WSJ - To Increase Equity, School Districts Eliminate Honors Classes

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Except they're not raising the bar. They're diluting the rigor in the name of honors for all.

Is there any evidence to this effect or is it just your assumption?

DP.. have you looked at the scores of certain segments of the MCPS student population? A lot of those kids are in "honors" classes because a lot of the HS no longer have on track classes.

There is so much grade inflation, 50% rule, retake of exams, it's hard not to get bad grades, but still, some do.

The 50% rule is hardly a concern. I'm fine with it because some kid might get a C- instead of D+. I'm also fine with retakes since the point is learning, not punishment. In the end, if students learn more then MCPS is doing its job well. Further, none of this has anything to do with expecting all students to meet a higher standard by offering honors for all.

This. I don't see any problems with expecting all students to meet a higher standard, especially English, the national language of the country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Except they're not raising the bar. They're diluting the rigor in the name of honors for all.

Is there any evidence to this effect or is it just your assumption?

DP.. have you looked at the scores of certain segments of the MCPS student population? A lot of those kids are in "honors" classes because a lot of the HS no longer have on track classes.

There is so much grade inflation, 50% rule, retake of exams, it's hard not to get bad grades, but still, some do.

The 50% rule is hardly a concern. I'm fine with it because some kid might get a C- instead of D+. I'm also fine with retakes since the point is learning, not punishment. In the end, if students learn more then MCPS is doing its job well. Further, none of this has anything to do with expecting all students to meet a higher standard by offering honors for all.

This. I don't see any problems with expecting all students to meet a higher standard, especially English, the national language of the country.

The United State of America has never had a national language. You can argue that it should - but please don't argue that it has because it doesn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Except they're not raising the bar. They're diluting the rigor in the name of honors for all.

Is there any evidence to this effect or is it just your assumption?

DP.. have you looked at the scores of certain segments of the MCPS student population? A lot of those kids are in "honors" classes because a lot of the HS no longer have on track classes.

There is so much grade inflation, 50% rule, retake of exams, it's hard not to get bad grades, but still, some do.

The 50% rule is hardly a concern. I'm fine with it because some kid might get a C- instead of D+. I'm also fine with retakes since the point is learning, not punishment. In the end, if students learn more then MCPS is doing its job well. Further, none of this has anything to do with expecting all students to meet a higher standard by offering honors for all.

This. I don't see any problems with expecting all students to meet a higher standard, especially English, the national language of the country.

There is no national language in the United States. Just FYI.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Except they're not raising the bar. They're diluting the rigor in the name of honors for all.

Is there any evidence to this effect or is it just your assumption?

DP.. have you looked at the scores of certain segments of the MCPS student population? A lot of those kids are in "honors" classes because a lot of the HS no longer have on track classes.

There is so much grade inflation, 50% rule, retake of exams, it's hard not to get bad grades, but still, some do.

The 50% rule is hardly a concern. I'm fine with it because some kid might get a C- instead of D+. I'm also fine with retakes since the point is learning, not punishment. In the end, if students learn more then MCPS is doing its job well. Further, none of this has anything to do with expecting all students to meet a higher standard by offering honors for all.

This. I don't see any problems with expecting all students to meet a higher standard, especially English, the national language of the country.

Even if the standards are higher, the kids can't reach that standard, hence the heavy uplift. Once they leave HS and go to college, will they get a 50% rule, retakes?

Having higher expectations is fine, but if they cannot meet it, and so you have to effectively let them "cheat" to get to that standard, what have they learned, and how will they be able to deal with college?

This is why there is so much grade inflation in MCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Honors for all = Honors for none

It's pretty simple logic really.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Honors for all = Honors for none

It's pretty simple logic really.

I know some people would like to spend it that way, but I've seen no evidence to support that conjecture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Honors for all = Honors for none

It's pretty simple logic really.

I know some people would like to spend it that way, but I've seen no evidence to support that conjecture.

I also prefer to take them out face value unless there's evidence to the contrary. Honors for all simply means honors for all and I'm all for raising everyone up to a higher standard.

