Is it time for private school vouchers in Montgomery County?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP you are citing multiple posters and trying to lump different arguments into one.

Many special populations - special needs students being one - fell disproportionately behind than other students according to MCPS data presented to the Board of Ed. MCPS was quick to remove the supports and services that these students legally need for accessibility. MCPS has been slow to provide services so special needs students can catch up. This equates to a two year decline for students with special needs. Enough is enough. We are tired of our students being treated as an afterthought by MCPS, and as one PP has expressed, not deserving of educational benefit. That’s taking a whole student group that gained rights under the ADA, Section 504, and the IDEA back to pre-Civil Rights level of discrimination.

Parents are tired with fighting with MCPS for basic services listed on IEPs that aren’t being provided. School choice would provide us a financial mechanism to be able to leave MCPS to a school that wants to educate them.

My child has an IEP. I haven't seen their issues not being addressed. True, their issues aren't very complicated compared to.some.

But you are speaking for your own family. Not for all of us. Like you, I assume, I'm also on the various SN list serves and Facebook groups. There's no groundswell of parents demanding school vouchers. And you don't seem to be complaining there about it.

At this point I think at least half a dozen different posters have explained to you why school choice isn't going to give your child a magic placement that will "fix" them. That horrible troll post about damaged kids had one element of truth in what they said that perhaps you need to hear:

Our kids aren't "normal," whatever that even means. It's ablelist for you to assume our kids can meet your arbitrary goals and that only some vast Moco conspiracy is what's holding them back. Maybe what's holding your child back is his father's massive sense of entitlement and privilege.

Except what MCPS is doing (not providing more than de minimus) is against federal law. Gosh, some of you are so dim! Just because your kids can memorize things quickly doesn’t mean our kids (who may have working memory issues) aren’t bright and are being ignored. (As an example).

MCPS is a despicable organization - but if your kid is in Blair Magnet - you wouldn’t even realize it. Or you work for the schools - Moco is America’s Venezuela… everyone works for the schools or the county.

Charters are one of the few ways to give a monopoly a signal - you are sub-optimal. With so many county workers as voters it’s challenging to change the status quo.

+1 million

This is exactly ir.

+1000 - There are many reasons why parents are unhappy. How students with disabilities are discriminated against is one reason parents want alternative options.

If you are happy with MCPS (particularly if MCPS is paying for your child’s private education) then count your children blessed. Some disabilities are more appropriately addressed by MCPS than others. Some schools do a better job than others. It doesn’t mean the voice of complaints aren’t valid. The State complaint losses are piling up. The OCR complaints are piling up. Due Process is a longer venue and the last result, so they will begin piling up as well.

Even though some PPs have clear implicit bias about educating students with disabilities, all students deserve FAPE - a Free Appropriate Public Education.

I don’t think most are disagreeing with you that students with disabilities deserve FAPE. What they are arguing in 1) Appropriate needs to be defined with respective to each disability and 2)the current MCPS average cost to educate a student of 16K (which includes the additional dollars being spent on a smaller portion of the population) is not going to pay for private school tuition most anywhere in the DMV, and definitely not somewhere that will address many of the student disabilities that MCPS is tasked with addressed. ALSO, and this is very key, no private school is required to admit your child (voucher or no voucher) nor lower their cost of tuition, which means for many, that vouchers wouldn’t actually give them meaningful choice.

Yes but it would make rich people happy and then they would pay more taxes or some other horeshit logic!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The reality is that school choice, whether vouchers or more likely charters, is an inevitability at this point. A matter of when not if. It will be the legacy of Brenda Wolff’s leadership as President of the BOE.

Nah. The reality is that even those of us who support public education, and, perhaps especially those of us who support public education, will want more accountability and perhaps a whole different set of services in return for our tax dollars. Nothing is “inevitable “, and you seem to be misreading the priorities of most county residents — perhaps deliberately.

Two charter proposals came before the BOE already this year and the BOE voted both down. One of the proposals was well funded with a million dollar state grant. It should be noted that these charter proposals were sponsored and lead by Black groups. The proposals will keep coming and if the discontent with MCPS continues grow, they will be inevitable

If people cared about public education and believe that school choice will undermine it, they just understand that the only way to protect public education is to take action now to bring MCPS back from the brink.

There is a lot slack available for further deterioration of educational quality. The self-correction needs to happen now.

I think only one of them was denied, actually. The one that was denied, according to coverage at the time, did not have a clear operational plan or strategy to pay for upgrades to the building they were looking to use. https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-recommends-one-of-two-charter-school-applications/

It was also for a single sex elementary school starting in K, but otherwise wasn't filling a niche that is currently not filled. MCPS has been clear that they want charter schools to provide programs not already available.

The other proposal appears to have been approved, for a business and entrepreneurial focused MS.

[Anonymous]

Given MCPS’ third grade reading scores what is desperately needed is a dyslexia charter - like NYC.

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/education/2022/02/10/as-city-eyes-news-schools-for-students-with-dyslexia--one-charter-school-is-already-serving-them

A charter school for entrepreneurs in socialist MoCo? Now that’s irony..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

While we're doing this, I thought maybe we could also have private vouchers for police and fire protection too! Think of the savings!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Given MCPS’ third grade reading scores what is desperately needed is a dyslexia charter - like NYC.

