What is it with people given childless couples unsolicited fertility advice?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

People give you advice because it seems you need it.

If you didnt want kids that would be one thing. But if youre in your mid 30s and want kids but are holding out because you think your income is too low then you are making a very poor decision.

Wanting kids under certain conditions is not making poor decisions, it's prioritizing other things that in OP's case seem to be her lifrstyle. You seem to lack the ability to see naunce, or to be in a position to not understand how can people have priorities other than children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:That’s not what you wrote in previous posts. And I find it really hard to believe relative strangers are walking up to you and randomly going “hey, you’re old, you might want to worry about infirtility”.

I don't remember writing that, but the point is, the fertility conversation starts as soon as they learn I don't have kids. By your logic I shouldn't tell them that at all. You'd be surprised at how nosy some people can get. These are acquaintances/relatives I rarely see, hence the "relative strangers" part.

NP here. I was just at a family event where my relatives, some I hadn’t seen in a long time, had lots of questions for my senior in high school. They didn’t get that the college process is something that some kids like to play close to the vest to deal with their emotions around potential rejection and making one of their biggest decisions to date. I realized that in general most of the all the relatives are nosy and has had unsolicited advice for every step of life, dating, marriage, kids, kids schooling, job you name it. I am not sure of the motivation - is it cultural and expected, is it because life was likely very difficult for them and they had to depend on each other and they want to feel like their advice is helpful.

But what I realized is that no one truly has life worked out - every one of the relatives giving advice has made a series of choices and decisions that led down different roads, both happiness and sadness. Some choices may have been partly due to the era of their times so I can’t say if I wouldn’t have made the same decisions. And even if they were making those same decisions today they might not make the same choices I would make. It’s hard because you can’t have the real conversations about the trade offs and sacrifice and if in today’s world they would have done the same. But then again, maybe the point of unsolicited advice is for the person giving it to feel as though it is creating a bond, and looking for respect and/or validation of their choices rather than giving you a perspective (both the good and the bad) with space for you to make your own decisions that could be different than theirs.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:This thread is full of the unsolicited advice that OP is not asking for. And what's more, SHE KNOWS ALL OF THIS.

She knows how old she is. She knows what IVF costs. She knows about egg donation, surrogates, all of it. She knows that her husband can up and leave her and have kids with someone else. She has taken all of this knowledge, weighed it against her desire to have children, and decided on the risk that she's comfortable with.

You're all being extremely patronizing.

BS. I don't buy for a second that OP is "comfortable with" her decisions. She would not be so oversensitive about people's commentary if she were.

Obviously, otherwise this thread would not exist and she’d tell people she didn’t want kids!

But she tells people that's none of their business and leaves it at that. You guys don't seem you know how to read, or are simply making scenarios in your heads.

“I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.”

Based on the above nobody is badgering her. Different people are (very casually) making conversation with her over time. Everybody in the whole world is supposed to know she’s sensitive about this conversation, apparently. The world revolves around her.

"Hi Jane. How are you doing? You just turned 35? You gotta have children soon because your fertility is waning?"

That's how it sounds based on what OP said. They're not badgering her, but they go straight to the fertility talk. Would you appreciate it if someone you barely knew started giving you sex advice or weight lose advice? Probably not.

If I told people I was trying to lose weight and they gave me basic batch 101 common sense advice like go to the gym, watch what you eat, cut your sugars, no, obviously, I would not get offended???

Where does OP say thst she tells ppl she wants kids. She says they start with the comments when they learn she doesn't have kids. Read the first post please.

Most people know most married couples want children. It is, in fact, true of OP. They are correct in surmising that and are doing what they perceive to be helpful to someone who perhaps appears ambivalent. Nothing more, nothing less. It. Is. Not. Personal.

[Anonymous]

at my age, I might have troubles conceiving

You sound dumb. If they care about you, they may be trying to knock some sense into you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

People give you advice because it seems you need it.

If you didnt want kids that would be one thing. But if youre in your mid 30s and want kids but are holding out because you think your income is too low then you are making a very poor decision.

Wanting kids under certain conditions is not making poor decisions, it's prioritizing other things that in OP's case seem to be her lifrstyle. You seem to lack the ability to see naunce, or to be in a position to not understand how can people have priorities other than children.

What is going to happen in the next few years, before she ages out, to make OP think she can afford kids? If the answer is "nothing", she doesn't want kids. Cool! "I don't want kids." End of conversation, or keep repeating it. If the answer is "I might get a pay raise"....really? That's going to shift you from not wanting kids to wanting kids? No. C'mon. The effect of having kids on your life is enormous. Positive and negative! It's not going to be *that* different because of any financial changes that are actually likely to happen to OP in the next few years, unless there's a possible massive inheritance she hasn't mentioned. That's what people are picking up on.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread is full of the unsolicited advice that OP is not asking for. And what's more, SHE KNOWS ALL OF THIS.