[Anonymous]

How many UMC kids:
Get tutored material “ above grade level”
Get good teacher recommendations due to bias

There is already a hidden unsaid shadow education system that advantages the privileged. “ honours for all” to me will just give all kids the same privileges as what used to be only available to those with pushy UMC parents without inherent loss of rigor.

[Anonymous]

Why is the solution alllllllllways to kowtow to the lowest common denominator.

This should be great for America's progress and innovation - knee cap the brightest because half the class are children of illegal migrants who need all sorts of remedial work since they can't even speak English.

People just cannot handle the fact there is also a natural bell curve of intelligence. Stop holding back our best.

[Anonymous]

I personally think this crap idea is peddled by the people that want to undermine public education. I wouldn't hesitate to put my kid in private if public went this direction.

[Anonymous]

Is that the same “ bell curve of intelligence “ that was used as an excuse to admit mediocre white boys to Harvard purely because their parents where rich ? If so that’s total bull and admitting poor Black and Hispanic kids of equal drive and intelligence in their place to so called elite programme won’t do zip to the overall rigor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How many UMC kids:
Get tutored material “ above grade level”
Get good teacher recommendations due to bias

There is already a hidden unsaid shadow education system that advantages the privileged. “ honours for all” to me will just give all kids the same privileges as what used to be only available to those with pushy UMC parents without inherent loss of rigor.

If you claim that UMC are getting into "honors" and advanced classes because they are tutored, then that would mean that those classes are difficult. If they are that difficult such that UMC need to be tutored to get an A, are you saying that non UMC who aren't tutored are able to get good grades in honors and advanced classes without tutoring? So, they are actually way smarter than UMC students because they don't need tutors but UMC kids do?

LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How many UMC kids:
Get tutored material “ above grade level”
Get good teacher recommendations due to bias

There is already a hidden unsaid shadow education system that advantages the privileged. “ honours for all” to me will just give all kids the same privileges as what used to be only available to those with pushy UMC parents without inherent loss of rigor.

In order for there to be no "inherent loss of rigor," MCPS would have to be ok with as much as half of the kids in the "honors for all" classes failing. But that's not the case because the rigor isn't the same and diluting the curriculum, slowing down the pace and making all kinds of compromises to accommodate the fact that they have a bunch of kids who aren't really on honors-level taking honors classes that are honors in name only.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How many UMC kids:
Get tutored material “ above grade level”
Get good teacher recommendations due to bias

There is already a hidden unsaid shadow education system that advantages the privileged. “ honours for all” to me will just give all kids the same privileges as what used to be only available to those with pushy UMC parents without inherent loss of rigor.

If you claim that UMC are getting into "honors" and advanced classes because they are tutored, then that would mean that those classes are difficult. If they are that difficult such that UMC need to be tutored to get an A, are you saying that non UMC who aren't tutored are able to get good grades in honors and advanced classes without tutoring? So, they are actually way smarter than UMC students because they don't need tutors but UMC kids do?

LOL

I am asking what’s the difference between a UMC parent sending their on grade level child to extra tutoring to expose them to advanced material and an honors program admitting all on grade level children? I am saying that the gatekeeping is unnecessary.

Open schools all year round and tell parents that they have all 52 weeks of the year to complete the old “one semester” long course. That way those that need remediation can get it and the more advanced kids have time for extra ECs / vacation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Article from WSJ today. Too bad for the schools doing this,


https://www.wsj.com/articles/to-increase-equity-school-districts-eliminate-honors-classes-d5985dee

Instead of eliminating honors which is the national trend, MCPS is doing the opposite and raising the bar by requiring honors for all.

Honors for all = Honors for none

It's pretty simple logic really.

I know some people would like to spend it that way, but I've seen no evidence to support that conjecture.

I also prefer to take them out face value unless there's evidence to the contrary. Honors for all simply means honors for all and I'm all for raising everyone up to a higher standard.

But if everyone has honors, how will parents know that their kids are special and better than the gen pop kids? Let's be clear...the parents who care about this aren't as concerned about academic rigor as they are viewing education as a competition.