Banneker HS - College and Score Outcomes

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

I've been in the DC public schools long enough to sit through a principal's presentation where they enthusiastically lauded the fact that the school was making progress toward closing the equity gap! (But if you looked at the fine print, you saw that it was solely because scores of the white kids had dropped -- not that the scores of disadvantaged kids rose at all). No matter what their race or social-economic background, a mind is a terrible thing to waste. All kids should be encouraged to reach their potential. But instead, ours will be lapped by kids in other countries and have a challenge competing in an AI-led, global economy.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Look up
DCPS SAT scores. I think on the DCPS site. There's a spreadsheet. You can also find AP scores. Walls is the only school that's just across the board higher. JR is obviously huge and high-variance.

Thanks. Found the SAT (https://dcps.dc.gov/publication/dcps-data-set-sat) and AP (https://dcps.dc.gov/publication/ap-score-data-sets) spreadsheets. The averages are indeed as you say. I would have expected Banneker to do better but I take it that there is a very long thread from a few years back on that topic.

Why do you think your child will score in line with others? I have a Banneker student who has scored 5 on APs and 1540 on SATs. You’re aware this is a Title 1 school. The kids are all very studious and bright but there are some kids who have tough home lives. If your kid doesn’t have these challenges, s/he will score high. Test score track HHI closely.

My personable Asian 8th grader who finds 10th grade math/Trigonometry easy at a DC charter, scored 600s on the SAT for admission to a Johns Hopkins CTY STEM camp and has a 3.9 GPA wasn't so much as waitlisted at Banneker. I'm left with the impression that Banneker doesn't knock itself out on the STEM achievement front. We're staying at the charter, which the kid isn't wild about, with new appreciation for it.

Banneker is a Humanities focused school so no you won't get the STEM feel you want. It's not hard to figure out. I'd look at moving if you feel like your kid needs more of a challenge. TJ would probably be great..Blair also.

Do you not understand the residency requirements that apply to public schools across the country or are you trying to make a different point about where you would like people from certain backgrounds to move to? I'm genuinely curious.

DP who referenced TJ, Blair and RMIB. No, it has nothing to do with race. Just making a point about how annoying parents are when they declare nothing is possibly good enough for their “advanced” child. Ok friend, try your hand at the VERY selective and demanding public programs just a short move away. Oh, Larlo won’t get into TJ? You don’t say …

They didn't get into Banneker. Banneker decided the kid wasn't good enough for them, not the other way around. And it wasn't because they had a long line of more academically-advanced kids trying to get in.

+1. What a joke. When a pleasant, diligent 8th grader does HS math two or three years ahead of grade level and destroyed both mandatory sections of the SAT at age 14 but can't even get waitlisted at Banneker, the system is broken. Everybody's sure that not being low SES or AA was irrelevant in the case? I'm far from convinced. I note that Banneker's average SAT scores for 17–18-year-olds are still just a little above the national average, in the low 500s.

They don't look at PARCC scores or what math class the kid is taking, much less SAT, and they're explicit about that. I think that's a huge mistake. But I don't think you need an additional explanation on top of that. It's basically random.

What an outrage. Why in the hell can't DC support a single world-class public high school with transparent admissions or an elite school-within-a-school program like other big US cities do here in 2024? High time for DC voters to demand more.

Walls, BASIS, Banneker, J-R, Latin, DCI, none of them are half as good as Boston Latin or Cambridge Rindge and Latin (although Boston and DC are very close in population size). All of our best public high schools either support middling academics, weak facilities or both. All of them essentially admit by lottery, or by real estate. None of them even aspire to be in the same league as the Blair Montgomery magnets, TJ, or Richard Montgomery or Washington-Liberty IB Diploma, here in the DMV. High time for DC to up its game.

While I agree with much of this, why is it that Walls, for example, gets a rating of 2nd best Metro-area school, after TJ? It's not any of the MoCo schools. BTW I'm a MoCo school product and don't believe I received some kind of superior education to the masses.

Walls and Banneker used to have a more rigorous selection processes and have built their reputations on the student bodies they attracted as a result. As other threads attest to, those selection processes have been torn asunder in recent years by doing away with PARCC scores and testing and basing admissions decisions entirely on GPA (despite wide variation within and between DCPS schools in grading standards), subjective letters of recommendation, interviews, and an essay (application for Banneker, in-person for Walls). As a result, selection has become more akin to a lottery, which will inevitably impinge upon the preparedness of the students and the quality of learning at the schools. The proposed funding cuts to DCPS won't help matters either. Which is a long way of saying that while these DC selective schools have good reputations, they are probably heading in the wrong direction.

