Stay at TT or Retire to Suburbs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

Because grade deflation and competition against the best leads to better applicants. Getting a 4.3 at a public for mouth breathing doesn’t bring out the best. A 1500 isn’t that impressive now that the SAT has been dumbed down and inflated.

[Anonymous]

Scarsdale is an excellent choice if your kid wants Cornell. https://scarsdale10583.com/section-table/278-events/11599-class-of-2025-off-to-college-where-they-are-headed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Scarsdale is an excellent choice if your kid wants Cornell. https://scarsdale10583.com/section-table/278-events/11599-class-of-2025-off-to-college-where-they-are-headed

I also see Harvard, Princeton, Yale, MIT, Dartmouth, Duke, Penn, etc.

And of course the only people who post here are summa cum laude HYPS grads who are kind enough to take a break from splitting atoms to grace us with their presence, so even Dartmouth, Duke, Penn, Cornell aren't good enough for their perfect children...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

Those college results sound really good! Which suburb was this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

That was my first post in this thread. My feelings about suburbs come from previously living in one - before we moved back to the city - and seeing the mediocrity and boredom firsthand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

That was my first post in this thread. My feelings about suburbs come from previously living in one - before we moved back to the city - and seeing the mediocrity and boredom firsthand.

Suburbs were better 30 years ago. Cities are safer and more vibrant now. Suburbs have gotten pricier and duller, complete ripoff

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

This kind of data is irrelevant today. When I was high school age, my kid's private sent 10 percent of the class to Princeton alone. Admissions has changed a ton. Upper middle class wealthy suburbs don't place as well as they use to, and are still behind private schools. Now it seems low income publics and rural publics are competitive with wealthy publics because of institutional priorites like pell grant eligible and first gen. With grade inflation high, colleges seem to be favoring schools with selective admissions, whether a public magnet or an independent private school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

exactly. the 4.0, 1500 kids with well curated EC - the suburb parents know how to play the game also. the top 5% is uber competitive. people make it out to be like a walk in the park

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

the suburbs of 30 years ago is not the suburbs of today. I went to Columbia in the mid 90s. It was not terribly difficult to get into from my above average suburban school. decent grades and test scores, captain of sports team, some okay EC. Today, that same results - even factoring in grade inflation and test score inflation - doesn't get me into a T25 school. Might not even get me into a t50 school.

[Anonymous]

Life is too short to live in suburbs if you don’t have to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

That was my first post in this thread. My feelings about suburbs come from previously living in one - before we moved back to the city - and seeing the mediocrity and boredom firsthand.

To add to this, both kids are in public school now, and while the class sizes are larger (which will no longer be the case for at least one of them next year), the kids are nicer - and generally smarter and more interesting - and while teachers are hit-and-miss, that was also very much the case in the suburban public we left, the curriculum and pedagogical choices seem a lot stronger (bigger district with more buying power and more staff to think about this stuff), there's much less reliance on screens, and the field trips are about 100x better

Since we missed COVID in the city I can't say I regret our time in the suburbs altogether, but if it hadn't been for that, I would, there's really very little upside - if it's important to you that your kid be surrounded by upper-middle-class peers, find a nice apartment on the UES or UWS and you can pretty much guarantee that for them until high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

That was my first post in this thread. My feelings about suburbs come from previously living in one - before we moved back to the city - and seeing the mediocrity and boredom firsthand.

To add to this, both kids are in public school now, and while the class sizes are larger (which will no longer be the case for at least one of them next year), the kids are nicer - and generally smarter and more interesting - and while teachers are hit-and-miss, that was also very much the case in the suburban public we left, the curriculum and pedagogical choices seem a lot stronger (bigger district with more buying power and more staff to think about this stuff), there's much less reliance on screens, and the field trips are about 100x better

Since we missed COVID in the city I can't say I regret our time in the suburbs altogether, but if it hadn't been for that, I would, there's really very little upside - if it's important to you that your kid be surrounded by upper-middle-class peers, find a nice apartment on the UES or UWS and you can pretty much guarantee that for them until high school.

are your kids in suburban public now? or NYC Publics?
It's not clear the point you are making

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:After thinking through and reading everyone's posts the conclusion I reach is that a student who has the goods to get into HYP from a TT will also do so from a good public. However the value of the TT is insurance for if the student is not one of those select few because it's really not possible to tell until the start of high school how truly academically gifted / capable a student is. The insurance is a multiples higher odds of admission into T10s through T25s compared to the even best publics. Is this broadly accurate?

Eh not exactly. Many get counseled out of the TTs, either they did not want to engage with material at a high level, they got burnt out being around very accomplished peers, or they were not up to snuff from the get go. If you have the drive to get through a TT and get into a T10-T25 college, you have the drive to have a 4.3 at a strong public through grade grubbing and get into a good college.

At most "strong suburban" publics, maybe top 5 percent of the class has a shot at a T25, they rarely get kids into all 8 Ivies and Stanford in a given year.

Yea but that top 5% just isn't that impressive.

How would you know? They likely all have SAT scores above 1500 and 4.0s as grade inflation is rampant in public schools. Your kid may not necessarily stick out and will probably be competing against some kids with more interesting life stories.

Also worth noting that living in the suburbs may itself be a detriment to your kid's college resume, particularly if they're not a star athlete - lot fewer opportunities to do interesting stuff in Westport than the Upper West Side.

The ignorant suburb hating here is comical. Times have changed but I went to a very good (but not the best) suburban public and we routinely got 30+ kids (out of about 350) into Ivy+ schools. And another 30 into the next tier (Emory, WashU, UVA, Michigan, Tufts, etc). Meanwhile, since it was public, there were plenty of kids who went to community college, military, etc. To fairly compare them, you are basically just looking at the top of the class, not percentages. My HS graduated people who have gone on to do world class medical research at Harvard/Yale, Ivy League professors, federal judges, run gigantic hedge funds, A-list actors, lead top NY law firms, professional athletes, etc.

And there are plenty of opportunities to do great things in the suburbs. Most sports are better. Community service is community service. Big hospitals. You can do anything in the summer, including commuting into the city from many places. I know a number of kids in NJ who interned at the many top pharma firms in the state. The poster I am responding to cited Westport, which is an easy drive to Yale as well as to hedge funds, etc. in Greenwich. And colleges are smart enough to recognize all of this.

But I'm sure the suburb haters (particularly the one super ignorant troll) will refuse to admit there is anything decent with the suburbs and they are totally inferior. The world is not that black and white.

That was my first post in this thread. My feelings about suburbs come from previously living in one - before we moved back to the city - and seeing the mediocrity and boredom firsthand.

To add to this, both kids are in public school now, and while the class sizes are larger (which will no longer be the case for at least one of them next year), the kids are nicer - and generally smarter and more interesting - and while teachers are hit-and-miss, that was also very much the case in the suburban public we left, the curriculum and pedagogical choices seem a lot stronger (bigger district with more buying power and more staff to think about this stuff), there's much less reliance on screens, and the field trips are about 100x better

Since we missed COVID in the city I can't say I regret our time in the suburbs altogether, but if it hadn't been for that, I would, there's really very little upside - if it's important to you that your kid be surrounded by upper-middle-class peers, find a nice apartment on the UES or UWS and you can pretty much guarantee that for them until high school.

are your kids in suburban public now? or NYC Publics?
It's not clear the point you are making

Sorry, NYC. (I was adding to my own previous post)