Discipline for excessive crying

[Anonymous]

Have you been a to developmental pediatrician to have her evaluated?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.

This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.

I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”

I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD

And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?

This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.

I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.

Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.

You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.

I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?

Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.

Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.

You’ve never dealt with SN I see

But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?

It’s very common for SN kids to be able to hold it together with people they know will judge them and like them less because of their disregulation, and then stop working so hard to regulate when they are with their “safe” person who understands them and loves them no matter what.

However, OP has made multiple mentions of other people being unable to deal with her child. The night nurse quit, the babysitter agreed she was the highest needs baby she’d ever dealt with, then OP felt she had to become a SAHM because of her child’s high needs, so obviously the child isn’t “typical” with everyone else; she’s just the most extreme with her own mother.

I have a SN child who is old enough to articulate that I’m the only person who understands her, is almost always kind to her, likes her, and she knows I’ll love her unconditionally. She’s sad that no one else seems to truly like her. So guess who is the only person in the whole world she “gets real” with? At times, when she was younger, it genuinely felt like I was trapped in an abusive relationship that I couldn’t leave. Time and the accompanying maturity it brings, medication and therapy have made things so much better. My child’s divergent behavior has been witnessed by many people, but I’m the only person who’s been there for 98% of it and I take the brunt of it.

[Anonymous]

I do hope the OP will come back. I think there have been some good ideas and perspectives mixed in with the less-helpful comments.

One of my kids at 2-3 wasn’t continually upset like OP’s, but they were HIGHLY interactive and never content to do their own thing. They wanted my full attention and participation whenever I didn’t have another obvious task in front of me. When I had reached my limit, I would say “Mommy is going to rest her ears for a bit. You can keep talking to me, but I won’t be able to answer because I’m turning off my ears until the timer is done.”

And then I’d set the timer for 20 minutes and sit with my eyes closed while they kept chattering — but without any expectation that I would respond or engage. Total sanity saver.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don’t think “punish” is the right word but I would lean hard into the “ignore” and stay firm about it, even if she’s making herself vomit.

“Mommy cannot help you when you are so upset. You need to calm down.” Rinse and repeat. Maybe create a “calm down space” with stuffed animals but no human interaction where she can (needs) to go when she’s upset - essentially a time out for excessive crying.

And give lots of positive attention when she is calm. Crying = loses attention. Calm = gets attention. Model how to appropriately express emotions. Point isn’t she can’t express emotions - she just needs to do so in appropriate ways.

+1

OP here, I think this is a great response. Any advice on how I can keep myself calm to listen to what will probably be hours and hours of crying in her time out space? She’s spent her whole life crying and it raises my blood pressure and makes me panic because my experience is it never ends, so I really struggle to stay neutral and calm.

I think she picks up on that and panics herself. Focusing on your own emotional regulation could benefit you both - yoga, meditation, accepting feelings as they come and go, etc. I had a child like this and it really pushed my buttons, trying to focus on her accomplished little. When I built up my own regulation and tolerance and framed it as being a safe container for her to express her feelings, keeping her sense of attachment secure, it started to help. It is super hard but you both may be easily dysregulated.

This. You may want to also say when you need a minute “mommy is going to step out of the room (if you are in her bedroom for instance) and take a few breaths so she can calm her body down”. I would recommend reading “Good Inside” and focusing on a chapter at the end of the book about kids who have big emotions (the author has some acronym to describe these kids but of course I forget it). As PP wrote, you want her to learn that all emotions are safe to express. You are human and showing her how you calm down can be instructive. I’m sorry, OP. I find crying very disregulating. If my kids are crying or yelling when I’m driving I sometimes try to explain it’s very distracting for me. Other times I ignore the behavior after trying to reason with them - and turn on music they like as a diversion. And sometimes if they are tired and I know the screaming or crying won’t get better (my kids really meltdown if they are tired) I just turn on NPR or a podcast so I can listen to something I like during the yelling.