I think you are being dramatic and perhaps resentful. My child, and the others in their cohort who got into Walls and Banneker, are all high-achieving, high GPA's and 4's & 5's on PARCC, and read and math above grade level. Yes, they made it in under the subjective letters of rec, interview, and essay, but those don't negate the objective merits that helped get them in. The bottom line is, there are not enough spots for all the kids who deserve them, as has been said hundreds of time before. So it has to come down to luck at some point. I do believe that the '09-'10 babies were a boom in the city and changed the demographics forever more. Unfortunately it's only going to be harder for the coming cohorts to get into these schools. Hopefully though, the likes of McKinley, DCI, and others will benefit from the onslaught of more high-achieving students and things will start equaling out a bit with more better HS options in DC (plus the intro of MacArthur into the mix).

If you define "qualified" as "good grades and testing at grade level", then yes, there are too many qualified kids. But that's not the full range of ways we have of evaluating students no matter how many times someone says it. When a kid who's already testing in the 600s on each section of the SAT can't get into a school where the high school seniors on average are doing less well, it's not because there are too many high-achieving students, it's because the admissions process doesn't look at achievement beyond a certain point. And that bar doesn't even include being at grade level any more. Of course a lot of the kids who get in are still good. But that's a function of the applicant pool, not the admissions process.

And this is where it comes down to luck, I’m sorry to say. That sounds like an outlier situation as I’m sure there is not a massive number of middle-schoolers scoring like that on the SAT’s (or even taking the SATs yet?)

I'm not even sure how the school would be aware of one's SATs for this to even be a factor. If it was mentioned in interview, it was probably off-putting.

It's not a factor. Whether you do advanced coursework is also not a factor. Whether you test at grade level is not a factor. The whole point is that *none of these are factors*, so kids who are too advanced for their EOTP zoned high schools (which in some cases really just means being at grade level) have no way to differentiate themselves in the admissions process for Banneker or Walls.

This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

I take it you will be singing the same tune during college admissions instead of finding a better solution and fit for your kid.

dp: What are you talking about? Colleges don't have any obligation to serve anybody (except state run systems and their citizens). DCPS is here for the residents (and tax-payers!) of DC. It's not a private institution.

DCPS is doing precisely that. And I'm referring to complaining about rejection instead of moving on to Plan B. That sounds much like the parents who complain about acceptances to elite colleges for kids that they deem less deserving. Get used to rejection, its a part of life and move on to a better solution within your control.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Look up
DCPS SAT scores. I think on the DCPS site. There's a spreadsheet. You can also find AP scores. Walls is the only school that's just across the board higher. JR is obviously huge and high-variance.

Thanks. Found the SAT (https://dcps.dc.gov/publication/dcps-data-set-sat) and AP (https://dcps.dc.gov/publication/ap-score-data-sets) spreadsheets. The averages are indeed as you say. I would have expected Banneker to do better but I take it that there is a very long thread from a few years back on that topic.

Why do you think your child will score in line with others? I have a Banneker student who has scored 5 on APs and 1540 on SATs. You’re aware this is a Title 1 school. The kids are all very studious and bright but there are some kids who have tough home lives. If your kid doesn’t have these challenges, s/he will score high. Test score track HHI closely.

My personable Asian 8th grader who finds 10th grade math/Trigonometry easy at a DC charter, scored 600s on the SAT for admission to a Johns Hopkins CTY STEM camp and has a 3.9 GPA wasn't so much as waitlisted at Banneker. I'm left with the impression that Banneker doesn't knock itself out on the STEM achievement front. We're staying at the charter, which the kid isn't wild about, with new appreciation for it.

Banneker is a Humanities focused school so no you won't get the STEM feel you want. It's not hard to figure out. I'd look at moving if you feel like your kid needs more of a challenge. TJ would probably be great..Blair also.

Do you not understand the residency requirements that apply to public schools across the country or are you trying to make a different point about where you would like people from certain backgrounds to move to? I'm genuinely curious.

DP who referenced TJ, Blair and RMIB. No, it has nothing to do with race. Just making a point about how annoying parents are when they declare nothing is possibly good enough for their “advanced” child. Ok friend, try your hand at the VERY selective and demanding public programs just a short move away. Oh, Larlo won’t get into TJ? You don’t say …

They didn't get into Banneker. Banneker decided the kid wasn't good enough for them, not the other way around. And it wasn't because they had a long line of more academically-advanced kids trying to get in.

