Marylanders: Did you regret not choosing Virginia when it came time to apply to college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a professor (not at UVA or UMD) and I have to say that the UMD booster is a bit clueless as to what makes a university reputable for undergraduate education. The references to inventions/cultural icons are perhaps important to a few people, but not to the people who make decisions about a schools' reputation. Research dollars do matter in terms of a university's research status, but they tell very little about how good an undergraduate education a college provides. Most of these research dollars are for equipment and salaries for graduate and post-graduate researchers. In fact, one might reasonably argue that many second-tier research universities (like UMD) actually place LESS value undergraduate education because the faculty is rewarded for research, not for teaching. Think of the small liberal arts colleges--Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams, Wesleyan, Pomona--these are routinely regarded as best for undergraduate education.

But I digress. FWIW, I can think of few of my colleagues who would send their children to UMD above UVA.

Well said professor. Also the US Naval Academy and Johns Hopkins are not Maryland state colleges. So let's drop those from the conversation. As a VA resident, it isn't all about UVA either. What I like is the range of choices from the University of Mary Washington to Va Tech to U Va to U VA-Wise and everything in between. As for the notion that U Va takes a lot of out of state students that's a matter of perspective. They take 33% from the rest of the country and beyond. The standards for out of state students are higher than in state (which are already quite high if you live in NoVa) and they pay full tuition and board. There' s been a lot of misinformation and chest beating on this thread. But there's plenty of objective analysis out there setting the record straight.

I understand those who for political reasons may not want to live in Virginia. Those are the same reasons I don't live in Maryland. It's a wonderful state but not my preference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a professor (not at UVA or UMD) and I have to say that the UMD booster is a bit clueless as to what makes a university reputable for undergraduate education. The references to inventions/cultural icons are perhaps important to a few people, but not to the people who make decisions about a schools' reputation. Research dollars do matter in terms of a university's research status, but they tell very little about how good an undergraduate education a college provides. Most of these research dollars are for equipment and salaries for graduate and post-graduate researchers. In fact, one might reasonably argue that many second-tier research universities (like UMD) actually place LESS value undergraduate education because the faculty is rewarded for research, not for teaching. Think of the small liberal arts colleges--Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams, Wesleyan, Pomona--these are routinely regarded as best for undergraduate education.

But I digress. FWIW, I can think of few of my colleagues who would send their children to UMD above UVA.

The just released QS world university rankings which are reqarded as the most objective disagree with your asessment and Umd rank 104 Uva rank 130. Additionally, you apparently have no explanation as to why Umd is so adept in producing graduates in differing fields so productive and displaying such genius and Uva doesn't have even one . I have a theory...Uva is very attractive to snooty, preppy, not so bright students who aspire to prepare title searches but are not very good at math and science. They are also weak in the entrepeneurial areas. I'm sure the professor doesn't care about entrepeneurism but he will surely be impressed by Umd's insurmountable lead in pulitzers and nobels.......unless he is not objective.

[Anonymous]

I've got to admit, I've learned a lot on this thread. I checked Charlottesvilles crime stats for myself and they are not good. Two student murders in one year are very close to not being coincidence. I also think it is very strange that Uva graduates really haven't done anything very impressive. Doesn't anybody have an explanation for this? Maybe Umd just attracts different kinds of people. I'll tell you one thing, if just 1% of the magic a Sergi Brin, Kevin plank or Larry David can rub off on other students (and professors) that would be worth the price of tuition!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a professor (not at UVA or UMD) and I have to say that the UMD booster is a bit clueless as to what makes a university reputable for undergraduate education. The references to inventions/cultural icons are perhaps important to a few people, but not to the people who make decisions about a schools' reputation. Research dollars do matter in terms of a university's research status, but they tell very little about how good an undergraduate education a college provides. Most of these research dollars are for equipment and salaries for graduate and post-graduate researchers. In fact, one might reasonably argue that many second-tier research universities (like UMD) actually place LESS value undergraduate education because the faculty is rewarded for research, not for teaching. Think of the small liberal arts colleges--Swarthmore, Amherst, Williams, Wesleyan, Pomona--these are routinely regarded as best for undergraduate education.

But I digress. FWIW, I can think of few of my colleagues who would send their children to UMD above UVA.

