The White Lotus season 2

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Very interesting interview with Aubrey Plaza on the Still Watching podcast today.

She says that Harper is not attracted to Cameron at all, he represents pretty much everything she hates, and the more she learns about him the more she dislikes him.

She says that a lot of Harper’s anger at Ethan about the night with Cameron is about how he is behaving so differently with Cameron than he does around her. Like with her he is withdrawn, unadventurous. He won’t even break his routines to have sex with her, he seems so disinterested in her. But with Cameron he’s doing molly and staying up all night? Contrast this with Harper’s night in Noto where, despite taking an edible she remains 100% the same person and is focused on getting home and communicating with Ethan.

Also says she thinks of the show like a 7 hour movie because of how she read the scripts (all at once) and that she is “scared” of the finale.

I agree I think she does see him flirting with her and it just disgusts her further. I think what other people have read as 'flirting back' is more like incredulity that he's giving her eyes in front of Daphne. I see no version of events where they hooked up. But it is telling that in Noto Harper says that Ethan won't cheat on her and is right and even when faced with evidence he did she is skeptical and does seek out his version and I think does believe him although she's angry about the general events that DID happen. In contrast Ethan is faced with this minor moment of her absence and goes full paranoid psycho even though it would be ENTIRELY out of her character to get with Cameron on multiple levels. It just confirms what Harper is already mad about, that Ethan is all about Cameron. He is viewing the entire trip through Cameron's viewpoint not Harper. She is an incidental character in his vacation story. Something she has picked up on but he has not.

The preview for next week makes it seem like something definitely happened.

It's so infuriating that Ethan denies Harper physical affection of any kind yet gets insanely jealous of a hint of Cameron flirting. Harper is the pawn and it's about time she made a move.

Their relationship is dead, do not resuscitate. In the end, the contrast with Daphne and Cameron's highly problematic but also affectionate and loving relationship is instructive and will help her make the necessary break. If he doesn't end up dead first.

She won’t, remember last season when that wife just decided to sacrifice all her happiness and fulfillment and stay with the jerk? Yep.

I don't think that relationship is comparable to Harper and Ethan, if for no other reasons than

1) Harper is gainfully employed and can walk away and maintain a good life
2) Ethan is complicated and has darkness but he is not the petulant man child that Shane is/was
3) Harper is both more comfortable in and simultaneously a lot less attached to opulent wealth than Rachel was

H/E are a lot more adult than S/R for whatever that is worth.

I think a lot of this comes from the fact that Harper was already married to Ethan when the wealth arrived. She wasn't in it for the money, and if anything she sees it causing problems for them.

So, I don't think Harper decides to suck it up for the comfortable lifestyle. I think they either reconcile (maybe as they try to hide Cameron's body after Ethan kills him semi-accidentally) or Harper leaves him.

I am kind of finding myself rooting for Ethan and Harper to make it now

I think Ethan accidentally drowns next week.

Ugh I was so nervous when he went running solo/swimming. That'd kind of be a less satisfying death though? We're expecting a big fight between Harper/Cameron and it's a pure accident on his own?

I mean, it's just a guess! We'll see what happens. My predictions are:
- ethan
- quentin
- jack
-greg

Mine are

- Lucia
- Quentin

I think:
- Nonno
- Greg

I was very worried for Nonno at that crazy house of women!

We haven't talked about that - what was up with that? I have to admit that I thought it was hugely cringey to just drive up to this random house and expect the family to be thrilled to see their very distant relatives that immigrated to the US generations ago. I felt bad for Nonno, but I also thought the whole idea was questionable. Maybe with Lucia to translate, but even then.

It shows Nonno's arrogance. The reunion he had in his mind was not based on any reality and normal people know that and wouldn't do what they did. He is so wrapped up in himself and his own world - think about his belief that his wife was not bothered by his affairs, that he didn't approach this in any reasonable way.

This is a whole thing in the Italian American community -- going to Italy to trace your roots and look for living relatives. But I think the Di Grassos experience is actually very common. Especially when the family you find are pretty rural, and you don't speak any Italian.* It absolutely is arrogant and these people do not think through what it must be like to just be living your life and then have a group of foreigners who don't even speak your language show up AT YOUR HOME and demand not only your time but expect to fulfill their emotional needs. It's an extremely weird expectation and very entitled.