She knows how old she is. She knows what IVF costs. She knows about egg donation, surrogates, all of it. She knows that her husband can up and leave her and have kids with someone else. She has taken all of this knowledge, weighed it against her desire to have children, and decided on the risk that she's comfortable with.

You're all being extremely patronizing.

BS. I don't buy for a second that OP is "comfortable with" her decisions. She would not be so oversensitive about people's commentary if she were.

Obviously, otherwise this thread would not exist and she’d tell people she didn’t want kids!

But she tells people that's none of their business and leaves it at that. You guys don't seem you know how to read, or are simply making scenarios in your heads.

“I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.”

Based on the above nobody is badgering her. Different people are (very casually) making conversation with her over time. Everybody in the whole world is supposed to know she’s sensitive about this conversation, apparently. The world revolves around her.

"Hi Jane. How are you doing? You just turned 35? You gotta have children soon because your fertility is waning?"

That's how it sounds based on what OP said. They're not badgering her, but they go straight to the fertility talk. Would you appreciate it if someone you barely knew started giving you sex advice or weight lose advice? Probably not.

If I told people I was trying to lose weight and they gave me basic batch 101 common sense advice like go to the gym, watch what you eat, cut your sugars, no, obviously, I would not get offended???

Where does OP say thst she tells ppl she wants kids. She says they start with the comments when they learn she doesn't have kids. Read the first post please.

Most people know most married couples want children. It is, in fact, true of OP. They are correct in surmising that and are doing what they perceive to be helpful to someone who perhaps appears ambivalent. Nothing more, nothing less. It. Is. Not. Personal.

Most people know that most married couples want to have sex, should we start giving advice on erectile dysfunction to ageing couples?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

People give you advice because it seems you need it.

If you didnt want kids that would be one thing. But if youre in your mid 30s and want kids but are holding out because you think your income is too low then you are making a very poor decision.

Wanting kids under certain conditions is not making poor decisions, it's prioritizing other things that in OP's case seem to be her lifrstyle. You seem to lack the ability to see naunce, or to be in a position to not understand how can people have priorities other than children.

What is going to happen in the next few years, before she ages out, to make OP think she can afford kids? If the answer is "nothing", she doesn't want kids. Cool! "I don't want kids." End of conversation, or keep repeating it. If the answer is "I might get a pay raise"....really? That's going to shift you from not wanting kids to wanting kids? No. C'mon. The effect of having kids on your life is enormous. Positive and negative! It's not going to be *that* different because of any financial changes that are actually likely to happen to OP in the next few years, unless there's a possible massive inheritance she hasn't mentioned. That's what people are picking up on.

Which is why OP said the will not have k8ds if things for her don't change. You guys are the ones obsessed with the possibility that she might be childless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

at my age, I might have troubles conceiving

You sound dumb. If they care about you, they may be trying to knock some sense into you

You sound obtuse. OP is taking a risk because she only wants kids under specific circumstances. Having other priorities than kids is not being dumb. Doing what most posters do here is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This thread is full of the unsolicited advice that OP is not asking for. And what's more, SHE KNOWS ALL OF THIS.

She knows how old she is. She knows what IVF costs. She knows about egg donation, surrogates, all of it. She knows that her husband can up and leave her and have kids with someone else. She has taken all of this knowledge, weighed it against her desire to have children, and decided on the risk that she's comfortable with.

You're all being extremely patronizing.

BS. I don't buy for a second that OP is "comfortable with" her decisions. She would not be so oversensitive about people's commentary if she were.

Obviously, otherwise this thread would not exist and she’d tell people she didn’t want kids!

But she tells people that's none of their business and leaves it at that. You guys don't seem you know how to read, or are simply making scenarios in your heads.

“I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.”

Based on the above nobody is badgering her. Different people are (very casually) making conversation with her over time. Everybody in the whole world is supposed to know she’s sensitive about this conversation, apparently. The world revolves around her.

"Hi Jane. How are you doing? You just turned 35? You gotta have children soon because your fertility is waning?"

That's how it sounds based on what OP said. They're not badgering her, but they go straight to the fertility talk. Would you appreciate it if someone you barely knew started giving you sex advice or weight lose advice? Probably not.

If I told people I was trying to lose weight and they gave me basic batch 101 common sense advice like go to the gym, watch what you eat, cut your sugars, no, obviously, I would not get offended???

Where does OP say thst she tells ppl she wants kids. She says they start with the comments when they learn she doesn't have kids. Read the first post please.