The just released QS world university rankings which are reqarded as the most objective disagree with your asessment and Umd rank 104 Uva rank 130. Additionally, you apparently have no explanation as to why Umd is so adept in producing graduates in differing fields so productive and displaying such genius and Uva doesn't have even one . I have a theory...Uva is very attractive to snooty, preppy, not so bright students who aspire to prepare title searches but are not very good at math and science. They are also weak in the entrepeneurial areas. I'm sure the professor doesn't care about entrepeneurism but he will surely be impressed by Umd's insurmountable lead in pulitzers and nobels.......unless he is not objective.

Objective by whose standards? If you took statistics, you would understand that the QS rankings (as with any other) are flawed.

You are clearly a UMD parent, student, or grad. And you should be proud of that. UMD is a good school. Others are going to reasonably disagree. All of your boostering here is impressive, but you are not going to convince anyone what for undergraduate education UMD is more prestigious than UVA. Sorry. You can repeat your arguments and your stats, but ultimately, things like academic reputation are not quantifiable.

[Anonymous]

I'll take results over "reputation" anytime. So the the Federal Government which wisely spends 58% more money at Umd for a superior research product than inferior Uva. Interestingly Johns Hopkins is #1 in research dollars invested (lots of brains up here in Md). Next time you want to do any research or just surf the net be sure not to use Google (it would be too humiliating). I'm sure Uva will graduate somebody any day now that will finally produce something people actually need. But until then you might just have to take off your clothes (Under Armour), unplug your computer (google), and don't buy anything (Universal Price Code). Just for kicks see if anyone can win a nobel out of Uva the you will be halfway to Umd. You will never catch us in pulitzers though!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've got to admit, I've learned a lot on this thread. I checked Charlottesvilles crime stats for myself and they are not good. Two student murders in one year are very close to not being coincidence. I also think it is very strange that Uva graduates really haven't done anything very impressive. Doesn't anybody have an explanation for this? Maybe Umd just attracts different kinds of people. I'll tell you one thing, if just 1% of the magic a Sergi Brin, Kevin plank or Larry David can rub off on other students (and professors) that would be worth the price of tuition!

I was also surprised that Charlottesville's murder rate was higher than College Park's but really, except for the fun people are having trash-talking on this thread, it would make no sense to choose your school based on this.

[Anonymous]

Both schools are really good. Uva is a really pretty campus. I have to admit that the list of impressive people, ideas,nobels and pulitzers that have come out of Umd is nothing short of astonishing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Both schools are really good. Uva is a really pretty campus. I have to admit that the list of impressive people, ideas,nobels and pulitzers that have come out of Umd is nothing short of astonishing.

The key is that they "came out" of U. Md. They certainly aren't there now, for the most part, so the benefit to current students is quite limited. In comparison, U. Va. is much more of an academic village with great scholars always present.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both schools are really good. Uva is a really pretty campus. I have to admit that the list of impressive people, ideas,nobels and pulitzers that have come out of Umd is nothing short of astonishing.

The key is that they "came out" of U. Md. They certainly aren't there now, for the most part, so the benefit to current students is quite limited. In comparison, U. Va. is much more of an academic village with great scholars always present.

An "academic village" that sits around and talks about philosphy while Umd scholars are busy shaping the future of the United States of America

[Anonymous]

Even people who go to Harvard, MIT and Johns Hopkins don't say stupid stuff like "My achool is an academic village". The Ivy league laughs at Uva talking like that. At least Umd has produced legitimate genius.

[Anonymous]

Tech recruiter here. Uva and Umd are different kinds of schools. Umd is highly respected in the computer science and hard science fields. The recent US News department rankins are as follows computer science Umd 16 Uva 33 / engineering Umd 22 Uva 39 / Physics Umd 14 Uva 40 / chemistry Umd 38 Uva 45 / mathematics Umd 20 Uva 46. So there is truth about Umd being excellent in the "results oriented" disciplines. Uva is a fine school but in the more liberal arts type of study. I do however agree that any school that considers itself an "academic village" and is not at least Ivy League has a screw loose in my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Tech recruiter here. Uva and Umd are different kinds of schools. Umd is highly respected in the computer science and hard science fields. The recent US News department rankins are as follows computer science Umd 16 Uva 33 / engineering Umd 22 Uva 39 / Physics Umd 14 Uva 40 / chemistry Umd 38 Uva 45 / mathematics Umd 20 Uva 46. So there is truth about Umd being excellent in the "results oriented" disciplines. Uva is a fine school but in the more liberal arts type of study. I do however agree that any school that considers itself an "academic village" and is not at least Ivy League has a screw loose in my opinion.

