Do you consider redshirting cheating?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm talking about public schools. Yes, a wealth disparity exists, yes its growing. Lets not pretend that we can wipe it out of existence by foregoing piano en masse, but we do have a different consideration when it comes to public education. A "rule" that only/mostly benefits the children who need it least, in public education, is a bad rule, IMO. I'm not attaching any morality to anyones decision, but to the concept as a whole.

Some school districts have a 1-2 month window on either side of the cutoff date that are allowed without exceptions and otherwise the school needs to agree to the exception. Is this a rule that you're looking for? It already exists in some districts.

That would solve a lot of the abuse!

Then advocate for it. Our school board has a meeting just about every week. Show up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm talking about public schools. Yes, a wealth disparity exists, yes its growing. Lets not pretend that we can wipe it out of existence by foregoing piano en masse, but we do have a different consideration when it comes to public education. A "rule" that only/mostly benefits the children who need it least, in public education, is a bad rule, IMO. I'm not attaching any morality to anyones decision, but to the concept as a whole.

Some school districts have a 1-2 month window on either side of the cutoff date that are allowed without exceptions and otherwise the school needs to agree to the exception. Is this a rule that you're looking for? It already exists in some districts.

That would solve a lot of the abuse!

Then advocate for it. Our school board has a meeting just about every week. Show up.

I have and will continue to do so!

[Anonymous]

OP, your question is very ambiguous. In your case, I would consider it cheating, since most district allow kids to go to Kindergarten as long as they turn 5 before October, as is the case with your son. However, in some districts, kids with October, November, and December birthdays are allowed to enter Kindergarten at 4. If their parents choose to redshirt them, I would not consider it cheating since in most districts, they would have to wait a year anyways.

[Anonymous]

To the PP who mentioned Malcolm Gladwell: I'm sorry, but Gladwell's logic is extremely flawed. He says that most professional hockey players have birthdays earlier in the year because they're older, except they're not. In grade school, his argument makes more sense, because all the kids on a given hockey were born in the same year, so the kids were birthdays earlier in the year are going to be older default. However, when you get into the adult, you're no longer just competing against people born in the same year as you. I can't find the study, but while most of the ice hockey players mentioned have early birthdays, they're all born in different years, which tells me that it's really just a coincidence. Let's say that the age span of adults trying out for a professional ice hockey team are those born between 1990 and 1996. By Gladwell's argument that age is an advantage, the players born in 1990, 1991, and 1992, would mainly be the ones to make the team, regardless of what month they were born. However, by Gladwell's logic, a player born in January of 1996 has an unfair advantage over a player born in December of 1990, which makes no sense, as the December-born players is over 5 years older than the January-born player

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:When your child is that close to the line, they will fit in with either cohort.

There are days when I wish we had fought to send our October kid early (born to be oldest, considered making him youngest); on balance, it was the right decision to go on time.

Considering OP's child and mine are days on either side of the cut off, it's the same thing on the opposite end (OP's kid is born to be youngest, they are considering making him oldest), and the point is that the child will fit in with either cohort -- do what feels right for your child and your family.

Truth! Most kids who are redshirted will just be days behind other students. Are these Oct. students dumb, bored and disruptive (as anti redshirts have claimed on this thread)? No. We have an Oct. child and a Sept. child. It just seemed unnecessary to send the Sept. kid early. And based on our experience with our OCt. kid it definitely seemed like pushing ahead, not delaying. A few posters on here commented about a wasted year, but my kids learned SO much socially and emotionally in that year that transferred to elementary. It REALLY prepared her. Definitely NOT a waste (or delay) in any sense. It was expensive though, and not for everyone.

Another anti-redshirt comment that always gets me from having an Oct. kid is that the kid will get a false sense of accomplishment. In what reality does age solely corrolate to accomplishment on EVERYTHING?! My kids SUCK at sports, and are with other fall birthdays and spring kids too, as the older ones. They are usually just average if not below. Just not natural for them, But they work hard at it. Imagine if they were with kids a full year ahead, they would probably give up in frustration because the goal would be so unattainable. It could be like that for a younger child in school (or any aged child that struggles).



I'm sure she really did learn a lot in that year. I mean, if she didn't learn something in what is about 20% of her life experience, that would be so weird, don't you think? You just don't know what she could have learned in the more challenging grade. Maybe more!

How can you say it was not a delay? They will graduate from HS and college a year later than they would have. Thats a delay, right?

Because the deadline is totally random! So is my Oct. kid delayed?? Are September kids in 40+ states delayed? Are all fall birthday kids delayed because the deadline was December until 10 years ago? No. And delayed from what? To start work? How about if they take a gap year, or if that young kid ended up being retained. You have NO idea what will happen in the future.

Delayed from beginning school. Gap year etc in no way related. You delay them from entering school for a year. I have no idea about anything related to your October child. If they were legally of age to go to school and you delayed them a year yes, they were delayed. If they went when eligible their education was not delayed. This isn’t meant to be a judgment.


The more I say delay the less it seems to mean

You missed my point. I get what the definition of a delay is. What I’m saying is that it’s insignificant because it’s literally a couple days. I understand she would have been a year younger in school if I sent her to K at 4, but I didn’t want to do that. It felt more like pushing her ahead than holding her behind. Maybe it would have felt less so if everyone had the same cut off, but that’s not the case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, your question is very ambiguous. In your case, I would consider it cheating, since most district allow kids to go to Kindergarten as long as they turn 5 before October, as is the case with your son. However, in some districts, kids with October, November, and December birthdays are allowed to enter Kindergarten at 4. If their parents choose to redshirt them, I would not consider it cheating since in most districts, they would have to wait a year anyways.