* Showing up not only without a translator (and keep in mind that they didn't put much effort into locating a translator), but with almost no Italian language skills at all was the part that was most offensive to me. My Italian is middling at best, but I would have been able to handle that situation a million times better. My experience is that Italians tend to be pretty grateful towards efforts to speak their language, and that even if you can't fully converse in Italian, having all your greetings, common sayings, and then key vocabulary in the language goes a looooong way to getting along well with Italians, even in more rural areas. Also, if you have Italian heritage, learning that amount of Italian would not even be hard or time consuming because there is so much random Italian floating around. Like if you grew up with an Italian mother or grandmother, you don't know how to say mille grazie or mi dispiaci, just sort of intuitively? Come on. Albie I'll forgive because he's three generations removed and he's young, but it is a joke to me that Bert and Dom didn't have any Italian and couldn't even be bothered to listen to a few Duo Lingo courses on the plane.

Totally the fact that they didn't even google how to say 'we are the Di Grassos from American our grandparents lived here and we wanted to say hello' was insane. Like did they look up BONJOURNO!? They knew nothing, it was embarassing.

That said I think that the bolded is a pretty unkind take on it. Plenty of people love getting access to a piece of their history and plenty of people don't. But this movement towards people suppressing all efforts to communicate with others at the risk of offending is just going to turn the whole world into Wall-E. They showed up, they were asked to leave, they did! No harm no foul. They made arrogant decisions that set themselves up for failure but the inherent idea I do not think is bad.

And maybe you should have looked up how to spell BUONGIORNO before you posted

touche! thank god i wasn't going to meet my long lost italian relatives hahaa

[Anonymous]

What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Very interesting interview with Aubrey Plaza on the Still Watching podcast today.

She says that Harper is not attracted to Cameron at all, he represents pretty much everything she hates, and the more she learns about him the more she dislikes him.

She says that a lot of Harper’s anger at Ethan about the night with Cameron is about how he is behaving so differently with Cameron than he does around her. Like with her he is withdrawn, unadventurous. He won’t even break his routines to have sex with her, he seems so disinterested in her. But with Cameron he’s doing molly and staying up all night? Contrast this with Harper’s night in Noto where, despite taking an edible she remains 100% the same person and is focused on getting home and communicating with Ethan.

Also says she thinks of the show like a 7 hour movie because of how she read the scripts (all at once) and that she is “scared” of the finale.

I agree I think she does see him flirting with her and it just disgusts her further. I think what other people have read as 'flirting back' is more like incredulity that he's giving her eyes in front of Daphne. I see no version of events where they hooked up. But it is telling that in Noto Harper says that Ethan won't cheat on her and is right and even when faced with evidence he did she is skeptical and does seek out his version and I think does believe him although she's angry about the general events that DID happen. In contrast Ethan is faced with this minor moment of her absence and goes full paranoid psycho even though it would be ENTIRELY out of her character to get with Cameron on multiple levels. It just confirms what Harper is already mad about, that Ethan is all about Cameron. He is viewing the entire trip through Cameron's viewpoint not Harper. She is an incidental character in his vacation story. Something she has picked up on but he has not.

The preview for next week makes it seem like something definitely happened.

It's so infuriating that Ethan denies Harper physical affection of any kind yet gets insanely jealous of a hint of Cameron flirting. Harper is the pawn and it's about time she made a move.

Their relationship is dead, do not resuscitate. In the end, the contrast with Daphne and Cameron's highly problematic but also affectionate and loving relationship is instructive and will help her make the necessary break. If he doesn't end up dead first.

She won’t, remember last season when that wife just decided to sacrifice all her happiness and fulfillment and stay with the jerk? Yep.

I don't think that relationship is comparable to Harper and Ethan, if for no other reasons than

1) Harper is gainfully employed and can walk away and maintain a good life
2) Ethan is complicated and has darkness but he is not the petulant man child that Shane is/was
3) Harper is both more comfortable in and simultaneously a lot less attached to opulent wealth than Rachel was

H/E are a lot more adult than S/R for whatever that is worth.

I think a lot of this comes from the fact that Harper was already married to Ethan when the wealth arrived. She wasn't in it for the money, and if anything she sees it causing problems for them.