[Anonymous]

I know you said that medical testing had yielded no results, but my friend’s daughter was like this as a toddler and it turns out she has celiacs.

[Anonymous]

Op, since your child understands you fully, do you try to give her a 1-2-3 heads up?
Like, we are going to the car in 3 minutes, leaving in two minutes okay? you ready in 1 minute?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You feel even more stressed because you’re doing this all day every day by being a stay at home mom, for dubious reasons at this point. You claim she is good for everyone else, then put her in a daycare. Maybe she will be happier around other kids her age as well. If she’s crying all day at home, I think it’s logical to let her go to daycare especially when you already established that she is well-behaved as long as she is not around you. It’s one thing if she gets kicked out of daycares and you had no choice but to stay home with her. But that is not the case here so I am perplexed as to why you keep on doing it. It also doesn’t sound like you’re financially struggling, so this whole thing is self inflicted.

Why continue to let her stay at home all day with you when she’s obviously not happy because she’s crying all day?

I have a kid who was a very very difficult infant. The type who cried all day and needed to be held all day and all night. I also quit my job to stay home with him. Even as he got older, he always needed my attention at all times. When he was around 18 months old I’ve had it, and decided I had to try daycare. I had avoided it for a long time because I was afraid he would get kicked out. Turns out he loved daycare. Never threw a tantrum there. I am told that he is among the most well-behaved child in his classes. He is much better now that he’s older.

I think you should give it a try. It’s unclear why you kept on staying at home with your child when you have admitted that she has a lot of behavior issues when she’s with you, and not with anyone else. That just doesn’t make any sense.

We have applied for preschool for next fall. She is going a year early. I’m not sure if you’ve dealt with severe, severe sleep deprivation, but I was too stupid for a long time to figure this all out. I came to the same realization a few months ago but it was too late to line up school for this fall. I’m looking for strategies to cope until next August.

Start looking for short term daycare openings. If those are absolutely not available at all where you live, then I suggest doing a lot of mommy and me classes, outings, etc. Be outside of the house around other people. You stated in a prior post that she’s fine when you’re doing your outings and socializes well with other people - and the opening post describes issues that happen only when you’re alone with her. If you must be in the house for whatever reason, hire a sitter to show up and help out since she doesn’t act like that in front of the sitter. To help you get a break and prevent behavior issues until dad gets home. When dad comes home from work he should take on the primary role in dealing with her because she doesn’t act like that in front of him. Even if it means he does less chores in the household. Spend money to outsource anything you can so you don’t have to do everything, and he can focus on taking care of her. On the weekends, sign her up for more classes. At home, dad will need to continue taking on the primary role of taking care of her. Always make sure that dad is present in the car or at home. If he needs a break and cannot be present, get a sitter. Time to spend money to save your sanity.

[Anonymous]

Please get her checked for autism.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You feel even more stressed because you’re doing this all day every day by being a stay at home mom, for dubious reasons at this point. You claim she is good for everyone else, then put her in a daycare. Maybe she will be happier around other kids her age as well. If she’s crying all day at home, I think it’s logical to let her go to daycare especially when you already established that she is well-behaved as long as she is not around you. It’s one thing if she gets kicked out of daycares and you had no choice but to stay home with her. But that is not the case here so I am perplexed as to why you keep on doing it. It also doesn’t sound like you’re financially struggling, so this whole thing is self inflicted.

Why continue to let her stay at home all day with you when she’s obviously not happy because she’s crying all day?

I have a kid who was a very very difficult infant. The type who cried all day and needed to be held all day and all night. I also quit my job to stay home with him. Even as he got older, he always needed my attention at all times. When he was around 18 months old I’ve had it, and decided I had to try daycare. I had avoided it for a long time because I was afraid he would get kicked out. Turns out he loved daycare. Never threw a tantrum there. I am told that he is among the most well-behaved child in his classes. He is much better now that he’s older.

I think you should give it a try. It’s unclear why you kept on staying at home with your child when you have admitted that she has a lot of behavior issues when she’s with you, and not with anyone else. That just doesn’t make any sense.

