Couples therapy and mandatory reporting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really? Sounds like lotsa low-level “therapists” who have no first-hand expertise with the fallout of reporting.

What exactly is a low level therapist? Do you think there's some sort of GS system of therapy levels? Or black belts like karate?

Sounds like a lot of people who cover for abusers and use CPS as an excuse.

Let’s see, someone who does an online degree; someone who does a certificate program; someone who does the minimum qualification to call themselves a therapist but lacks the intelligence of an MD or PhD; someone who is still in school, training or supervision; someone who just has an MSW or worse, “counseling” degree but little experience; someone who uses alternative methods and just calls themselves a therapist; someone who is unlicensed; shall I continue?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Really? Sounds like lotsa low-level “therapists” who have no first-hand expertise with the fallout of reporting.

Or a family member of an elementary school teachers who reported the same person four or five times before CPS even did a home visit. At the second interaction with CPS it was when a social worker came to get her at the hospital after her dad had beaten her mother so badly she needed the ICU. But yeah don’t report it might get an abuser disinvited to a golf match.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really? Sounds like lotsa low-level “therapists” who have no first-hand expertise with the fallout of reporting.

Or a family member of an elementary school teachers who reported the same person four or five times before CPS even did a home visit. At the second interaction with CPS it was when a social worker came to get her at the hospital after her dad had beaten her mother so badly she needed the ICU. But yeah don’t report it might get an abuser disinvited to a golf match.

Perfect example of why reporting is a matter of scale. Were the four or five reports because the dad was “irked” and seeking therapy? I doubt it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Really? Sounds like lotsa low-level “therapists” who have no first-hand expertise with the fallout of reporting.

Or a family member of an elementary school teachers who reported the same person four or five times before CPS even did a home visit. At the second interaction with CPS it was when a social worker came to get her at the hospital after her dad had beaten her mother so badly she needed the ICU. But yeah don’t report it might get an abuser disinvited to a golf match.

Perfect example of why reporting is a matter of scale. Were the four or five reports because the dad was “irked” and seeking therapy? I doubt it.

The first one was because of a small, but visible mark on the wrist where the father had pulled the student out of the room. Sounds familiar. It’s why the standard for reporting is visible marks.

I also find it interesting that you keep homing in on “irked” and ignoring “triggered to anger” and “latest incident”.

Why do you feel so compelled to protect this abuser?

[Anonymous]

Pulled the student out of the classroom? Who does that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Pulled the student out of the classroom? Who does that?

Same kind of person who yanks their kid outside for making noise.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I am a therapist. This would have to be reported.

And I agree with the PP, this should not be your biggest concern.

What? Because he grabbed the kid? God help our culture if we think it's better to lock up a parent or divorce him because he grabbed his kid too hard in a moment of frustration. Where is the compassion? Where is the proportionality? It really doesn't sound like he was trying to hurt the kid. Maybe he didn't realize how much force he was applying. Maybe he didn't realize the point at which he woudl leave a mark. And what's "a mark," anyway - a bruise? The slight discoloration in skin that comes from pressure or heat and then dissipates after a few seconds? As long as he now acknowledges that he squeezed too tight, I think everyone needs to get over it.

+10000

I am a different poster and agree with this. It’s legal to spank your kids. He needs better emotional regulation but this isn’t CPS-worthy IMO. And I am a mandated reporter and have reported to CPS before.

Then you do not know what you are doing. I am also a mandated reporter and leaving marks always requires a report. PP, maybe you should think about changing professions.

As someone said above, there are marks and there are marks. Grabbing a child even non-abusively will leave brief red marks. If we are talking about bruises visible hours later that is a different story. But considering none of us here has even seen the photos I think you’re the one jumping to conclusions.

Exactly. If my child was headed for the street and I grabbed his arm to stop him from being run over, the potential to leave a mark is there, maybe even a bruise. Other parent could disagree and say Larlo would have listened to the word 'no' so grabbing his arm was wrong. Mandatory reporter could then report to CPS, and some CPS worker with a chip on his/her shoulder could consider action abusive.

Ok so in a worst case scenario a CPS investigation is started and since you have nothing to hide and don’t routinely bruise your child (right?) it’s an annoyance and potentially an expense.

A mandatory reporter ignores those bruises and loses their job and a kid potentially loses their life. Why is that a preferable outcome to you?

I don’t think you have any concept or understanding of how traumatizing these inquiries can be even if they are baseless. These people, most of whom have sub mental IQs, have the power to ruin your reputation, in some cases your career, destroy your family, and remove your child. It is a horrific experience even if you are innocent.

I do understand this could be traumatizing. I’m saying the trauma a parent who engages in one-time abuse or is misunderstood feels is a lesser evil than a child dying. I’m saying your reputation and career are not more important than the mandatory reporters career, which is what they lose if they don’t report you.

My reputation and career ARE more important than a mandated supporters career.

And if my spouse tried to label me an abuser we would be done, and they could kiss seeing their children goodbye at least half of the time.

Why is your career more important than a doctor's, or a teacher's, or a therapist's?

In many states the the definition of who is a mandated reporter has been extended so broadly as to include virtually any adult.

Is that doctor, teacher or therapist going to be supporting my children? No. Therefore my career and reputation are more important FOR THE CHILD than the reporter’s.