+1. What a joke. When a pleasant, diligent 8th grader does HS math two or three years ahead of grade level and destroyed both mandatory sections of the SAT at age 14 but can't even get waitlisted at Banneker, the system is broken. Everybody's sure that not being low SES or AA was irrelevant in the case? I'm far from convinced. I note that Banneker's average SAT scores for 17–18-year-olds are still just a little above the national average, in the low 500s.

They don't look at PARCC scores or what math class the kid is taking, much less SAT, and they're explicit about that. I think that's a huge mistake. But I don't think you need an additional explanation on top of that. It's basically random.

What an outrage. Why in the hell can't DC support a single world-class public high school with transparent admissions or an elite school-within-a-school program like other big US cities do here in 2024? High time for DC voters to demand more.

Walls, BASIS, Banneker, J-R, Latin, DCI, none of them are half as good as Boston Latin or Cambridge Rindge and Latin (although Boston and DC are very close in population size). All of our best public high schools either support middling academics, weak facilities or both. All of them essentially admit by lottery, or by real estate. None of them even aspire to be in the same league as the Blair Montgomery magnets, TJ, or Richard Montgomery or Washington-Liberty IB Diploma, here in the DMV. High time for DC to up its game.

While I agree with much of this, why is it that Walls, for example, gets a rating of 2nd best Metro-area school, after TJ? It's not any of the MoCo schools. BTW I'm a MoCo school product and don't believe I received some kind of superior education to the masses.

Walls and Banneker used to have a more rigorous selection processes and have built their reputations on the student bodies they attracted as a result. As other threads attest to, those selection processes have been torn asunder in recent years by doing away with PARCC scores and testing and basing admissions decisions entirely on GPA (despite wide variation within and between DCPS schools in grading standards), subjective letters of recommendation, interviews, and an essay (application for Banneker, in-person for Walls). As a result, selection has become more akin to a lottery, which will inevitably impinge upon the preparedness of the students and the quality of learning at the schools. The proposed funding cuts to DCPS won't help matters either. Which is a long way of saying that while these DC selective schools have good reputations, they are probably heading in the wrong direction.

I think you are being dramatic and perhaps resentful. My child, and the others in their cohort who got into Walls and Banneker, are all high-achieving, high GPA's and 4's & 5's on PARCC, and read and math above grade level. Yes, they made it in under the subjective letters of rec, interview, and essay, but those don't negate the objective merits that helped get them in. The bottom line is, there are not enough spots for all the kids who deserve them, as has been said hundreds of time before. So it has to come down to luck at some point. I do believe that the '09-'10 babies were a boom in the city and changed the demographics forever more. Unfortunately it's only going to be harder for the coming cohorts to get into these schools. Hopefully though, the likes of McKinley, DCI, and others will benefit from the onslaught of more high-achieving students and things will start equaling out a bit with more better HS options in DC (plus the intro of MacArthur into the mix).

If you define "qualified" as "good grades and testing at grade level", then yes, there are too many qualified kids. But that's not the full range of ways we have of evaluating students no matter how many times someone says it. When a kid who's already testing in the 600s on each section of the SAT can't get into a school where the high school seniors on average are doing less well, it's not because there are too many high-achieving students, it's because the admissions process doesn't look at achievement beyond a certain point. And that bar doesn't even include being at grade level any more. Of course a lot of the kids who get in are still good. But that's a function of the applicant pool, not the admissions process.

And this is where it comes down to luck, I’m sorry to say. That sounds like an outlier situation as I’m sure there is not a massive number of middle-schoolers scoring like that on the SAT’s (or even taking the SATs yet?)

I'm not even sure how the school would be aware of one's SATs for this to even be a factor. If it was mentioned in interview, it was probably off-putting.

It's not a factor. Whether you do advanced coursework is also not a factor. Whether you test at grade level is not a factor. The whole point is that *none of these are factors*, so kids who are too advanced for their EOTP zoned high schools (which in some cases really just means being at grade level) have no way to differentiate themselves in the admissions process for Banneker or Walls.

This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

I take it you will be singing the same tune during college admissions instead of finding a better solution and fit for your kid.

dp: What are you talking about? Colleges don't have any obligation to serve anybody (except state run systems and their citizens). DCPS is here for the residents (and tax-payers!) of DC. It's not a private institution.

DCPS is doing precisely that. And I'm referring to complaining about rejection instead of moving on to Plan B. That sounds much like the parents who complain about acceptances to elite colleges for kids that they deem less deserving. Get used to rejection, its a part of life and move on to a better solution within your control.

