Stay at TT or Retire to Suburbs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

Based on my experience there, I think you are off by half. The pool of high performing kids is likely close to one third of the class - somewhere between 100 and 150.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

Honest question, are APs really that hard? I remember it was mostly memorization and knew plenty of kids who just took a test after self study and got 5's.

[Anonymous]

Yes, they all use Singapore and that’s the problem. It emphasizes things like “number sense” and the “concept” of numbers vs the rote memorization that we learned. Imagine learning how to read by thinking about the letter B for a few years or learning to read music by describing a note in words. Turns out 97 percent of the kids in singapore go to “cram” schools where they learn math the way we were taught and that’s why their math scores are so high. It’s why everyone does Kumon or Russian math outside of school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, I have not been impressed with my kid’s TT lower/midlle school education, everyone tutors and I don’t think it’s to keep up, it’s because of the quality of the teachers and curriculum. The math is very bad, and I had to teach my kid grammar with amazon workbooks. Just to say, it’s all a crapshoot.

Very interesting, would love to know which school

Why is the math so bad? Don’t they all use Singapore math

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes, they all use Singapore and that’s the problem. It emphasizes things like “number sense” and the “concept” of numbers vs the rote memorization that we learned. Imagine learning how to read by thinking about the letter B for a few years or learning to read music by describing a note in words. Turns out 97 percent of the kids in singapore go to “cram” schools where they learn math the way we were taught and that’s why their math scores are so high. It’s why everyone does Kumon or Russian math outside of school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, I have not been impressed with my kid’s TT lower/midlle school education, everyone tutors and I don’t think it’s to keep up, it’s because of the quality of the teachers and curriculum. The math is very bad, and I had to teach my kid grammar with amazon workbooks. Just to say, it’s all a crapshoot.

Very interesting, would love to know which school

Why is the math so bad? Don’t they all use Singapore math

Eh, my kid is at a TT, had Singapore math with zero supplementation, and she’s a very good math student. Of course, we didn’t care if she was able to do algebra by 5th grade like some of the tiger parents (the school’s pace was good with us), and she will end up in MV calculus by graduation, which is fine for her goals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, they all use Singapore and that’s the problem. It emphasizes things like “number sense” and the “concept” of numbers vs the rote memorization that we learned. Imagine learning how to read by thinking about the letter B for a few years or learning to read music by describing a note in words. Turns out 97 percent of the kids in singapore go to “cram” schools where they learn math the way we were taught and that’s why their math scores are so high. It’s why everyone does Kumon or Russian math outside of school.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:FWIW, I have not been impressed with my kid’s TT lower/midlle school education, everyone tutors and I don’t think it’s to keep up, it’s because of the quality of the teachers and curriculum. The math is very bad, and I had to teach my kid grammar with amazon workbooks. Just to say, it’s all a crapshoot.

Very interesting, would love to know which school

Why is the math so bad? Don’t they all use Singapore math

Eh, my kid is at a TT, had Singapore math with zero supplementation, and she’s a very good math student. Of course, we didn’t care if she was able to do algebra by 5th grade like some of the tiger parents (the school’s pace was good with us), and she will end up in MV calculus by graduation, which is fine for her goals.

Does her goals involve majoring in math, physics, electrical engineering or comp sci?

[Anonymous]

I want my kids to have the option to pursue careers in engineering, etc, if that is what they want to do. To do that, you need a solid math ed. It’s ridiculous how everyone crunches the stats of where these kids get into college and doesn’t seem to care if they are prepared to do well once they are there. I actually now advise people to get outside math assessments at the end of every year to make sure there kid is actually on track, and by on track, I mean meeting the national average.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I want my kids to have the option to pursue careers in engineering, etc, if that is what they want to do. To do that, you need a solid math ed. It’s ridiculous how everyone crunches the stats of where these kids get into college and doesn’t seem to care if they are prepared to do well once they are there. I actually now advise people to get outside math assessments at the end of every year to make sure there kid is actually on track, and by on track, I mean meeting the national average.

You do realize that a lot of kids who do engineering and lead a very successful life (though not up to the esteemed standards of NYC TT parents) are alums of very average high schools in suburban flyover country who then go to the excellent engineering programs at schools like Illinois, Purdue, NC State, etc. that you ridicule one of your "friends" for letting their child attend. These are kids who probably take AB Calc their senior year of HS but end up doing great. Engineering isn't just MIT, Cal Tech, Penn M&T, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

But it is probably the same kid regardless if the student studied at Princeton hs or at a private school. Both places give enough opportunity that the top motivated nerds can make it to Princeton from either

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

But it is probably the same kid regardless if the student studied at Princeton hs or at a private school. Both places give enough opportunity that the top motivated nerds can make it to Princeton from either

The opportunity is there in both places but the math shows the odds are much better at a TT Private . (although Princeton from Princeton might be the exception) -

If you disagree with that statement then the whole discussion point is pointless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

But it is probably the same kid regardless if the student studied at Princeton hs or at a private school. Both places give enough opportunity that the top motivated nerds can make it to Princeton from either

The opportunity is there in both places but the math shows the odds are much better at a TT Private . (although Princeton from Princeton might be the exception) -

If you disagree with that statement then the whole discussion point is pointless.

Not sure. Princeton wants the students it wants. If those students decide to go to Princeton HS or elsewhere instead of an elite nyc private, Princeton still wants them. If Princeton doesn't get them, their competitors will.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

But it is probably the same kid regardless if the student studied at Princeton hs or at a private school. Both places give enough opportunity that the top motivated nerds can make it to Princeton from either

The opportunity is there in both places but the math shows the odds are much better at a TT Private . (although Princeton from Princeton might be the exception) -

If you disagree with that statement then the whole discussion point is pointless.