Do you understand that if telling the truth ruins your reputation, then it is based upon a falsehood?

If you can't stand behind your own actions, because they would be roundly condemned...maybe you need to look in the mirror.

Maybe you need to get a clue. In many circles and professions, the inquiry alone would be sufficient to cause harm. For a doctor for example, they may be required to state whether they have ever been investigated in order to get hospital privileges or a state license. Even if nothing came of the investigation. Not to mention other parents. Are you sending your kid to play and socializing with the parents who had CPS called on them, even if chargers were never filed? Yeah no.

You know what? It’s about the child’s safety, not your frigging social life.

NP. Correct in many situations - but not OP’s. From what she has described, the child is not in danger. So yes, she would potentially be socially ostracizing herself (and her child!) which frankly benefits no one in this scenario. If his behavior escalates then OP can go from there and decisions can change. But from what we’ve been told, involving the police and CPS would be opening a gigantic can of worms that wouldn’t benefit any member of this family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Pulled the student out of the classroom? Who does that?

Same kind of person who yanks their kid outside for making noise.

Says you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Op: number one rule. Never, I repeat never talk to the Man.
(The po po, fuzz, etc). You do not show the therapist a picture. You do not open the door to interference from cps.
See above, do not talk to the man.

You can do therapy. Work on your marriage and anger management.

People are so stupid to not understand. Never invite the man into your business.

+1
You don't want to get caught up in the criminal justice system unless it's a serious offense. If it's domestic violence, which could be as harmless as someone throwing a remote control on the ground, police will arrest if they have probable cause. Gone are the days of working things out.

Uh, how well did letting them alone to work it out turn out for Gabby Petito? This idea that police jump to arrest abusers is either naïveté or misogyny.

She didn’t file a report. Once you file a report it all unfolds like clockwork.

If the relationship falls under the domestic violence laws, you generally don't file a report. The cops show up, and if there is PC, they make an arrest. If you call the cops several days after the incident, good luck with that.

[Anonymous]

There are several questions here people are conflating.

1. The question the OP asked: if OP shares this with a therapist, will it be reported? Op should assume the answer is yes.

2. Will CPS do anything about it? I think it's unlikely.

3. Should CPS do anything about it? IMO, based on the info we have here, no, even though this is likely a pattern of abuse, CPS's involvement wouldn't make the situation better.

4. Is CPS a good institution? Definitely debatable. Sometimes they are the only thing keeping kids away from abuse, sometimes they deliver children into abuse, sometimes it's just a wash.

[Anonymous]

People don’t seem to understand that CPS involvement can be very traumatic for the child. There is a big cost to involving state authorities in a family that doesn’t really need it. The threshold should be high.

Won’t put the link here because of spam-catcher, but recommend that people check out the National Coalition for Child Protection Reform. Also worth checking out the testimony to and findings of the Massachusetts Mandated Reporter Commission in 2021, which are available on the web. They got a tidal wave of testimony from community organizations and activists as to the human costs and damages created by excessive mandated reporting.

CPS are basically a police force directed at families and just like involving the police there is a downside that has to be considered. In fact, you have many fewer due process rights when dealing with CPS than with the police, and the proportion of CPS cases where involvement of the state is justified is much lower than with the police.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People don’t seem to understand that CPS involvement can be very traumatic for the child. There is a big cost to involving state authorities in a family that doesn’t really need it. The threshold should be high.

Won’t put the link here because of spam-catcher, but recommend that people check out the National Coalition for Child Protection Reform. Also worth checking out the testimony to and findings of the Massachusetts Mandated Reporter Commission in 2021, which are available on the web. They got a tidal wave of testimony from community organizations and activists as to the human costs and damages created by excessive mandated reporting.

CPS are basically a police force directed at families and just like involving the police there is a downside that has to be considered. In fact, you have many fewer due process rights when dealing with CPS than with the police, and the proportion of CPS cases where involvement of the state is justified is much lower than with the police.

I think people understand that and also think mandatory reporters should report child abuse in this case.

Remember the kids whose parents escalate to serious violence didn’t get the opportunity to testify because they’re dead or impaired for life.

[Anonymous]

No, they are blindly following their mandated reporter guidelines and thinking about their own licenses, read the thread. Hardly anyone thinks that calling CPS on this family who have already self-reported and are engaging in joint therapy is an immediate danger to the child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No, they are blindly following their mandated reporter guidelines and thinking about their own licenses, read the thread. Hardly anyone thinks that calling CPS on this family who have already self-reported and are engaging in joint therapy is an immediate danger to the child.

They haven’t “self reported” to anyone— there is zero record. Making things up to protect the abuser, again, shows where your priorities in this case are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No, they are blindly following their mandated reporter guidelines and thinking about their own licenses, read the thread. Hardly anyone thinks that calling CPS on this family who have already self-reported and are engaging in joint therapy is an immediate danger to the child.

They haven’t “self reported” to anyone— there is zero record. Making things up to protect the abuser, again, shows where your priorities in this case are.

By “self-reported” I meant took the initiative to seek professional help. Isn’t that what CPS would recommend anyway? Or are you seriously suggesting this child be removed from the home? If you are you are crazier than I thought.