So, I don't think Harper decides to suck it up for the comfortable lifestyle. I think they either reconcile (maybe as they try to hide Cameron's body after Ethan kills him semi-accidentally) or Harper leaves him.

I am kind of finding myself rooting for Ethan and Harper to make it now

I think Ethan accidentally drowns next week.

Ugh I was so nervous when he went running solo/swimming. That'd kind of be a less satisfying death though? We're expecting a big fight between Harper/Cameron and it's a pure accident on his own?

I mean, it's just a guess! We'll see what happens. My predictions are:
- ethan
- quentin
- jack
-greg

Mine are

- Lucia
- Quentin

I think:
- Nonno
- Greg

I was very worried for Nonno at that crazy house of women!

We haven't talked about that - what was up with that? I have to admit that I thought it was hugely cringey to just drive up to this random house and expect the family to be thrilled to see their very distant relatives that immigrated to the US generations ago. I felt bad for Nonno, but I also thought the whole idea was questionable. Maybe with Lucia to translate, but even then.

It shows Nonno's arrogance. The reunion he had in his mind was not based on any reality and normal people know that and wouldn't do what they did. He is so wrapped up in himself and his own world - think about his belief that his wife was not bothered by his affairs, that he didn't approach this in any reasonable way.

This is a whole thing in the Italian American community -- going to Italy to trace your roots and look for living relatives. But I think the Di Grassos experience is actually very common. Especially when the family you find are pretty rural, and you don't speak any Italian.* It absolutely is arrogant and these people do not think through what it must be like to just be living your life and then have a group of foreigners who don't even speak your language show up AT YOUR HOME and demand not only your time but expect to fulfill their emotional needs. It's an extremely weird expectation and very entitled.

* Showing up not only without a translator (and keep in mind that they didn't put much effort into locating a translator), but with almost no Italian language skills at all was the part that was most offensive to me. My Italian is middling at best, but I would have been able to handle that situation a million times better. My experience is that Italians tend to be pretty grateful towards efforts to speak their language, and that even if you can't fully converse in Italian, having all your greetings, common sayings, and then key vocabulary in the language goes a looooong way to getting along well with Italians, even in more rural areas. Also, if you have Italian heritage, learning that amount of Italian would not even be hard or time consuming because there is so much random Italian floating around. Like if you grew up with an Italian mother or grandmother, you don't know how to say mille grazie or mi dispiaci, just sort of intuitively? Come on. Albie I'll forgive because he's three generations removed and he's young, but it is a joke to me that Bert and Dom didn't have any Italian and couldn't even be bothered to listen to a few Duo Lingo courses on the plane.

Yeah, My SIL still has relatives and property in Italy and it is a whooollleee thing between the relatives that went to the US and those that stayed. And these are people that she knows and spends time with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

I have a bad marriage with a lot of problems that have compounded over time (not cheating though). Frankly, there are things I would simply rather not address, particularly things that are not likely to change. I don't want a divorce. So yeah, I don't spend my time with my husband and family fixating on those things. Cheating is a different ball of wax, but yeah, people compartmentalize.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ethan staring into space like a dope in the beginning of this episode sums up this dweebs acting performance so far

We concur

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The preview is pretty helpful: Tanya survives the night. Cameron is wrestled under the water. Harper is showing emotion. Ethan is paranoid. Albie wants to save Lucia. Can't wait til Sunday!

Yes but why did the Italian stud muffin who seduced her have a gun? Why did they keep Portia away for the night? My bet is that Quentin and the gays are in cahoots with Tanya’s husband Greg who absconded suddenly from Sicily. He is setting up Tanya via the gay ring master Quentin (who is actually banging Portia’s cockney fling and ostensible nephew Jack). Maybe they will force Tanya to sign a new will at gun point or there may be an infidelity clause in the prenuptial agreement that would endow Greg with lions share of fortune if she dies: They may be planning to throw her overboard and Portia will not be there to help save her. Greg was very irate that Tanya brought Portia along. If the scheme works - The gays get half of the billion which should be enough to keep Quentin’s palazzo and their grand life style going for a few more years.

Yet Quentin told that story about Isola Bella island and the wealthy Swedish family who owned the island. She refused to sell the island and her body washed up on the rocks later and the estate became open to the public. Would Tanya’s estate become public somehow if she washes up on the rocks after being thrown overboard?