Most people know most married couples want children. It is, in fact, true of OP. They are correct in surmising that and are doing what they perceive to be helpful to someone who perhaps appears ambivalent. Nothing more, nothing less. It. Is. Not. Personal.

Most people know that most married couples want to have sex, should we start giving advice on erectile dysfunction to ageing couples?

Wrong—Most people don’t want to think about old people having sex at all. They do, however, think quite happily on young wed couples cooing over their first long-awaited baby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also fwiw, babies don’t require very much. People are obsessed thinking a baby means a big house, a car, tons of material things. The first year, the biggest expense you actually need is diapers. (Outside of childcare of course.) but people go nuts thinking they need all kinds of things they just don’t.

Daycare can easily cost 15K a year. Moving from a one bedroom apartment to an available two bedroom one can easily be an extra 1K a month. That's already 25K extra a year, not to mention increased bills, reduced working hours if you don't have a 9 to 5 job and need to take care of your child outside that timeframe. Not sure if that's OPs case, but children can easily become a financial disaster if you're not a high earner. People who got help or who make a decent salary relative to their area's cost of living don't seem to realize this.

You don't need a 2br apartment with kids. I know plenty of people who went 2+ years in a 1br apartment and didn't have issues. Americans generally are nuts about living space.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

People give you advice because it seems you need it.

If you didnt want kids that would be one thing. But if youre in your mid 30s and want kids but are holding out because you think your income is too low then you are making a very poor decision.

Wanting kids under certain conditions is not making poor decisions, it's prioritizing other things that in OP's case seem to be her lifrstyle. You seem to lack the ability to see naunce, or to be in a position to not understand how can people have priorities other than children.

What is going to happen in the next few years, before she ages out, to make OP think she can afford kids? If the answer is "nothing", she doesn't want kids. Cool! "I don't want kids." End of conversation, or keep repeating it. If the answer is "I might get a pay raise"....really? That's going to shift you from not wanting kids to wanting kids? No. C'mon. The effect of having kids on your life is enormous. Positive and negative! It's not going to be *that* different because of any financial changes that are actually likely to happen to OP in the next few years, unless there's a possible massive inheritance she hasn't mentioned. That's what people are picking up on.

Which is why OP said the will not have k8ds if things for her don't change. You guys are the ones obsessed with the possibility that she might be childless.

Then all she has to do is say "I don't want kids." Pause. Repeat it if they keep going.

[Anonymous]

I personally had this issue in the middle of our infertility journey. The moment I started telling too much (IMO) people shut up, thankfully. Once you tell them you've lost 5 pregnancies they get the clue to not ask.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

It’s just something people say because they can’t comprehend why you don’t have children. That said, if you really want kids my advice would be to not wait for the prefect moment. We ended up spending over $100k on IVF and adoption fees.

OP here. Nobody needs to understand anything. If you learn a person doesn't have children is not your place to start giving them fertility advice when you don't even know the reason why the person is childless. I know that IVF is expensive. I also know that if I leave children for later I might not be able to conceive at all. I literally say this in the post you're quoting.

Oh please then don’t spend your Saturday posting about fertility!

Says the person spending their Saturday replying to me.

We are not the ones triggered by fertility discussions.

Seems like you were triggered enough to reply and to even give me advice.

I’m not the one who started a thread on the topic luv. Just giving you some solicited advice.

Not OP, but your advice wasn't solicited at all. OP never asked if she should get pregnant., SHe already knows her answer.

But she also tells people she *wants* kids at some later point in time. At 36. And so poor she still isn’t out of the hole after 4 years of marriage beginning at 32. Her desires are incongruous with reality. Or perhaps she is not being honest with herself, because she can’t actually actively want kids and be on the path she is on.

Maybe she’s so cagey because she’s not being honest with herself. She actually doesn’t want kids, and thinks saying “she’s not financially ready” is the socially (even to herself) acceptable answer.

You seem to be living in a bubble. Most people aren't making anywhere close to a six figure income. An individual salary of less than 60K is actually average across the country. This is not a hole for most Americans, this is their reality. Wanting two things at the same time, a comfortable lifestyle and children, and not being able to have them both isn't dishonesty. She already mentioned she wants kids but is willing to risk not having them, and that the only thing she wanted to know is why people are so nosy. You are the one making assumptions about OP because you seen unable to leave your bubble or to think in a way that's not black and white, which comes as both ignorant and extremely arrogant.