We have applied for preschool for next fall. She is going a year early. I’m not sure if you’ve dealt with severe, severe sleep deprivation, but I was too stupid for a long time to figure this all out. I came to the same realization a few months ago but it was too late to line up school for this fall. I’m looking for strategies to cope until next August.

Start looking for short term daycare openings. If those are absolutely not available at all where you live, then I suggest doing a lot of mommy and me classes, outings, etc. Be outside of the house around other people. You stated in a prior post that she’s fine when you’re doing your outings and socializes well with other people - and the opening post describes issues that happen only when you’re alone with her. If you must be in the house for whatever reason, hire a sitter to show up and help out since she doesn’t act like that in front of the sitter. To help you get a break and prevent behavior issues until dad gets home. When dad comes home from work he should take on the primary role in dealing with her because she doesn’t act like that in front of him. Even if it means he does less chores in the household. Spend money to outsource anything you can so you don’t have to do everything, and he can focus on taking care of her. On the weekends, sign her up for more classes. At home, dad will need to continue taking on the primary role of taking care of her. Always make sure that dad is present in the car or at home. If he needs a break and cannot be present, get a sitter. Time to spend money to save your sanity.

Dad can’t even do bedtime or OP won’t push for it. She’s not going to do something like the above.

[Anonymous]

I had a baby like this - she is 9 now and we got through it. She is not special needs but very sensitive and still to this day needs tons of hugs and emotional connections, it is just her nature. I don’t know what it is, it is just her personality and my other kid is not like this at all. We did not sleep through the night until she was FOUR. (Yes I did move to stay at home for this reason and it was exhausting) She would not “cry it out” - which worked with my first and which everyone relentlesslyadvised. But I could tell she was truly frightened and would literally crap her pants when she was in a state of stress. I just listened to my gut and gave her hugs when she got super anxious and it went on and ok til she was four and then -boom- she learned to sleep. She still gets super anxious and sensitive now and then when trying to cope with stress and she probably has anxiety but it gets easier as she matures and builds self confidence. People do not get it when I say I woke up 2-3 times a night for four years and I can see how not everyone would handle it the way I did but it worked out for us.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:You feel even more stressed because you’re doing this all day every day by being a stay at home mom, for dubious reasons at this point. You claim she is good for everyone else, then put her in a daycare. Maybe she will be happier around other kids her age as well. If she’s crying all day at home, I think it’s logical to let her go to daycare especially when you already established that she is well-behaved as long as she is not around you. It’s one thing if she gets kicked out of daycares and you had no choice but to stay home with her. But that is not the case here so I am perplexed as to why you keep on doing it. It also doesn’t sound like you’re financially struggling, so this whole thing is self inflicted.

Why continue to let her stay at home all day with you when she’s obviously not happy because she’s crying all day?

I have a kid who was a very very difficult infant. The type who cried all day and needed to be held all day and all night. I also quit my job to stay home with him. Even as he got older, he always needed my attention at all times. When he was around 18 months old I’ve had it, and decided I had to try daycare. I had avoided it for a long time because I was afraid he would get kicked out. Turns out he loved daycare. Never threw a tantrum there. I am told that he is among the most well-behaved child in his classes. He is much better now that he’s older.

I think you should give it a try. It’s unclear why you kept on staying at home with your child when you have admitted that she has a lot of behavior issues when she’s with you, and not with anyone else. That just doesn’t make any sense.

We have applied for preschool for next fall. She is going a year early. I’m not sure if you’ve dealt with severe, severe sleep deprivation, but I was too stupid for a long time to figure this all out. I came to the same realization a few months ago but it was too late to line up school for this fall. I’m looking for strategies to cope until next August.