Also Quentin discussed that he has only ever loved one man - a heterosexual cowboy from Wyoming - and that 30 years later he would still do anything for him. Is Greg the cowboy who thirty years later is on his fourth wife? When he married Tanya he thought he was dying and she spent a fortune on medical care for him. But now he may have many years ahead of him he is not thrilled to spend them with Tanya. Has he given Quentin false hope of them having a luxurious future together if they can get rid of Tanya?

I wonder whether GLBTQ folks are annoyed by the portrayal of the gays as sleazy, dishonest, fawning, superficial, hedonistic and immoral degenerates? Or they straights painted similarly so they don’t mind?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

I have a bad marriage with a lot of problems that have compounded over time (not cheating though). Frankly, there are things I would simply rather not address, particularly things that are not likely to change. I don't want a divorce. So yeah, I don't spend my time with my husband and family fixating on those things. Cheating is a different ball of wax, but yeah, people compartmentalize.

Out of the four of them, Daphne seems the happiest and at peace with her decisions. But, I agree she has a looming sadness we only see for a split second here and there. This originally made me think if she is that good of hiding/compartmentalizing emotion,,,perhaps she has it in her to compartmentalize murder

[Anonymous]

Italian stud muffins gun will be used by Tanya to kill off the gay cons and the British Wanker

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

I have a bad marriage with a lot of problems that have compounded over time (not cheating though). Frankly, there are things I would simply rather not address, particularly things that are not likely to change. I don't want a divorce. So yeah, I don't spend my time with my husband and family fixating on those things. Cheating is a different ball of wax, but yeah, people compartmentalize.

Out of the four of them, Daphne seems the happiest and at peace with her decisions. But, I agree she has a looming sadness we only see for a split second here and there. This originally made me think if she is that good of hiding/compartmentalizing emotion,,,perhaps she has it in her to compartmentalize murder

I do think she is the most at peace with her choices and fulfilled in life. The others are much more complicated. She has found a way to be happy and 'not be a victim' as she likes to say.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Italian stud muffins gun will be used by Tanya to kill off the gay cons and the British Wanker

Could

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

I have a bad marriage with a lot of problems that have compounded over time (not cheating though). Frankly, there are things I would simply rather not address, particularly things that are not likely to change. I don't want a divorce. So yeah, I don't spend my time with my husband and family fixating on those things. Cheating is a different ball of wax, but yeah, people compartmentalize.

Out of the four of them, Daphne seems the happiest and at peace with her decisions. But, I agree she has a looming sadness we only see for a split second here and there. This originally made me think if she is that good of hiding/compartmentalizing emotion,,,perhaps she has it in her to compartmentalize murder

I do think she is the most at peace with her choices and fulfilled in life. The others are much more complicated. She has found a way to be happy and 'not be a victim' as she likes to say.

Completely agree with this. She has made a peace with her situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The preview is pretty helpful: Tanya survives the night. Cameron is wrestled under the water. Harper is showing emotion. Ethan is paranoid. Albie wants to save Lucia. Can't wait til Sunday!

Yes but why did the Italian stud muffin who seduced her have a gun? Why did they keep Portia away for the night? My bet is that Quentin and the gays are in cahoots with Tanya’s husband Greg who absconded suddenly from Sicily. He is setting up Tanya via the gay ring master Quentin (who is actually banging Portia’s cockney fling and ostensible nephew Jack). Maybe they will force Tanya to sign a new will at gun point or there may be an infidelity clause in the prenuptial agreement that would endow Greg with lions share of fortune if she dies: They may be planning to throw her overboard and Portia will not be there to help save her. Greg was very irate that Tanya brought Portia along. If the scheme works - The gays get half of the billion which should be enough to keep Quentin’s palazzo and their grand life style going for a few more years.

Yet Quentin told that story about Isola Bella island and the wealthy Swedish family who owned the island. She refused to sell the island and her body washed up on the rocks later and the estate became open to the public. Would Tanya’s estate become public somehow if she washes up on the rocks after being thrown overboard?

