US has no good options in Ukraine

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

It's not an argument. PP was pointing out that our aid to Ukraine is famous -- as is Zelensky.

Anyone who is unaware that we supply a lot of military aid to Ukraine has been in a coma for ... many years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Putin is no idiot. If he wanted Ukraine by force, he would have done so by now. This is a shit test of the West of what are you going to do about it?

The only reaction is to show him who we are and what we are prepared to do with all our collective might.

😂 Putin's a complete imbecile. Every choice he's made has been absolutely disastrous. The problem now is that he's a mortally wounded cornered rat. The Russian people are the only ones that can end this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is what is puzzling to me. As comforting as it is to believe Putin is just some bumbling idiot who miscalculated something just doesn't add up here and no I don't just buy the explanation he's power mad and wants to revive the USSR. There's more going on than we're being told now.

Here is a line of reasoning that could potentially have led Putin to invade Ukraine:

1. Ukraine continues to drift towards the West
2. It is plausible that Ukraine might join NATO at some point in the future
3. With each passing year, Ukraine's military is increasing in power
4. Even if Putin could extract an agreement from the West that Ukraine will never join NATO, Putin may believe that such an agreement would be worthless: the West can't be trusted, in Putin's view
5. If the West helps Ukraine build its defenses, those defenses might also have offensive capabilities aimed at Russia

Given this information, Putin might conclude that invading Ukraine now is the only option for pushing back on NATO. If Putin waits any longer, and Ukraine grows in military power, Putin's window of opportunity might close.

The flaw in your argument is that if the Ukraine is part of Russia, Putin will have NATO countries on his doorstep. A neutral Ukraine was a better buffer. However, I am sure Putin doesn't want NATO to expand regardless of which country, Ukraine, Finland, etc. One way to ensure that doesn't happen is to take the countries by force.

Or, he can choose option B, which is not to be so much of a threat in the first place that creates a need for NATO.

Yeah, but which came first, the chicken or the egg? Was it Putin's actions that created the need to expand NATO, or was it the push for NATO expansion that amplified Russia's fears of the West?

Ah yes. The timeless, "I'M jUsT AsKinG QueSTIonS."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

Trump didn't send them. It took an act of Congress to override Turmp's blackmail. This didn't happen that long ago. The ones that had been sent previously had strong attached - they had to remain in the western part of the country, away from the Russian border. Kinda defeats the purpose, no?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

DP. Trump was impeached for withholding lethal defense weapons from Ukraine.

Duh.

[Anonymous]

Paul Manafort, Trump's campaign manager, also worked for Viktor Yanukovych -- Putin's stooge in Ukraine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

DP. Trump was impeached for withholding lethal defense weapons from Ukraine.

Duh.

Do some research. They got the weapons. All of them.

Of course they did. In spite of Trump, not because of him. There is a PP who is saying that Trump is responsible for giving defense weapons to Ukraine. When actually Trump tried to prevent the defense weapons from going there, tried to use them as leverage against Zelensky - yes that Zelensky.

We all saw this happen. It wasn't that long ago. Unless some posters are 2 years old?

Yes he leveraged. No one denies. Obama sent blankets- yes or no?

Why is defending Trump so important to you?

Telling the truth is not defending. There was a misinformation campaign that Trump withheld weapons from a Ukraine and that they have no weapons. That is not true. Trump sent (maybe delayed) more weapons than any US President including your hero Obama. Those are the facts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

DP. Trump was impeached for withholding lethal defense weapons from Ukraine.

Duh.

Do some research. They got the weapons. All of them.

Of course they did. In spite of Trump, not because of him. There is a PP who is saying that Trump is responsible for giving defense weapons to Ukraine. When actually Trump tried to prevent the defense weapons from going there, tried to use them as leverage against Zelensky - yes that Zelensky.

We all saw this happen. It wasn't that long ago. Unless some posters are 2 years old?

Yes he leveraged. No one denies. Obama sent blankets- yes or no?

Why is defending Trump so important to you?

Telling the truth is not defending. There was a misinformation campaign that Trump withheld weapons from a Ukraine and that they have no weapons. That is not true. Trump sent (maybe delayed) more weapons than any US President including your hero Obama. Those are the facts.

Sorry, dear. You are the one who is trying to spread misinformation.

Trump didn't send defense weapons to Ukraine, Congress did.

The US. Our country. We did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

DP. Trump was impeached for withholding lethal defense weapons from Ukraine.

Duh.

Do some research. They got the weapons. All of them.

Of course they did. In spite of Trump, not because of him. There is a PP who is saying that Trump is responsible for giving defense weapons to Ukraine. When actually Trump tried to prevent the defense weapons from going there, tried to use them as leverage against Zelensky - yes that Zelensky.

We all saw this happen. It wasn't that long ago. Unless some posters are 2 years old?

Yes he leveraged. No one denies. Obama sent blankets- yes or no?

Why is defending Trump so important to you?

Telling the truth is not defending. There was a misinformation campaign that Trump withheld weapons from a Ukraine and that they have no weapons. That is not true. Trump sent (maybe delayed) more weapons than any US President including your hero Obama. Those are the facts.

Sorry, dear. You are the one who is trying to spread misinformation.

Trump didn't send defense weapons to Ukraine, Congress did.

The US. Our country. We did.

Dear,
Did Congress send any weapons under Obama? I’ll wait.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No fly zone. NATO. Now. Before Russia declares victory. We’re just peace keeping as they are.

This. 100%.

Wrong. There’s no way American planes will be shooting down Russian jets. That really could start an American Russian war. We could arm Ukraine with stinger missiles so Russian planes will have to fly higher but we’re not starting a shooting war with Russia.

Dp- exactly. We can’t enforce a no fly zone.

That’s true. But the US military knew this was coming. Shouldn’t we have armed them better a while ago?

What are you talking about? We’ve been sending weapons and military equipment to Ukraine for years

+1 Quite famously in recent years.

This argument is so tired and made by people who have nothing else to offer. Explain to me how what Trump
did resulted in where we are today. Ukraine got more lethal weapons under Trump than Obama. What did Obama do to bring peace to the region?

“But first I need to ask for a favor”.

Obama sent Ukraine MREs and blankets.
Trump sent lethal weapons.

DP. I am far from an expert on this, but isn't it Congress who approved sending weapons to Ukraine? Like Trump had no say in the decision and his role was to simply make sure it was done. But then he tried to withhold them to extract a personal favor from Zelensky. Isn't that right? I don't understand how Trump would get credit for anything other than finally doing what Congress authorized in the first place, after getting caught trying not to do it.

What did Obama do?

Are you going to answer my question?

Who cares? Trump sent lethal weapons. Obama sent blankets. Send proof otherwise.

DP. Trump was impeached for withholding lethal defense weapons from Ukraine.

Duh.

Do some research. They got the weapons. All of them.

Of course they did. In spite of Trump, not because of him. There is a PP who is saying that Trump is responsible for giving defense weapons to Ukraine. When actually Trump tried to prevent the defense weapons from going there, tried to use them as leverage against Zelensky - yes that Zelensky.

We all saw this happen. It wasn't that long ago. Unless some posters are 2 years old?

Yes he leveraged. No one denies. Obama sent blankets- yes or no?

Why is defending Trump so important to you?

Telling the truth is not defending. There was a misinformation campaign that Trump withheld weapons from a Ukraine and that they have no weapons. That is not true. Trump sent (maybe delayed) more weapons than any US President including your hero Obama. Those are the facts.

Is is ok for a president to delay the transfer of weapons that were authorized by Congress?