Princeton from Princeton isn’t the exception, most are faculty kids. There are also faculty kids who are rejected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Back to op’s original question. Op, you seem to have a belief that your kids will have a better chance of attending a T10 coming from Princeton High than your private, because you think the class will be less competitive. Last year, Princeton high school had 371 AP scholars (students who scored at least a 3 on three or more ap tests). Assuming this number is spread equally among sophomores, juniors and seniors (since freshman won’t have data)meven though more likely to be concentrated among juniors and seniors, that’s one hundred and twenty kids per class that will be gunning for highly selective colleges.
Further, 84 kids applied to Princeton U from Princeton High two years ago. https://www.towntopics.com/2025/10/29/matriculation-report-helps-phs-counselors-discover-student-trends/ That is roughly the number of kids who think they are Ivy level applicants, the number is maybe 30 kids at my kid’s private.
19 of those kids were accepted which seems like a huge number. But we know that three quarters will usually be faculty kids. Let’s assume only two thirds are faculty kids. That’s assume only one other kid is hooked in any way, also probably an underestimate. That gives us an unhooked acceptance rate to Princeton from Princeton High of 7 percent. You can compare that to your current school, but my guess is that they are similar. Princeton High sends zero to two kids to other Ivies and about 3 to 5 to Cornell. That isn’t better than my private, and the pool of competitive applicants at Princeton High is at least twice as large.

So it’s a nice place to live and you should give it a try if you want a suburb with a high quality of life. But don’t move because you think it will improve your kid’s odds of getting into an Ivy, it won’t do that.

Thank you for this well thought out post. I think we would make the move if we felt that we weren't hurting the quality of our kids' education (it's bad enough that they would have to say goodbye to many close and good friends). Princeton is somewhat unique because there does seem to be a very well-qualified pool of undergrads who are active in tutoring local kids. So we don't expect any issues in terms of supplementing to make up for any not so great teachers when that occurs. We expect the peer set to lean more towards STEM which actually we welcome.

With regards to colleges, I agree with the 7% you backed into for Princeton specifically. Thank you for sharing the AP Scholar stat as I wasn't aware of it before and it's a very instructive metric. With that said I think the kids who are really in the running for Ivy's are going to be in the range of 8 to 10 AP's and are going to need all 5's. From a base of let's say 180 AP scholars per class I feels plausible (but this is a total guess) that maybe half or less are in that category. So let's call this a base of 90 kids in the true "AP crowd". Excluding the 15 or so hooked seniors who matriculate to Princeton each year, it gets to something like 20 to 25 kids going to Ivies, Stanford, MIT, Duke and UChicago out of a base of 75. That's not so bad if the assumptions I've made aren't just completely off. We're also double legacy at a mid-range Ivy and are pretty certain applying ED from Princeton High will be a lot more meaningful than doing that coming out of our current TT. But who knows is legacy is evening going to be a thing in 10 to 15 years.

All this is to say that we think (whether correctly or incorrectly) that Princeton public has comparable and certainly not worse matriculation odds than any other non-magnet (e.g. Bergen County Academies) public. We also think that it will in fact be less competitive academically than our current TT. So in our minds it's kind of a wash from a college exmissions perspective.

In terms of rigor and how competitive things are academically, if given the choice between the type of writing that's demanded from TT classes vs. scoring well in a rote AP test I think it's way easier (though far less beneficial educationally) to ace the AP test. Our biggest concern is that the kids truly do lose something in the teaching approach that a school like Princeton high is forced to structurally take compared to the discussion and Socratic? approach that can be offered by top privates. We could of course apply to Lawrenceville or boarding school later but we view that as applying to a worse version of where we are already at with exmissions being more competitive relative to Princeton public.

I invite everyone to please poke holes and ruthlessly tell me where I am completely wrong in all of this.

Ap scholar is three or more aps with no upper limit. The three is a minimum. And in fact there was 695 kids enrolled in ap classes at Princeton that year. So I think you continue to underestimate the number of kids operating at a high level.

exactly - to think that these 700 kids (even if it's like 250 per graduating class) aren't going to be shooting for Top 50 schools. it's gonna be very competitive. Outside of Princeton U - is harvard really going to take 15 kids out of a class of 500? they will take 3 kids out of a class of 100 at a TT.

But it is probably the same kid regardless if the student studied at Princeton hs or at a private school. Both places give enough opportunity that the top motivated nerds can make it to Princeton from either

The opportunity is there in both places but the math shows the odds are much better at a TT Private . (although Princeton from Princeton might be the exception) -

If you disagree with that statement then the whole discussion point is pointless.

Not sure. Princeton wants the students it wants. If those students decide to go to Princeton HS or elsewhere instead of an elite nyc private, Princeton still wants them. If Princeton doesn't get them, their competitors will.

A student with the same exact scores and ECs holds very different odds coming from South Dakota, HM, Princeton, or inner city Chicago. Princeton wants the students it wants and those students are not fungible

[Anonymous]

I wrote the thing about wanting my kids to be able to be engineers if they want, and I am well aware of the kids from a flyover state having been one myself at one of these schools. It’s why the way they teach math in a TT concerns me because I fully believe there are plenty of kids outside a few private schools in New York City who are just as smart as the kids in them and if they are being taught math the way I was taught, they are going to kick my kids ass because it’s a music better way of teaching it. You can boost an SAT scores in math but you can’t fake it in the classroom. It’s why 97 percent of kids in singapore do outside tutoring of traditional math at a “cram” school. I’d prefer just the “cram” school.