Also Quentin discussed that he has only ever loved one man - a heterosexual cowboy from Wyoming - and that 30 years later he would still do anything for him. Is Greg the cowboy who thirty years later is on his fourth wife? When he married Tanya he thought he was dying and she spent a fortune on medical care for him. But now he may have many years ahead of him he is not thrilled to spend them with Tanya. Has he given Quentin false hope of them having a luxurious future together if they can get rid of Tanya?

I wonder whether GLBTQ folks are annoyed by the portrayal of the gays as sleazy, dishonest, fawning, superficial, hedonistic and immoral degenerates? Or they straights painted similarly so they don’t mind?

I think the fact that basically everyone is horrible is what makes this fine. And the creator Mike White is bi and has been in gay relationships.

[Anonymous]

I was thinking about how many of the characters appear to be in over their heads or 'out of their depth' or even drowning in debt. Will this determine who drowns?

I also thought the thing with visiting the 'long lost relatives' was neat because last season we engaged a bit with the question of whether tourism is exploitative, whether the hula show was cultural appropriation. I think the show does a nice job of helping viewers to think about tourism as a phenomenon, the different types of tourism and the ethics associated with them. I met an academic a while ago who studies tourism and she was talking about various types -- things like 'lets go see this unspoiled place before it sinks into the sea' or competing to be the only one to see some unspoiled place. Lots of weird ethical questions associated with tourism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Italian stud muffins gun will be used by Tanya to kill off the gay cons and the British Wanker

Could

Maybe but presumably Jack will not be around when they try to take down Tanya as he continues to stonewall Portia to keep her off the “Love Boat”.

Also why did Greg not want to be seen in photos when they took their Vespa joy ride around Sicily before he disappeared? How would him being in vacation photos with his wife impact the scheme that he and Quentin have been cooking to reap the rewards of whatever sad fate that have planned for Tanya?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What do people make of Daphne's awareness/belief about what happened with the guys while they were in Noto? I am very curious about the two different conversations she had about it, one with Harper and one with Cameron:

With Harper: she is just kind of dead in the eyes when Harper says that she thinks the guys got up to some stuff that night, and then there's the very weird exchange where she talks about her trainer and spending all her time with him while Cameron is working, and then "accidentally" shows Harper a photo of her kids. I still don't know what I think of what Daphne is trying to say there (that she's cheating with her trainer, and Harper should to? that the kid is her trainer's kid, and if Harper wants kids, she should do the same? that there is no trainer and she's actually talking about her kids, who make the compromises in her marriage worth it?), but in that conversation she all but acknowledged that her husband probably was unfaithful while she was away.

With Cameron: jokey, smiley, says something like "Harper is sooo convinced you guys got up to something while we were gone" giggles. Then Cameron doesn't exactly answer but is charming and joking too (they are both very good at the flirtatious conversation) and Daphne makes some comment like "you'd never do that to me" even though she told Harper in Noto that she knows he has done it, and then the kiss and seem happier than ever.

I think we're supposed to think one is the "real" response and one is the fake response, but I actually think they are both real. I think she and Cameron maybe are just weirdly amazing at compartmentalizing and even though they both know that they both cheat, they are excellent about just putting it out of their minds when they are together and being happy and in love. Like I think they really do love each other, it's not a front.

But I also think this is an INSANE arrangement and that Daphne's dead-eyed stare and the weirdness with the photo indicates that maybe when she and Cameron aren't enjoying their lovey-dovey couple time, she is relatively tormented by how unfaithful their marriage is. Maybe? Still trying to figure Daphne out. A lot of characters (basically all of the foursome, plus Dom, Lucia, Mia, and Quentin) are still puzzles to me, but none more so than Daphne. This actress has such fascinating microexpressions and line deliveries. I'm very interested to see what we learn about her in the finale.

I have a bad marriage with a lot of problems that have compounded over time (not cheating though). Frankly, there are things I would simply rather not address, particularly things that are not likely to change. I don't want a divorce. So yeah, I don't spend my time with my husband and family fixating on those things. Cheating is a different ball of wax, but yeah, people compartmentalize.

Out of the four of them, Daphne seems the happiest and at peace with her decisions. But, I agree she has a looming sadness we only see for a split second here and there. This originally made me think if she is that good of hiding/compartmentalizing emotion,,,perhaps she has it in her to compartmentalize murder

She’s had zero interaction with Ethan thus far and then she’s pictured walking away and he’s following her…. So intrigued