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/education/2022/02/10/as-city-eyes-news-schools-for-students-with-dyslexia--one-charter-school-is-already-serving-them

A charter school for entrepreneurs in socialist MoCo? Now that’s irony..

They would need more than one. Statistically 20% of people in the world have dyslexia. So that’s roughly 30,000 students in MCPS. Let’s also not forget that the reading curriculums designed for dyslexia work on ALL children. So every school (public and private) should be teaching reading based on science that’s been around for decades.

https://www.apmreports.org/episode/2019/08/22/whats-wrong-how-schools-teach-reading

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The reality is that school choice, whether vouchers or more likely charters, is an inevitability at this point. A matter of when not if. It will be the legacy of Brenda Wolff’s leadership as President of the BOE.

Nah. The reality is that even those of us who support public education, and, perhaps especially those of us who support public education, will want more accountability and perhaps a whole different set of services in return for our tax dollars. Nothing is “inevitable “, and you seem to be misreading the priorities of most county residents — perhaps deliberately.

Two charter proposals came before the BOE already this year and the BOE voted both down. One of the proposals was well funded with a million dollar state grant. It should be noted that these charter proposals were sponsored and lead by Black groups. The proposals will keep coming and if the discontent with MCPS continues grow, they will be inevitable

If people cared about public education and believe that school choice will undermine it, they just understand that the only way to protect public education is to take action now to bring MCPS back from the brink.

There is a lot slack available for further deterioration of educational quality. The self-correction needs to happen now.

I think only one of them was denied, actually. The one that was denied, according to coverage at the time, did not have a clear operational plan or strategy to pay for upgrades to the building they were looking to use. https://www.mymcmedia.org/mcps-recommends-one-of-two-charter-school-applications/

It was also for a single sex elementary school starting in K, but otherwise wasn't filling a niche that is currently not filled. MCPS has been clear that they want charter schools to provide programs not already available.

The other proposal appears to have been approved, for a business and entrepreneurial focused MS.

Both were denied. One was determined ineligible. The other, which has received signing funding, was voted down unanimously.
https://www.mymcmedia.org/boe-rejects-charter-school-proposals/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Would you take your child out of MCPS if there was a private school voucher program so Montgomery County residents had school choice?

While we're doing this, I thought maybe we could also have private vouchers for police and fire protection too! Think of the savings!

Montgomery County gives grants to religious organizations to upgrade their security systems. So yes, they already do that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

Yeah. But how much would hiring a lot of people and doing lots of audits cost?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

MCPS has lots of oversight (parents, BOE, local council, state superintendent DOE, Federal DOE, etc). Much more than any private school. I’m pretty sure that most principals, teachers, and folks would agree that less in some areas would be great. Like leas testing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

MCPS has lots of oversight (parents, BOE, local council, state superintendent DOE, Federal DOE, etc). Much more than any private school. I’m pretty sure that most principals, teachers, and folks would agree that less in some areas would be great. Like leas testing.

Goverment contractors complaining about inefficiency and bloat.

Hilarious

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Given MCPS’ third grade reading scores what is desperately needed is a dyslexia charter - like NYC.

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/education/2022/02/10/as-city-eyes-news-schools-for-students-with-dyslexia--one-charter-school-is-already-serving-them

A charter school for entrepreneurs in socialist MoCo? Now that’s irony..

We don't need a charter school, we need more reading specialists, identify reading issues in K-1 grade and do heavy remediation and we need special programs for kids come 3-4th grades for kids who have dyslexia.

We had a charter program. It got shut down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

MCPS has lots of oversight (parents, BOE, local council, state superintendent DOE, Federal DOE, etc). Much more than any private school. I’m pretty sure that most principals, teachers, and folks would agree that less in some areas would be great. Like leas testing.

Given how little time teachers spend with each child, for some kids, testing is a good thing. I have a kid who basically got ignored and the teachers were shocked by the test scores. We tried to tell them but they wouldn't listen.

Privates aren't comparable as they test prior to coming to the school and they are taking either the wealthy who pay for private tutoring or the smart kids who don't need as much help/support so there is no need for testing as those kids will continue on target.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

Yeah. But how much would hiring a lot of people and doing lots of audits cost?

How much do MCPS meetings that are never followed up on cost?

Privates are smaller and therefore more flexible to meet the needs of students.

MCPS is huge and doesn’t give a damn if children are educated. Leaders are constantly vying for that next promotion or lucrative contract hire after they leave MCPS. Even MCPS leadership doesn’t think that the schools are good enough for their children who are enrolled in private schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand the economics. Where does 16k a kid go? Seems that 4 kids pay the teachers salary but class sizes are 20-25.

MCPS wastes an enormous amount of money. It’s insane. Plus the salaries of Central Office employees.

Look through DCUM for some threads about the enormous waste in MCPS.

Part of the issue is that MCPS is just too big and doesn’t have any oversight.

I know it's shameful they're wasting all that money on education!