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DC Public and Public Charter Schools
Ax vs Ask
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Anonymous
I don't think I agree that an accent is a mispronunciation. |
Anonymous
Try to keep up here, it's not that hard. The black PP wrote that she pulled her child out of public school because her child's teacher spoke AAVE--and she very reasonably determined that she wanted a teacher who knew to speak, and would model proper, standard English. Not that she wouldn't speak AAVE; that her child's teacher spoke it. If you want to fling baseless charges of racism around as some sort of therapeutic tool, or substitute for rational argument, you may wish to start with her. By your logic, she's clearly "acting white" out of self-focused racism. |
Anonymous
That is why there are quotation marks around it. The "mispronunciations" are not mispronunciations, of course, in Australian English or AAVE, but they're not the way the word would be pronounced in standard American English. |
Anonymous
| What does AAVE mean? TIA |
Anonymous
African American Vernacular English http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_American_Vernacular_English |
Anonymous
NP here. It is certainly true that a person, regardless of race, might not be racist and would be less concerned about the white teacher with the Boston accent than the black teacher who says "ax." But that person would also likely be responding to a social norm in society at large that it is much more low-class to say "ax" than to say "cah" because that is something that low-income blacks say and, let's face it, people of all races are more fearful of blacks than of white Bostonians. I believe that that may be the pp's point. That one may not personally be racist but it is important to recognize that the norms that are driving this debate are based on a clear racial stratification. |
Anonymous
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17:28- Thank you, that's the exact point I was making.
However, I think the PP you quoted (who is insisting that since I say there's a possible racial slant to the "aks vs cah" issue, I must also think that black people who don't like/speak AAVE are self-hating and "acting white") isn't really looking for real discussion. |
Anonymous
We're going to have to agree to disagree because pseudo-scholarly research notwithstanding, a lot of people find "ax" to be a mispronunciation. |
Anonymous
It's not called conducting "pseudo-scholarly research," it's called linguistics. It's sad that you show your disagreement with something by denying its legitimacy. That's not the way educated adults approach a debate, but perhaps I'm wrong for assuming that you're educated. |
Anonymous
It's ironic that you are scolding another on the way "educated adults debate" yet in the same sentence resort to a veiled ad hominem attack. Nice. |
Anonymous
I'd say There's nothing veiled about it and I'd call it a direct response. |
Anonymous
10:14 is correct, it's not a veiled attack, I'll say it directly- it's highly doubtful that you are educated (or well-educated) if your approach to something you don't agree with is to deny its legitimacy, when a quick Google search will lead you to several well-researched, well-written scholarly articles and Google book previews on the subject. |
Anonymous
I understand this, and don't disagree. But, again, "ax" isn't the equivalent of "cah". It's the equivalent of "youse guys". And the PP's histrionic accusations of racism hinge on whether one would totally accept a teacher saying "youse guys" while finding "axe" unacceptable--which is a position cut entirely from whole cloth. In other words, no one has offered it. Regardless off what sorts of racist boogeymen might be lurking in PPs imagination, I find both unacceptable in a professional educator. As far as social stratification--which I feel is the proper framing--yes, that does play into it. Just as it's inappropriate to go to a job interview--or to come to school--dressed in cut-offs and daisy-dukes, it's also inappropriate for the educational authority figure to use such language, and rather than trying to change it, to hold it up as just an example of an alternative dialect. Many of these inner-city kids struggle with enough issues without further disadvantaging them. Some of these social norms may be marginally unfair, but by pretending that they don't exist helps no one. |
Anonymous
That's okay. Let's just pretend these social norms don't exist. After all, it's better to bolster some teacher's self-esteem even if it might narrow the life options of the schoolchildren they're supposed to be teaching. All you DCUM racists out there are free to disagree with me. |
Anonymous
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10:14 is correct, it's not a veiled attack, I'll say it directly- it's highly doubtful that you are educated (or well-educated) if your approach to something you don't agree with is to deny its legitimacy, when a quick Google search will lead you to several well-researched, well-written scholarly articles and Google book previews on the subject.
8:44 here - I'm not the poster to whom you directed your ad hominem attack, just a virtual pedestrian who noted the contradiction in your post. That you feel it appropriate to attack someone personally while scolding them on their own argument technique is distasteful, and that you embrace personal attacks is troubling. Education is not a substitute for civility. |