Pp, the Big Ten is extremely interested in Umd joining them. The hard science excellence is one of the reasons. Umd has more in common with Michigan, Penn State, Wisconsin than with Duke, Florida State, Uva, NC state and the rest. The Big Ten is enamored with Umd's federal funding for research and making inroads into the Washington D.C. market. Theys also love Umd's athletic tradition. The ACC is frghtened about losing Umd because there would be a musical chairs exodus from the ACC and whoever is left behind would be in bad shape. The schools that are in the most danger in such a senario are Duke, Wake Forest, Virginia and Miami. The SEC would take Vtech, Fla State , UNC and Texas A@M. The Big Ten wants Umd,Rutgers, Syracuse and Notre Dame. Uva, Duke,Wake, NC State, Gtech, Miami and BC will be stuck with Connecticut, East Carolina, South Florida, Villanova, and whoever else they can scrounge up to make 16 schools. Its gonna be interesting over the next few years.

[Anonymous]

The original question was not UVa vs UMd.

Read carefully UMd boosters. You are not impressing with your reading comprehension skills. The reason we only are hearing about UMd I guess is because the Nobel Committee has not discovered Towson or Frostburg or Salisbury(Probably won a Nobel Prize in Physics for chicken plucking) yet.

It was Va vs MD state systems. UVa is definitely geared towards liberal arts, law and business hence the lack of bar code scanners and the plethora of Supreme Court Justices, Senators, Governors. Comedy? Larry David-UMd. Tina Fey-UVa , Jon Stewart - College of W&M. Etc, etc. Night Vision devices? College of William and Mary grad. Wikipedia has partial lists for all of these schools.

Maryland has an eggs in one basket system. VA has things spread out over the system by size and curriculum. Hence cherry picking the technical stuff isn't a good comparison. Last time I checked, Va Tech outranked UMd in engineering. UVa outranks UMd in Business and Law. William and Mary outrank UMD for undergrad liberal arts by a long shot. George Mason and James Madison probably out rank in other areas.

As for Federal Research money, this has little or no imact on undergrads is largely a reflection of political pan handling. Sen. Mikulski has been in for a long time and has a long reach for a such a short woman. And once gain, you should compare ALL the VA colleges and universityies vs ALL the colleges and universities in MD. The tech stuff gets the Fed funds. So VA Tech and Old Dominion and Geroge Mason would clearly give VA a larger share than just UVA alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both schools are really good. Uva is a really pretty campus. I have to admit that the list of impressive people, ideas,nobels and pulitzers that have come out of Umd is nothing short of astonishing.

The key is that they "came out" of U. Md. They certainly aren't there now, for the most part, so the benefit to current students is quite limited. In comparison, U. Va. is much more of an academic village with great scholars always present.

An "academic village" that sits around and talks about philosphy while Umd scholars are busy shaping the future of the United States of America

My husband actually is a philosopher and he has been concerned about how long-term budget cuts in Virginia over the years have affected the quality of the school's offerings. Myself, I've always been impressed with the quality of Virginia's state-supported higher ed system but as an academic who lived and taught for a time in Virginia, I've been concerned about the constant attacks on state support by Virginia's governors for years. I really worry for the long term health of the system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Both schools are really good. Uva is a really pretty campus. I have to admit that the list of impressive people, ideas,nobels and pulitzers that have come out of Umd is nothing short of astonishing.

The key is that they "came out" of U. Md. They certainly aren't there now, for the most part, so the benefit to current students is quite limited. In comparison, U. Va. is much more of an academic village with great scholars always present.

An "academic village" that sits around and talks about philosphy while Umd scholars are busy shaping the future of the United States of America

My husband actually is a philosopher and he has been concerned about how long-term budget cuts in Virginia over the years have affected the quality of the school's offerings. Myself, I've always been impressed with the quality of Virginia's state-supported higher ed system but as an academic who lived and taught for a time in Virginia, I've been concerned about the constant attacks on state support by Virginia's governors for years. I really worry for the long term health of the system.

What attacks are you talking about specifically? What cuts? Public money is limited. There will always be hard choices. Academics in Va gets a very healthy share.

George Mason U campus has been showered with money the past 20 years. Just visited UVa and it's quite nice.