Discipline for excessive crying

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Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.


This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.


I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”


I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD


And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?


This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.


I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.


Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.


You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.


I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?


Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.


Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.





You’ve never dealt with SN I see


But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?

It’s very common for SN kids to be able to hold it together with people they know will judge them and like them less because of their disregulation, and then stop working so hard to regulate when they are with their “safe” person who understands them and loves them no matter what.

However, OP has made multiple mentions of other people being unable to deal with her child. The night nurse quit, the babysitter agreed she was the highest needs baby she’d ever dealt with, then OP felt she had to become a SAHM because of her child’s high needs, so obviously the child isn’t “typical” with everyone else; she’s just the most extreme with her own mother.

I have a SN child who is old enough to articulate that I’m the only person who understands her, is almost always kind to her, likes her, and she knows I’ll love her unconditionally. She’s sad that no one else seems to truly like her. So guess who is the only person in the whole world she “gets real” with? At times, when she was younger, it genuinely felt like I was trapped in an abusive relationship that I couldn’t leave. Time and the accompanying maturity it brings, medication and therapy have made things so much better. My child’s divergent behavior has been witnessed by many people, but I’m the only person who’s been there for 98% of it and I take the brunt of it.


This reminds me of the posters who claim that because of some medical condition, their DH can’t manage chores or household responsibilities but can somehow can manage to meet all deadlines and complete all tasks for their high paying job. Riiiiiiiight.

You don’t know sh!t about ASD or ADHD. People with those diagnoses hyperfocus on things that interest them to the exclusion of everything else. When they’re concentrating, it’s like they have tunnel vision. They can’t think about anything other than whatever they’re working on. But all life’s trivial details and boring minutiae? Those things go in one ear and out the other. So a spouse with ADHD might be a very successful entrepreneur, but can’t remember what it was you wanted them to pick up at the grocery store and they constantly misplace their keys.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:A couple thoughts for you, from someone who has gone through toddler hell and come out the other side.

She will literally cry for hours until and unless you do exactly what she wants or I get so frustrated I distract/redirect her, which only works some of the time.


This makes me wonder how often you change your no to a yes. Or if you can sometimes be worn down to start offering bribes (“Want more snack? Would watching a show help you feel better? If you stop crying, you can go with Mommy to Starbucks and get a hot chocolate.”) Basically, I wonder if what started as legitimate high-needs behavior is getting reinforced and rewarded.

You also mention that she will follow you from room to room, weeping wailing. What happens when she does? Do you interact with her? (“Larla, you need to stop crying. Larla! Take deep breaths. Larla, let’s breathe together. Iiiiin and ouuuuuuut.”) Or do you cheerfully go about your business? (“Mommy is going into the family room to fold this laundry. Hmmm, I wonder where the other blue sock is.”)

My two cents would be to help her name her feelings (“You’re thinking about how good a sandwich would taste right now, and are frustrated that I can’t make one while I’m driving”), but don’t get sucked into the theatricality they generate. Acknowledge them, but don’t try to solve them. (“I like sandwiches too. Wouldn’t it be great if we could push a button in the car and have it make us a sandwich?”)

“How to Talk So Kids Will Listen” is an oldie but a goodie. Consistency is hard, but so important. Above all, don’t negotiate with terrorists. Give her tons of attention when she’s calm, but grey rock when the dramatics start.


I never offer bribes, and I never ever change no to yes. I do sometimes eventually redirect, which I thought I wasn’t supposed to do because you’re supposed to give them a chance to self-regulate.

While she’s crying and following me, I’m usually trying to ignore while occasionally acknowledging and affirming: “You’re so Upset I won’t sit on the floor and hold your bear for you.” Yes. That’s very hard.”


