? But alas that’s what it feels like and the inability for us to acknowledge the greatest loss of Jewish life since the Holocaust is leading to calls of antisemitism.

I’m just emotionally tired from all of this.

It’s gaslighting. It’s people “being over” Jewish trauma of the Holocaust and expecting us to have moved on. It’s more of the same that we have had to deal with for two millennia. Really didn’t think I’d see this in my lifetime. I see you…and I’m exhausted, too. But if I’m going to be pushed into a corner and denied the ability to hold two truths simultaneously, I’m going to choose Israel. And I’m learning to be ok with that. Hugs.

The thing is, you don’t have to choose a side in the sense of believing that one side is somehow right and innocent.

Terrorists murdering people is always wrong, and the Hamas attacks were evil with no possible justification at all. Also, there’s a lot wrong with the current Israeli government. Both things are true. Jingoistic denial of that truth doesn’t make the world better.

I say all this as someone who used to live in Israel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Jew here. My non-Jewish friends and family didn't reach out to me after Pittsburgh or so far related to Israel, even though I work in a Jewish institution and regularly attend synagogue. My take after Pittsburgh was that, of course, everyone was appalled by what had happened, so I didn't really need anyone to specifically check on me, because I could assume they weren't supportive of massacring people. Would it have been nice for someone to ask me how I was doing after Pittsburgh? Absolutely. But I wasn't really hurt that nobody did, because there was no doubt in my mind that they were horrified.

The difference I feel with regard to the current situation in Israel is that not only has nobody checked in to see how I'm feeling about the situation or how my friends and coworkers who live there are doing, but that so many of my non-Jewish friends (and honestly some of my lefty/DSA Jewish friends) are offering up "nuanced" takes on the violence, as if there can be any justification for Hamas' slaughter. SO MANY of them are posting about oppression in Gaza without a WORD of sympathy for behe@ded Israeli babies or r@ped Israeli women or mut!lated Israeli grandparents. And saying "oh, Hamas is doing this because of XYZ Israeli policy" is f*ing excuses and victim blaming. There is NO excuse.

We can talk about Israeli policy toward Gaza and we can talk about US and international aid and we can talk about what Palestinian freedom without terrorism would/could possibly look like (not now, because I don't have the space in my heart for it), but we need to also talk about Jewish and Israeli pain. You want to add nuance to this war? Let's talk about the complicated relationship between Israel and the Jewish Diaspora. Let's talk about the balance between security and freedom. Let's talk about how we didn't want to be judged by President Trump and maybe Israel doesn't want to be judged by Bibi. Let's talk about how I have so many liberal Jewish friends (myself included) who support human rights and don't like the right wing government in Israel and also need Israel to exist, because of the Holocaust and because of Charlottesville and because of Pittsburgh. And I have so many liberal Jewish friends who have to bury their Jewishness in certain liberal spaces in order to advocate for others, because Jewish = Israel in those spaces and intersectionality is great, unless it's Jewish. It's HARD to want ALL THE THINGS at once, but here we are.

So, yes, I think the non-Jews need to say something and check in.

Well said.

As a liberal non-Jew, we did not have time to grieve for the Jewish people because the Israeli govt started bombing and killing thousands of innocent Palestinian civilians. That is why the focus and outrage is on the genocide of the Palestinian people because it is STILL going on 12 days after the original attack. We need a ceasefire and negotiations to return the kidnapped people. We need to care for those displaced and injured on both sides.

This is insane. As a Arabic speaker who lived in the Middle East for many years and is as pro-Palestinian as anyone, I’ve got to say that this is an insane response. Any Arab or Western government would have done exactly the same thing that Israel has. ANY government. Most would have done far worse.

PP, did you mourn the 400,000 Iraqi conscripts that GWB ordered carpet bombed during the first gulf war? How about the hundreds of thousands killed in Yemen? How about the 1.2 million Iraqi civilians killed in the Iraq war?