I am Russian, she is Ukrainian, we were friends

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would this xenophobia be acceptable if China invaded Taiwan? A lot of WASPs around here seem to relish the opportunity to discriminate against non Aryan looking white people. I guess since it’s not socially acceptable to be bigoted against Blacks, Asians and Hispanics they need a healthy release valve for all their pent up bigotry and are taking it out on Slavs.

I think if China threatened to nuke us, people would be a lot more xenophobic towards Chinese people. It's understandable.

Don’t you think we can rise above xenophobia?

No. We recently elected a president whose main campaign promise was to build a border wall. So, no.

Well, you specifically could perhaps rise above it.

Unless they're outspoken in their opposition towards Putin, I will always view Russians with suspicion. That's just how it is now.

So how does that work? If you meet a Russian-American, they have to introduce themselves as follows: “Hi, I’m Aleksey and I hate Putin”? And if they don’t, you’re suspicious?

German citizens had to deal with this after World War II. There are many other examples in history. It's not like it's a new concept. It takes about 20 years after the cessation of hostilities for memories to start to fade. Germany post WW2 was accelerated by the Cold War.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

I missed nothing, I’m so sorry you and your false gotchas keep getting you nowhere. Oh well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:and she is no longer talking to me. I am anti-Putin, I support humanitarian efforts. She was my friend for 20 years and now she blocked me, told her children not talk to mine. What can I do? What should I do? I am devastated and so are my children.

Are you clearly opposed to the war? One thing we have encountered with Russian friends is that they take an equivocal position regarding the war in which they place some blame on the Ukrainians (or NATO, etc). I can imagine Ukrainians not having a lot of patience with both-sidesing the war right now.

I place absolutely no blame on the Ukrainians. This is their land that is being raped. I do not support Russian position and if anything, I have called for a no fly zone over Ukraine.

It is not enough as a Russian to “call for” something and say you are opposed. What concretely are you doing? you and your family, including your kids? Are you raising money? Are you attending protests? Are you writing your rep and asking for support for a no fly zone? Have you asked how you can support, concretely, your friends family? Do they have relatives still in Ukraine? What concrete help have you offered to get them out or provide them with supies or contacts?

If you are just talk and no action, your friend sees that as a betrayal.

A lot of Americans are opposed to no-fly zone, our politicians thread carefully when it comes to this for a reason, it's a complicated matter. Why should she be obligated to take this position exactly? It's a very different thing than donating, helping refugees, showing support, attending protests against the war. And if this friend is living here, what is her protesting going to do exactly? Why does she, an American citizen has to atone for the sins of deranged dictators of the country she left probably ages ago and cannot relate to? Do you all not see how wrong this is?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

I missed nothing, I’m so sorry you and your false gotchas keep getting you nowhere. Oh well.

You did, though. Oh well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:and she is no longer talking to me. I am anti-Putin, I support humanitarian efforts. She was my friend for 20 years and now she blocked me, told her children not talk to mine. What can I do? What should I do? I am devastated and so are my children.

Are you clearly opposed to the war? One thing we have encountered with Russian friends is that they take an equivocal position regarding the war in which they place some blame on the Ukrainians (or NATO, etc). I can imagine Ukrainians not having a lot of patience with both-sidesing the war right now.

I place absolutely no blame on the Ukrainians. This is their land that is being raped. I do not support Russian position and if anything, I have called for a no fly zone over Ukraine.

Your friend feels existentially threatened. Are you willing to join her, put it all on the line?

Just curious: how would a Russian-American join a Ukrainian and “put it all on the line”?

Enlist and go fight for Ukraine and kill Russian soldiers, what else? Maybe give everything you own and sell a kidney to donate it all to Ukrainian refugees, maybe wear a hair shirt the color of Ukrainian flag under your clothes? What else can appease angry trolls here? I am running out of imagination.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

I missed nothing, I’m so sorry you and your false gotchas keep getting you nowhere. Oh well.

You did, though. Oh well.

Nope. No one can read your mind - naturally, no one has the interest - to decode what you deem most important about a quote. For me, the focus is on what different nations can do to stem the killings and Putin’s continued reign. For you, what matters is screeching in multiple threads about the innocence of Russians. I hope you find some comfort as it becomes ever more clear that most people you’re trying to engage with here won’t see things your way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

I missed nothing, I’m so sorry you and your false gotchas keep getting you nowhere. Oh well.

You did, though. Oh well.

Nope. No one can read your mind - naturally, no one has the interest - to decode what you deem most important about a quote. For me, the focus is on what different nations can do to stem the killings and Putin’s continued reign. For you, what matters is screeching in multiple threads about the innocence of Russians. I hope you find some comfort as it becomes ever more clear that most people you’re trying to engage with here won’t see things your way.