I think it’s totally fine to sit on the floor and hold her bear unless you are busy with something else or too tired/upset. Don’t deny it out of principle.
-pp who first suggested ASD


And that is what I did for about the first 18 months of her life. Her demands have always been utterly relentless. Sit here, hold this, give me this, do this, say this. At first I thought I was nurturing a strong sense of self and her preferences so I thought it was fine. But as time has gone on I feel like it's not healthy to act like her slave all day. To be clear, she wants me to do something for her nearly every second of the day. It's not just hold the bear once. It's hold the bear, then sit on a specific spot on the floor, no chair allowed, then put this thing on a doll, then say a word this way not that way...it never ends. So I feel I have to refuse a lot of these requests because it's exhausting and also feels extreme and unhealthy. Where should I draw the line?


This is an interesting observation and is something I have observed from some women who stay at home with their kids and also children with overly indulgent mothers. It’s like the mom or nanny works for the kids and it can’t be healthy in the long term. This kind of dynamic is only possible when a mom has few kids and not a lot going or, or a FT nanny.



There’s a possibility your child just got off on the wrong foot when you indulged the child a great bit. A less gentle way to say it is that your child is spoiled. You demonstrated to your child that she’s in charge and your her space to cater to her every need. You don’t have other things to do - it all revolves around your child. All kids are self-centered, but yours is on another level.

Simply ignore your kid. Wear earplugs. I find it hard to believe your child doesn’t act like this with others, but continues to do so with you, and you’re not encouraging the behavior in some way. It’s like the parents who tell you their kids won’t sleep but whenever the kid screams at night they are in their room to comfort them.

Another solution is to put your child in all-day daycare or preschool next school year.


I agree to a certain extent, but she’s been this extreme and needy from birth. Our night doulas agreed she’s the worst sleeper they’ve ever seen, and they are professionals at this. And as an infant, she was this challenging with everyone, not just me. So I do think she’s high needs but yes, I probably accidentally made it worse by being available and not knowing when to say no.


Since she was born have you been away for a few days apart from her? Do you go out for an afternoon without her, or go on date nights?

The moms I know with these high need babies/toddlers never seem to be apart from their kid.


You are, very unfairly, getting the cause and effect wrong. I have never been apart from her for more than a few hours since birth. But NOT BY CHOICE. I would love, LOVE to go away for a week. Weeks. I have never left her because since birth no one else could soothe her or put her to bed. Not my husband, not my mother, not paid professionals. I think it’s unfair to claim I’m some attachment-woo, overprotective mother who created a child like this by refusing to be apart from her. No. I’m a pretty normal person who had a nanny and a plan lined up then compassionately changed my plans because my baby was super, super distressed (and everyone around me agreed).

I think the pp above is right in that if you have a child like this you end up walking on eggshells and accommodating over time.


I’m curious what you think might happen if you were to go away for a week? What is it that you’re imagining will occur or not occur?


Good question. About once a month my husband and I try to integrate him into the bedtime routine to see if we can make it work. It results in hours of screaming, hyperventilating, and vomiting, and then a personality change in the toddler for a few days to a week afterward where she seems, for lack of a better word, depressed. Her language skills regress, she talks endlessly about how she cried and mommy wasn’t there, she has even more tantrums and clings more, she doesn’t want to play as much, etc. It’s so extreme and not worth it.


Wait are you OP? I thought your daughter acts normal for everyone else except you?

Honestly the behavior sounds hysterical and so crazy that I’d still head out the door. I would assume it’s a type of tantrum. I can’t see how continuing to go along with the behavior is going to help your child.

If you are OP, the problem is making more sense as you respond to questions.

I personally think you need to go cold turkey. Your daughter needs to learn that your DH is a safe caretaker and you’re allowed to spend time alone.





You’ve never dealt with SN I see


But what kind of SN is it that a child acts normal for all adults except for with mom? This is a true medical condition?



This child isn't acting normal for everyone else. OP has said that her husband can't put the child to bed, and that night helpers have quit, a night doula said the child was the worst sleeper she's ever seen, etc. It's easy to think that when a child is happy to play a game with another caregiver that the child behaves "normally" with others, but you have to observe the child when a non-preferred activity is taking place with the other caregiver. Then you see that it's not all OK with other people.
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