This is totally false. Most states have a 9/1 cut off. Only NYC and Connecticut have December cut offs, but even that is changing. Many have Aug. 15th and a few have even earlier.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The hypocrisy... for all the people that consider redshirting cheating, you better never spend a dime towards your kids other than the bare minimum that everyone in the country can afford

Hit a nerve eh?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm talking about public schools. Yes, a wealth disparity exists, yes its growing. Lets not pretend that we can wipe it out of existence by foregoing piano en masse, but we do have a different consideration when it comes to public education. A "rule" that only/mostly benefits the children who need it least, in public education, is a bad rule, IMO. I'm not attaching any morality to anyones decision, but to the concept as a whole.

So you're totally cool with redshirting in private schools then?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The hypocrisy... for all the people that consider redshirting cheating, you better never spend a dime towards your kids other than the bare minimum that everyone in the country can afford

Hit a nerve eh?

It's accurate, though. Anti-redshirt posters on DCUM are nearly all gigantic hypocrites. Sorry if that bothers you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:My first grader has asked me why some kids in his class turn 7 at the same time as the kids in the older grade. What am I supposed to tell him? His mom thinks he’s shy?

The other kids are noticing.

I've actually noticed the opposite. My kids (4th and 5th grade) and their friends look up to the older (redshirted) kids. They wish they were the oldest kids.

My younger kid asks if they are dumb (not using those words). He thinks they aren't as smart and doesn't look up to them.

You need to teach your child some manners. Work on that.

My child has great manners but reality is something is off if kids are held back a year, especially when they are summer birthday kids.

Not necessarily PP. My son is among the oldest in his class and it gives him an advantage over being the youngest. Call redshirting cheating or whatever you want. I could care less. As all parents do in some shape and form, I do what is best for my children so that they can have as pleasant and successful experiences as possible. It is called parenting.

What advantage is that? My son is the youngest (not among, the absolute youngest) and I don't see the advantage. We held him back in K and it was bad. He wasn't challenged at school and he was acting younger playing with younger kids. You are making a false "maturity" as your kid isn't any more mature but just appears that way among younger kids. We found our kid acted older and was more independent wanting to keep up with the older kids vs. being the oldest/example. If your child is smart, they will be fine no matter what you do. If your kid isn't the brightest, holding back isn't going to help and they will struggle without the right supports in place. You just want things to come easy. That is fine but life isn't easy and most people have a lifetime of struggles.

PP here. Was not referring in the least about real or perceived maturity. It is the child's confidence that makes huge differences in how they perceive themselves and their place in the classroom. Having my child among the oldest in the class may help in his overall confidence as a student. More than intelligence, confidence and motivation is what makes the difference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My first grader has asked me why some kids in his class turn 7 at the same time as the kids in the older grade. What am I supposed to tell him? His mom thinks he’s shy?

The other kids are noticing.

I've actually noticed the opposite. My kids (4th and 5th grade) and their friends look up to the older (redshirted) kids. They wish they were the oldest kids.

My younger kid asks if they are dumb (not using those words). He thinks they aren't as smart and doesn't look up to them.

You need to teach your child some manners. Work on that.

My child has great manners but reality is something is off if kids are held back a year, especially when they are summer birthday kids.

Not necessarily PP. My son is among the oldest in his class and it gives him an advantage over being the youngest. Call redshirting cheating or whatever you want. I could care less. As all parents do in some shape and form, I do what is best for my children so that they can have as pleasant and successful experiences as possible. It is called parenting.

What advantage is that? My son is the youngest (not among, the absolute youngest) and I don't see the advantage. We held him back in K and it was bad. He wasn't challenged at school and he was acting younger playing with younger kids. You are making a false "maturity" as your kid isn't any more mature but just appears that way among younger kids. We found our kid acted older and was more independent wanting to keep up with the older kids vs. being the oldest/example. If your child is smart, they will be fine no matter what you do. If your kid isn't the brightest, holding back isn't going to help and they will struggle without the right supports in place. You just want things to come easy. That is fine but life isn't easy and most people have a lifetime of struggles.

PP here. Was not referring in the least about real or perceived maturity. It is the child's confidence that makes huge differences in how they perceive themselves and their place in the classroom. Having my child among the oldest in the class may help in his overall confidence as a student. More than intelligence, confidence and motivation is what makes the difference.

Bingo! I am a teacher and 100% agree with this. Anti-redshirt people will say it’s false confidence, but It’s mor about the fact that they are developmentally ready for the material beging a little older.

[Anonymous]

An average of 27% of my town’s kindergarteners were redshirted. (I’m in the northeast).

Yes, I think it’s cheating

[Anonymous]

This thread seems to be focusing on kids who are a few days (or at least under a month) from the cutoff. Isn’t that much different than being ahead as a June or April birthday?

[Anonymous]

I get really confident when I play tennis against children, too.

Who cares if I have to play children to feel confident, all that matters are my feeeeellllllinnnnngs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I get really confident when I play tennis against children, too.

Who cares if I have to play children to feel confident, all that matters are my feeeeellllllinnnnngs.

I would completely rule in 1st grade!