NPS: Ban Cars Now in DC Urban Parks

[Anonymous]

The District has given motorists under the guise of "fairness and equality" the liberty of being able to drive like maniacs and suffer no repercussions.

Some bicyclists cycle with little empathy for those they share walking paths and roads around DC.

Where does it end when both parties are the blame?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:DC has given an exemption to traffic rules for bicyclists. An exemption they dont get in MD or VA. It may be legal but that doesn't mean it is either right or good policy.

What exemption, specifically, are you referring to? Please explain.

Stopping at red lights and stop signs. As has been stated repeatedly.

So because you are at a red light in a car, and a bike slows down, assesses and determines it is safe for them to continue, that gets you upset? And in terms of stopping at stop signs, have you heard of the "Idaho Stop?" Many states have adopted this as a very safe option. Get used to it.

Many states that do not include Washington DC, Virginia, or Maryland, right? I know everyone does it anyway and most of the time it's done safely, but it's not actually legal.

Most drivers do the Idaho stop at stop signs too.

Yep. Stake out any corner on Capitol Hill with a four-way stop sign. Take a shot every time you see a driver come to a complete stop if there isn't an obstacle directly in front of them. You'll be stone-cold sober at the end of the day.

Just confirming, it's not legal for bikes or cars, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DP. The weird thing about cyclists is that they think everyone cares about cycling and cyclists. We don’t, okay. No ones going to congratulate you because you think you’re morally superior. Get over yourselves.

great. this is a post about pedestrians killed by a reckless driver in a park. so let’s discuss that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. The weird thing about cyclists is that they think everyone cares about cycling and cyclists. We don’t, okay. No ones going to congratulate you because you think you’re morally superior. Get over yourselves.

I think you've identified the most annoying thing about self-declared cyclists, who I would consider to be a subset of the people who ride bikes. There's a sense of moral superiority about their choice of transportation that you don't see in people who walk, take public transit, or drive. Every argument for more bicycle infrastructure has an almost religious undertone because cycling is the One True Way to travel.

If bicycling is religious, driving is a cult. Literally, with blood sacrifices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

from what I’ve seen, the two dead pedestrians were african american seniors. stop trying to make this about race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

Yes, I’m a collapsible cart. Like what we do when we go to the beach. But thanks for labeling a large group of people is incapable of managing our business.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DP. The weird thing about cyclists is that they think everyone cares about cycling and cyclists. We don’t, okay. No ones going to congratulate you because you think you’re morally superior. Get over yourselves.

Where I live (Montgomery County) the single biggest group of cyclists is men riding on the sidewalk to get from point A to point B. Sometimes they also use the bus for part of their trip (and put their bikes on the bus rack in front).

The weird thing is that nobody who hates on cyclists seems to even see these cyclists, let alone recognize this fact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

You could get a permit for one car to drive per cookout. Sounds good to me. No it’s not zion but it is a park in an urban area, which makes preserving it even more precious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

from what I’ve seen, the two dead pedestrians were african american seniors. stop trying to make this about race.

You're kind of missing the point. There are different users of Hains Point. Some walk and bike through it, and it's perfectly fine to explore how to keep those folks safe. But, quite a few people need to drive through the park because their use requires them to, for example, carry large amounts of food, chairs, grills etc. Using the park for family cookouts seems to be disproportionately an African American thing. So, it's not surprising that the readership on DCUM would discount that use.

It's the usual provincialism you see on here. "No one I know has large family events at Hains Point, so therefore we don't need to consider that use."

And I say this as someone whose use of Hains Point is almost always bike-based.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

You could get a permit for one car to drive per cookout. Sounds good to me. No it’s not zion but it is a park in an urban area, which makes preserving it even more precious.

I'm sure it sounds great to you, because it doesn't create any burden for you. Imposing burdens on other people is one of the easiest things in the world to do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. The weird thing about cyclists is that they think everyone cares about cycling and cyclists. We don’t, okay. No ones going to congratulate you because you think you’re morally superior. Get over yourselves.

Where I live (Montgomery County) the single biggest group of cyclists is men riding on the sidewalk to get from point A to point B. Sometimes they also use the bus for part of their trip (and put their bikes on the bus rack in front).

The weird thing is that nobody who hates on cyclists seems to even see these cyclists, let alone recognize this fact.

because race and class and disability don’t actually matter to people who bring them up - they are just using them to gain points. the idea that black DC residents might like to be able to stroll safely or latino workers ride bikes doesn’t make a useful soundbite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DC has given an exemption to traffic rules for bicyclists. An exemption they dont get in MD or VA. It may be legal but that doesn't mean it is either right or good policy.

Only someone who hasn't ridden a bike in 30+ years would post this. Physics is your friend, on a bike.

No. Just somebody that walks a lot and has had orders of magnitude more close calls with bicyclists than drivers.

I guess you do all of your walking on the Capital Crescent Trail?

Nope. Downtown. Ward 2 to be specific.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

You could get a permit for one car to drive per cookout. Sounds good to me. No it’s not zion but it is a park in an urban area, which makes preserving it even more precious.

I'm sure it sounds great to you, because it doesn't create any burden for you. Imposing burdens on other people is one of the easiest things in the world to do.

right, like cars do ALL THE TIME. you want to make the comparative negative externality argument on cars v bikes v pedestrians, let’s go.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:From what I've seen, Hains Point is a pretty popular location for African-American families to have cookouts, usually involving a fair number of people of all ages (from little kids to seniors). Banning cars in this park would make those types of gatherings very difficult, if not impossible.

I'm guessing the people in favor of the ban on cars don't care about that.

Or park and walk? It’s not that hard to figure out a way for everyone to use the space safely. You just don’t need to be able to drive 100% of the park.

And carry all your food, chairs, grills and other stuff you need for a large family barbecue? While dragging little kids and trying to get seniors with mobility issues from the car to the picnic area?

Hains Point isn't Zion or Glacier National Park. People use it for different things, many of which require people to drive into the park. But, I sense there's a disconnect here between people coming from NW to use the park, versus people coming from SE or NE.

36% of households in DC don't own a car. Also, car ownership is highest in Ward 3 and lowest in Ward 8. Just saying.