Start looking for short term daycare openings. If those are absolutely not available at all where you live, then I suggest doing a lot of mommy and me classes, outings, etc. Be outside of the house around other people. You stated in a prior post that she’s fine when you’re doing your outings and socializes well with other people - and the opening post describes issues that happen only when you’re alone with her. If you must be in the house for whatever reason, hire a sitter to show up and help out since she doesn’t act like that in front of the sitter. To help you get a break and prevent behavior issues until dad gets home. When dad comes home from work he should take on the primary role in dealing with her because she doesn’t act like that in front of him. Even if it means he does less chores in the household. Spend money to outsource anything you can so you don’t have to do everything, and he can focus on taking care of her. On the weekends, sign her up for more classes. At home, dad will need to continue taking on the primary role of taking care of her. Always make sure that dad is present in the car or at home. If he needs a break and cannot be present, get a sitter. Time to spend money to save your sanity.

Daycare from now until the preschool starts

None of these other classes etc (which are "mommy and me" at that age) are a substitute for the rules, needing to wait to get attention, sharing with others etc that comes from daycare/preschool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You feel even more stressed because you’re doing this all day every day by being a stay at home mom, for dubious reasons at this point. You claim she is good for everyone else, then put her in a daycare. Maybe she will be happier around other kids her age as well. If she’s crying all day at home, I think it’s logical to let her go to daycare especially when you already established that she is well-behaved as long as she is not around you. It’s one thing if she gets kicked out of daycares and you had no choice but to stay home with her. But that is not the case here so I am perplexed as to why you keep on doing it. It also doesn’t sound like you’re financially struggling, so this whole thing is self inflicted.

Why continue to let her stay at home all day with you when she’s obviously not happy because she’s crying all day?

I have a kid who was a very very difficult infant. The type who cried all day and needed to be held all day and all night. I also quit my job to stay home with him. Even as he got older, he always needed my attention at all times. When he was around 18 months old I’ve had it, and decided I had to try daycare. I had avoided it for a long time because I was afraid he would get kicked out. Turns out he loved daycare. Never threw a tantrum there. I am told that he is among the most well-behaved child in his classes. He is much better now that he’s older.

I think you should give it a try. It’s unclear why you kept on staying at home with your child when you have admitted that she has a lot of behavior issues when she’s with you, and not with anyone else. That just doesn’t make any sense.

We have applied for preschool for next fall. She is going a year early. I’m not sure if you’ve dealt with severe, severe sleep deprivation, but I was too stupid for a long time to figure this all out. I came to the same realization a few months ago but it was too late to line up school for this fall. I’m looking for strategies to cope until next August.

Start looking for short term daycare openings. If those are absolutely not available at all where you live, then I suggest doing a lot of mommy and me classes, outings, etc. Be outside of the house around other people. You stated in a prior post that she’s fine when you’re doing your outings and socializes well with other people - and the opening post describes issues that happen only when you’re alone with her. If you must be in the house for whatever reason, hire a sitter to show up and help out since she doesn’t act like that in front of the sitter. To help you get a break and prevent behavior issues until dad gets home. When dad comes home from work he should take on the primary role in dealing with her because she doesn’t act like that in front of him. Even if it means he does less chores in the household. Spend money to outsource anything you can so you don’t have to do everything, and he can focus on taking care of her. On the weekends, sign her up for more classes. At home, dad will need to continue taking on the primary role of taking care of her. Always make sure that dad is present in the car or at home. If he needs a break and cannot be present, get a sitter. Time to spend money to save your sanity.

Daycare from now until the preschool starts

None of these other classes etc (which are "mommy and me" at that age) are a substitute for the rules, needing to wait to get attention, sharing with others etc that comes from daycare/preschool.

It’s not supposed to substitute for full childcare. Nothing can substitute for that. It’s to prevent the OP from having to be alone with the child in the house. She can do anything she wants or go anywhere she wants to as long as it is in the presence of other people.

It sounds like the child’s worst behaviors come out when she’s alone with mom. So as long she’s not alone with the child, she can prevent behavior issues.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.

This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.

I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”

I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD

And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?

This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.

I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.

Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.

You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.

I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?

Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.

Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.

You’ve never dealt with SN I see

But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?