People should complain about rejection if the system is random and if it DCPS is not serving all it's kids appropriately!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

NARRATOR: Children in DCPS do worse on standardized test than do kids in Mississippi. Nearly half of DC students are chronically absent, even though the school marks them as attending so long as they show up by 2pm. In many schools, *none* of the kids are working at grade level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

DC does not encompass the world, the country, or even the metropolitan area. Parents - particularly wealthy parents - have choices and will vote with their feet if the public schools are not doing their job. When they leave, they take their tax dollars and their motivated kids with them. Both of those factors hurt DC's ability to educate disadvantaged students. I'm sorry if it affects your notions of social justice, but the reality is that DC's failure to cater to high-performing students hobbles the rest of the public school system in the city.

[Anonymous]

It's not a failure to "cater" to high-performing students. It's a failure to meet their education needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's not a failure to "cater" to high-performing students. It's a failure to meet their education needs.

What are you talking about? The complaint is that a single high-scoring 8th grader didn't get in, even though they're great at the SAT. Banneker doesn't have to meet the needs of students who do not attend Banneker, and the complaint on the table is absolutely that the school isn't catering to the kinds of high-SES parents who make their middle schoolers take the SAT to show off. SAT scores aren't considered in admission to high schools because *middle schoolers don't take the SAT*.

What's fun is the assumption that since this kid is good at math and, by his mom's account, otherwise charming - then all the kids who did get into Banneker must be less intelligent and getting some kind of preferential treatment they don't deserve. I feel like you people can't even hear yourselves.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

I’m a public school teacher and people who think like you frustrate me. Schools cannot fix the damaging effects of poverty and trauma unfortunately. If you are concerned about homelessness, you should be advocating for the mayor to build more affordable housing in the city. And if you care about homeless kids, you should want them to get a good education in DCPS so they have access to good colleges which will lead to good jobs. If you follow DCPS graduates through college, the 4 year college graduation rate is low. I believe only about 20% of DCPS students who transition to a 4 year college actually come out with a college degree in 4-5 years. We need higher standards in our schools for all kids. A few years ago there was a Washington Post story about the valedictorian at Dunbar HS who was offered a full ride at a well known college. She dropped out a year later saying that she could not keep up with the academics at her college

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

Whole lotta stereotyping going on here. Sorry, sweetie. Most kids who do poorly in school aren't dodging bullets all day. They just don't give a shit about school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not a failure to "cater" to high-performing students. It's a failure to meet their education needs.

What are you talking about? The complaint is that a single high-scoring 8th grader didn't get in, even though they're great at the SAT. Banneker doesn't have to meet the needs of students who do not attend Banneker, and the complaint on the table is absolutely that the school isn't catering to the kinds of high-SES parents who make their middle schoolers take the SAT to show off. SAT scores aren't considered in admission to high schools because *middle schoolers don't take the SAT*.

What's fun is the assumption that since this kid is good at math and, by his mom's account, otherwise charming - then all the kids who did get into Banneker must be less intelligent and getting some kind of preferential treatment they don't deserve. I feel like you people can't even hear yourselves.

The problem isn't that the kid didn't get into Banneker. The problem is that the kid didn't get in to any DCPS school where they won't be a total outlier, and so all DCPS has for the kid is a school where even being at grade level is extremely rare.

And no one was complaining about not using SAT scores. The complaint was about not using anything that SAT scores also proxy for. If you look at the SAT scores at Banneker then, yes, obviously kids are getting admitted who aren't where that kid is. Which is totally fine, if DCPS had anything for that kid or other kids like them who aren't zoned for JR.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

Whole lotta stereotyping going on here. Sorry, sweetie. Most kids who do poorly in school aren't dodging bullets all day. They just don't give a shit about school.

This and they are not homeless or hungry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

I’m a public school teacher and people who think like you frustrate me. Schools cannot fix the damaging effects of poverty and trauma unfortunately. If you are concerned about homelessness, you should be advocating for the mayor to build more affordable housing in the city. And if you care about homeless kids, you should want them to get a good education in DCPS so they have access to good colleges which will lead to good jobs. If you follow DCPS graduates through college, the 4 year college graduation rate is low. I believe only about 20% of DCPS students who transition to a 4 year college actually come out with a college degree in 4-5 years. We need higher standards in our schools for all kids. A few years ago there was a Washington Post story about the valedictorian at Dunbar HS who was offered a full ride at a well known college. She dropped out a year later saying that she could not keep up with the academics at her college

Thank you for this!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not a failure to "cater" to high-performing students. It's a failure to meet their education needs.