It is when you’re 36, sorry, but it is. Of course there is nuance involved and not black and white. A 26 year old can honestly want the bolded, a 36 year old is if not dishonest, totally oblivious to the facts of the situation. And if she’s willing to take suc a huge risk, the honest answer would be that having kids isn’t all that important. Which, if it’s nobody’s business, she doesn’t have to tell. Who cares why people are nosy? You gotta deal with reality as it is.

Here are the median earnings by age group according to BLS: https://www.forbes.com/advisor/business/average-salary-by-age/
It's 63,596 for those in the 35-44 age range. If OP is in the high 50s she's still within the average range statistically, so yes, you're living in a bubble.
Now let me ask you, if you see yourself in a situation where you're both hungry and thirsty but only have enough money for either food or water, does that mean that one of them isn't important? No it simply means that you are constrained and need to make a choice, but you're unaware of this because you're in a bubble and with your head far up your a$$.

And yet 85% of all women eventually have children, which must include the majority of below average earning ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm 36 and husband is 34. We got married four years ago and still have no children because our financial situation isn't great at the moment. When people learn we're childless, they start making comments about how I shouldn't delay motherhood or at least freeze my eggs. The most infuriating things is that these people aren't even close family members or friends, they're acquaintances or some uncle/cousin I haven't seen in more than 10 years. I let them know that there's no reason to bring up the topic and leave it at that, but there's almost always somebody else who brings it later.

I'm aware that at my age, I might have troubles conceiving, especially if I have undiagnosed fertility issues, but the other option is having a baby that we won't able to support, so we're willing to risk it.

Why are some people so obsessed with the fertility of a couple whose kids they're not gonna raise or financially support?

It’s just something people say because they can’t comprehend why you don’t have children. That said, if you really want kids my advice would be to not wait for the prefect moment. We ended up spending over $100k on IVF and adoption fees.

OP here. Nobody needs to understand anything. If you learn a person doesn't have children is not your place to start giving them fertility advice when you don't even know the reason why the person is childless. I know that IVF is expensive. I also know that if I leave children for later I might not be able to conceive at all. I literally say this in the post you're quoting.

Oh please then don’t spend your Saturday posting about fertility!

Says the person spending their Saturday replying to me.

We are not the ones triggered by fertility discussions.

Seems like you were triggered enough to reply and to even give me advice.

I’m not the one who started a thread on the topic luv. Just giving you some solicited advice.

Not OP, but your advice wasn't solicited at all. OP never asked if she should get pregnant., SHe already knows her answer.

But she also tells people she *wants* kids at some later point in time. At 36. And so poor she still isn’t out of the hole after 4 years of marriage beginning at 32. Her desires are incongruous with reality. Or perhaps she is not being honest with herself, because she can’t actually actively want kids and be on the path she is on.

Maybe she’s so cagey because she’s not being honest with herself. She actually doesn’t want kids, and thinks saying “she’s not financially ready” is the socially (even to herself) acceptable answer.

You seem to be living in a bubble. Most people aren't making anywhere close to a six figure income. An individual salary of less than 60K is actually average across the country. This is not a hole for most Americans, this is their reality. Wanting two things at the same time, a comfortable lifestyle and children, and not being able to have them both isn't dishonesty. She already mentioned she wants kids but is willing to risk not having them, and that the only thing she wanted to know is why people are so nosy. You are the one making assumptions about OP because you seen unable to leave your bubble or to think in a way that's not black and white, which comes as both ignorant and extremely arrogant.

It is when you’re 36, sorry, but it is. Of course there is nuance involved and not black and white. A 26 year old can honestly want the bolded, a 36 year old is if not dishonest, totally oblivious to the facts of the situation. And if she’s willing to take suc a huge risk, the honest answer would be that having kids isn’t all that important. Which, if it’s nobody’s business, she doesn’t have to tell. Who cares why people are nosy? You gotta deal with reality as it is.

Here are the median earnings by age group according to BLS: https://www.forbes.com/advisor/business/average-salary-by-age/
It's 63,596 for those in the 35-44 age range. If OP is in the high 50s she's still within the average range statistically, so yes, you're living in a bubble.
Now let me ask you, if you see yourself in a situation where you're both hungry and thirsty but only have enough money for either food or water, does that mean that one of them isn't important? No it simply means that you are constrained and need to make a choice, but you're unaware of this because you're in a bubble and with your head far up your a$$.

And yet 85% of all women eventually have children, which must include the majority of below average earning ones.

And many of these below average earning women have high earning husbands, no savings or living paycheck to paycheck. Not everyone aspires to live like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I personally had this issue in the middle of our infertility journey. The moment I started telling too much (IMO) people shut up, thankfully. Once you tell them you've lost 5 pregnancies they get the clue to not ask.

I'm in the same boat. Infertility makes people unfomfortable so I'm pretty honest about it.