It’s very common for SN kids to be able to hold it together with people they know will judge them and like them less because of their disregulation, and then stop working so hard to regulate when they are with their “safe” person who understands them and loves them no matter what.

However, OP has made multiple mentions of other people being unable to deal with her child. The night nurse quit, the babysitter agreed she was the highest needs baby she’d ever dealt with, then OP felt she had to become a SAHM because of her child’s high needs, so obviously the child isn’t “typical” with everyone else; she’s just the most extreme with her own mother.

I have a SN child who is old enough to articulate that I’m the only person who understands her, is almost always kind to her, likes her, and she knows I’ll love her unconditionally. She’s sad that no one else seems to truly like her. So guess who is the only person in the whole world she “gets real” with? At times, when she was younger, it genuinely felt like I was trapped in an abusive relationship that I couldn’t leave. Time and the accompanying maturity it brings, medication and therapy have made things so much better. My child’s divergent behavior has been witnessed by many people, but I’m the only person who’s been there for 98% of it and I take the brunt of it.

This reminds me of the posters who claim that because of some medical condition, their DH can’t manage chores or household responsibilities but can somehow can manage to meet all deadlines and complete all tasks for their high paying job. Riiiiiiiight.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.

This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.

I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”

I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD

And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?

This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.

I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.

Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.

You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.

I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?

Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.

Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.

You’ve never dealt with SN I see

But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?

It’s very common for SN kids to be able to hold it together with people they know will judge them and like them less because of their disregulation, and then stop working so hard to regulate when they are with their “safe” person who understands them and loves them no matter what.

However, OP has made multiple mentions of other people being unable to deal with her child. The night nurse quit, the babysitter agreed she was the highest needs baby she’d ever dealt with, then OP felt she had to become a SAHM because of her child’s high needs, so obviously the child isn’t “typical” with everyone else; she’s just the most extreme with her own mother.

I have a SN child who is old enough to articulate that I’m the only person who understands her, is almost always kind to her, likes her, and she knows I’ll love her unconditionally. She’s sad that no one else seems to truly like her. So guess who is the only person in the whole world she “gets real” with? At times, when she was younger, it genuinely felt like I was trapped in an abusive relationship that I couldn’t leave. Time and the accompanying maturity it brings, medication and therapy have made things so much better. My child’s divergent behavior has been witnessed by many people, but I’m the only person who’s been there for 98% of it and I take the brunt of it.

This reminds me of the posters who claim that because of some medical condition, their DH can’t manage chores or household responsibilities but can somehow can manage to meet all deadlines and complete all tasks for their high paying job. Riiiiiiiight.

Tell me you don’t have a SN kid without telling me …

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.

This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.

I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”

I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD

And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?

This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.

I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.

Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.

You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.

I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?

Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.

Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.

You’ve never dealt with SN I see

But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?

It’s very common for SN kids to be able to hold it together with people they know will judge them and like them less because of their disregulation, and then stop working so hard to regulate when they are with their “safe” person who understands them and loves them no matter what.

However, OP has made multiple mentions of other people being unable to deal with her child. The night nurse quit, the babysitter agreed she was the highest needs baby she’d ever dealt with, then OP felt she had to become a SAHM because of her child’s high needs, so obviously the child isn’t “typical” with everyone else; she’s just the most extreme with her own mother.

I have a SN child who is old enough to articulate that I’m the only person who understands her, is almost always kind to her, likes her, and she knows I’ll love her unconditionally. She’s sad that no one else seems to truly like her. So guess who is the only person in the whole world she “gets real” with? At times, when she was younger, it genuinely felt like I was trapped in an abusive relationship that I couldn’t leave. Time and the accompanying maturity it brings, medication and therapy have made things so much better. My child’s divergent behavior has been witnessed by many people, but I’m the only person who’s been there for 98% of it and I take the brunt of it.

This reminds me of the posters who claim that because of some medical condition, their DH can’t manage chores or household responsibilities but can somehow can manage to meet all deadlines and complete all tasks for their high paying job. Riiiiiiiight.

You shouldn’t embarrass yourself like this.