What are you talking about? The complaint is that a single high-scoring 8th grader didn't get in, even though they're great at the SAT. Banneker doesn't have to meet the needs of students who do not attend Banneker, and the complaint on the table is absolutely that the school isn't catering to the kinds of high-SES parents who make their middle schoolers take the SAT to show off. SAT scores aren't considered in admission to high schools because *middle schoolers don't take the SAT*.

What's fun is the assumption that since this kid is good at math and, by his mom's account, otherwise charming - then all the kids who did get into Banneker must be less intelligent and getting some kind of preferential treatment they don't deserve. I feel like you people can't even hear yourselves.

I feel the need to defend this PP.

1. Parents like this have their kids take the SAT so that they can qualify for CTY. Then they send them to CTY so they can take challenging classes with other nerds and have the time of their lives. IYKYK. They aren't doing it to "show off" but for a much more tangible outcome.

2. In any other city, kids like this would ace the entrance exam for the application/magnet high school. Then they could go to a school where they are challenged and set on a path to succeed.

That's where this parents frustration lies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This. The process clearly isn't designed to identify the most capable or hardest-working 8th grade students who apply to either Walls or Banneker. If it were, an appropriate entrance exam would obviously be used to screen applicants, like the SSAT in NYC, the Boston Latin entrance exam, or the PSAT 8/9 (common high school magnet entrance exam around the country). It's painfully clear that Banneker and Walls don't favor academic highfliers over weaker students in admissions. If they did, applicants who work years ahead of grade level in math and English would be admitted over those who don't, period. What a travesty.

You clearly do not see that your privilege is a factor here. Did your children grow up in D.C. public schools? If so, then you would know that DC does not value the concept of working ahead of grade level. Most of those "several grade level ahead kids" are supplemented by tutors or are ahead of grade level because their parents' have attained a higher education (can do better on standardized tests due to wider vocabulary, grammar, etc.), eat regular healthy meals vs fast food/snacks so can focus, and do not typically have the same stresses as everyday D.C. public school kids (unavailable parent due to work schedule, gang violence, incarcerated parent, poverty, etc). My child goes to school with several homeless children. DCPS values those kids as much as they value mine. And they want to make it so that those kids have the same opportunities. In fact, I think that if a kid who is food insecure and has no home is able to come to school and make As, they deserve a shot at whatever school they want. The DC system is set up to recognize that all kids are equally capable. There is no concept of academic competition or getting ahead. It is about growth of all individuals. UMC families want that growth to be accelerated and their kid to be on top, but that is just not the goal of D.C. schools. Parents who know this are usually bought into the idea of "community" and all boats rise with the tide. The questions you are asking and the comments you are making seem foreign to me and most of the people I know with kids in D.C. Public Schools. They sound very elitist. But I understand they are common outside of D.C. Again, which is why I don't think you came up in D.C. Public Schools.

Whole lotta stereotyping going on here. Sorry, sweetie. Most kids who do poorly in school aren't dodging bullets all day. They just don't give a shit about school.

This and they are not homeless or hungry.

DC is obsessed with whatever advantages or disadvantages people supposedly have, but doing well in school is most closely correlated with trying really, really hard to do well in school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not a failure to "cater" to high-performing students. It's a failure to meet their education needs.

What are you talking about? The complaint is that a single high-scoring 8th grader didn't get in, even though they're great at the SAT. Banneker doesn't have to meet the needs of students who do not attend Banneker, and the complaint on the table is absolutely that the school isn't catering to the kinds of high-SES parents who make their middle schoolers take the SAT to show off. SAT scores aren't considered in admission to high schools because *middle schoolers don't take the SAT*.

What's fun is the assumption that since this kid is good at math and, by his mom's account, otherwise charming - then all the kids who did get into Banneker must be less intelligent and getting some kind of preferential treatment they don't deserve. I feel like you people can't even hear yourselves.

Wrong. Given that the girl works 2-3 years ahead of grade level in middle school math, her stellar early SAT scores do no more than reflect her exceptional aptitude and hard work as an 8th grade student of high merit. An entrance exam to Banneker testing above-grade-level math would have further attested to her exceptional achievement. In another city, where the magnet high school admissions system resembles something akin to a Jeffersonian Meritocracy, such a student would almost certainly been identified as a highly desirable applicant, a stand-out, before being admitted. In said city, ed system leaders would have followed the logic of snatching her up before some tony private school reeled her in with a juicy merit scholarship or she landed in a prestigious suburban test-in program. But here in the urban academic doldrums--DCPS--she's eminently expendable. The joke is clearly on our public schools.

People like you clearly lack analytical thinking skills, mired in relativism as you are in your woke miasma.