Yeah, you totally missed the nuance of that tweet thread. He was talking about the delicate balance between what external states can do (not nations — states), but where external influence inevitably falls short. He then talks about the myriad factors underpinning the long history of authoritarianism in Russia and how change must come from within, but that does not mean Russians are at fault for their reality.

It’s an excellent thread. It’s sad you didn’t understand it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would this xenophobia be acceptable if China invaded Taiwan? A lot of WASPs around here seem to relish the opportunity to discriminate against non Aryan looking white people. I guess since it’s not socially acceptable to be bigoted against Blacks, Asians and Hispanics they need a healthy release valve for all their pent up bigotry and are taking it out on Slavs.

It’s mostly Ukrainians who are xenophobic towards Russians. An average WASP won’t be able to tell one from the other

Seriously. All these sanctimonious virtue signalers on here couldn’t really tell the difference between Russia and Ukraine.

Ukraine is being brutalized into submission with missiles, bombs, tanks, bullets, fires, starvation, etc. Russia is not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would this xenophobia be acceptable if China invaded Taiwan? A lot of WASPs around here seem to relish the opportunity to discriminate against non Aryan looking white people. I guess since it’s not socially acceptable to be bigoted against Blacks, Asians and Hispanics they need a healthy release valve for all their pent up bigotry and are taking it out on Slavs.

It’s mostly Ukrainians who are xenophobic towards Russians. An average WASP won’t be able to tell one from the other

Seriously. All these sanctimonious virtue signalers on here couldn’t really tell the difference between Russia and Ukraine.

Ukraine is being brutalized into submission with missiles, bombs, tanks, bullets, fires, starvation, etc. Russia is not.

Thanks, Captain Obvious. Do you know any other differences or—as I suspect—is 100% of your knowledge about these countries from the past 2 months?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:and she is no longer talking to me. I am anti-Putin, I support humanitarian efforts. She was my friend for 20 years and now she blocked me, told her children not talk to mine. What can I do? What should I do? I am devastated and so are my children.

Are you an American citizen? If you and your friend knows it and still refuses to understand how are NOT a Russian citizen in any way accountable or needing to atone for what's happening, then just let it go. Give her space. It will be ugly for you for a while until people learn that this is just another variety of "woke white guilt" that is going to extremes and needs to end. In the meanwhile, you must know that majority of Americans will have no clue if you are Russian or Ukrainian and never will tell the difference. The good thing, you don't owe anyone any explanation and nobody will be pressing you to disclose your ethnic origin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This was sobering. And it’s why the posters who argue that Russians can’t do anything are being treated with appropriate disdain. The EU, NATO, US can sanction, and should per this man’s suggestion enact criminal penalties for those who do business with Russia as it has operated. But changing over the mentality and ultimately the government is an internal change.

So you ignored this part of it: “ It's not Russians' "fault", there are too many factors, but to fix this means a process of national breakdown, regrouping, redemption and re-education for, well, 80 years. It can only be done by the Russians themselves and the best thing we can do is not get in there to tell them how. Because we don't know better.:

“It can only be done by Russians themselves.” I agree and have never prescribed what they should do, just that THEY should do it. It bothers you - good. I’m very glad.

You missed the part, though, when he said that it isn’t their fault. You and others have been excoriating Russians for not revolting against Putin, acting as though it is evidence of some massive evil inside them.

I missed nothing, I’m so sorry you and your false gotchas keep getting you nowhere. Oh well.

You did, though. Oh well.

Nope. No one can read your mind - naturally, no one has the interest - to decode what you deem most important about a quote. For me, the focus is on what different nations can do to stem the killings and Putin’s continued reign. For you, what matters is screeching in multiple threads about the innocence of Russians. I hope you find some comfort as it becomes ever more clear that most people you’re trying to engage with here won’t see things your way.

Yeah, you totally missed the nuance of that tweet thread. He was talking about the delicate balance between what external states can do (not nations — states), but where external influence inevitably falls short. He then talks about the myriad factors underpinning the long history of authoritarianism in Russia and how change must come from within, but that does not mean Russians are at fault for their reality.

It’s an excellent thread. It’s sad you didn’t understand it.

I really enjoy your self-satisfied use of myriad, it’s very second-string in her APs at BCC of you. I also truly love your careful exegesis of a completely transparent twitter thread. So useful. You’re a pissy little nothing because I discussed the fundamental conclusion and it hurts that it doesn’t shore up your campaign to shame people resolute in noting that regime change will come from within there, no more and no less. Try again.