What happened to this California family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think buying a sugar free or gluten free so it if no celiac or diabetes absolutely does characterize a person! But I digress. DP

It's very Californian, TBH.

It’s very DC too - for anyone who tries to stay fit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an interesting link from the websleuths forum

https://emergency-vets.com/species/dogs/dogs-heat-stroke-stress-summer/

Unlike humans, dogs do not sweat to cool their bodies (except a small amount through the paw pads). Instead, dogs primarily regulate their temperature through their mouth, by panting. This can be very ineffective, however, when the temperature gets over 80 degrees or when a dog is in direct sunlight.

If the temperature is over 90 degrees, do not let your pet outside for more than 10 or 20 minutes.

Was just coming to post this. There is a veterinarian on thread #3 there re this family with some helpful input. Two other things of interest to me from recent posts over there:

The family's house, which was near the Savage/Lundy trailhead, was at 3,500 ft. elevation, where the temperatures we are assuming from the El Portal station were at 2,000 ft elevation. They may have judged the conditions by feel from the cooler temps at their house. Savage/Lundy and Devil's Gulch were probably hotter than both.

The poor moderators on Websleuths are clearly working overtime on this case. While I absolutely respect their "victim friendly" posting rule, I thought this post from them was hysterical, and I'm glad we have a bit more freedom here.

"Again: Websleuths is victim-friendly and speculation has to be fact-based.

No more lifestyle speculation based on donut orders.

Any discussion of obsessions or compulsions has to be based on stronger evidence than someone ordering a gluten-free (or even a sugar-free) donut. Someone buying a donut from a donut store does not mean they consider themselves morally and/or intellectually superior to others, nor does the type of donut purchased constitute evidence of an eating disorder, grandiose ideation or a sense of entitlement.

As we wait for more validated information, please keep the speculation based on the evidence we have so far. Thank you."

This is an EXCELLENT guideline.

Wish DCUM braintrust would follow that instead of actively finding ways to disparage the victims.

Sorry, don't agree. If we can't speculate on whether ordering "a gluten-free (or even a sugar-free) donut" is evidence of grandiose ideation, what's the point of being on DCUM?

Feel free to discuss finer points of donut orders if you can refrain from insulting dead people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an interesting link from the websleuths forum

https://emergency-vets.com/species/dogs/dogs-heat-stroke-stress-summer/

Unlike humans, dogs do not sweat to cool their bodies (except a small amount through the paw pads). Instead, dogs primarily regulate their temperature through their mouth, by panting. This can be very ineffective, however, when the temperature gets over 80 degrees or when a dog is in direct sunlight.

If the temperature is over 90 degrees, do not let your pet outside for more than 10 or 20 minutes.

Was just coming to post this. There is a veterinarian on thread #3 there re this family with some helpful input. Two other things of interest to me from recent posts over there:

The family's house, which was near the Savage/Lundy trailhead, was at 3,500 ft. elevation, where the temperatures we are assuming from the El Portal station were at 2,000 ft elevation. They may have judged the conditions by feel from the cooler temps at their house. Savage/Lundy and Devil's Gulch were probably hotter than both.

The poor moderators on Websleuths are clearly working overtime on this case. While I absolutely respect their "victim friendly" posting rule, I thought this post from them was hysterical, and I'm glad we have a bit more freedom here.

"Again: Websleuths is victim-friendly and speculation has to be fact-based.

No more lifestyle speculation based on donut orders.

Any discussion of obsessions or compulsions has to be based on stronger evidence than someone ordering a gluten-free (or even a sugar-free) donut. Someone buying a donut from a donut store does not mean they consider themselves morally and/or intellectually superior to others, nor does the type of donut purchased constitute evidence of an eating disorder, grandiose ideation or a sense of entitlement.

As we wait for more validated information, please keep the speculation based on the evidence we have so far. Thank you."

This is an EXCELLENT guideline.

Wish DCUM braintrust would follow that instead of actively finding ways to disparage the victims.

You can just go to Web Sleuths if that is more your speed. Victims aren't being disparaged here. Speculations are being made. Some with fact, some with fiction but the story is so crazy and odd and little information has been released that speculation is all anyone even Web Sleuths have to go on!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an interesting link from the websleuths forum

https://emergency-vets.com/species/dogs/dogs-heat-stroke-stress-summer/

Unlike humans, dogs do not sweat to cool their bodies (except a small amount through the paw pads). Instead, dogs primarily regulate their temperature through their mouth, by panting. This can be very ineffective, however, when the temperature gets over 80 degrees or when a dog is in direct sunlight.

If the temperature is over 90 degrees, do not let your pet outside for more than 10 or 20 minutes.

Was just coming to post this. There is a veterinarian on thread #3 there re this family with some helpful input. Two other things of interest to me from recent posts over there:

The family's house, which was near the Savage/Lundy trailhead, was at 3,500 ft. elevation, where the temperatures we are assuming from the El Portal station were at 2,000 ft elevation. They may have judged the conditions by feel from the cooler temps at their house. Savage/Lundy and Devil's Gulch were probably hotter than both.

The poor moderators on Websleuths are clearly working overtime on this case. While I absolutely respect their "victim friendly" posting rule, I thought this post from them was hysterical, and I'm glad we have a bit more freedom here.

"Again: Websleuths is victim-friendly and speculation has to be fact-based.

No more lifestyle speculation based on donut orders.

Any discussion of obsessions or compulsions has to be based on stronger evidence than someone ordering a gluten-free (or even a sugar-free) donut. Someone buying a donut from a donut store does not mean they consider themselves morally and/or intellectually superior to others, nor does the type of donut purchased constitute evidence of an eating disorder, grandiose ideation or a sense of entitlement.

As we wait for more validated information, please keep the speculation based on the evidence we have so far. Thank you."

This is an EXCELLENT guideline.

Wish DCUM braintrust would follow that instead of actively finding ways to disparage the victims.

Are you one of the posters assuming they died other than heat stroke?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think buying a sugar free or gluten free so it if no celiac or diabetes absolutely does characterize a person! But I digress. DP

It's very Californian, TBH.

How do you know she wasn’t celiac or diabetic? We don’t know that. Plus it’s very West Coast and not indicative of an ED.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's an interesting link from the websleuths forum

https://emergency-vets.com/species/dogs/dogs-heat-stroke-stress-summer/

Unlike humans, dogs do not sweat to cool their bodies (except a small amount through the paw pads). Instead, dogs primarily regulate their temperature through their mouth, by panting. This can be very ineffective, however, when the temperature gets over 80 degrees or when a dog is in direct sunlight.

If the temperature is over 90 degrees, do not let your pet outside for more than 10 or 20 minutes.

Was just coming to post this. There is a veterinarian on thread #3 there re this family with some helpful input. Two other things of interest to me from recent posts over there:

The family's house, which was near the Savage/Lundy trailhead, was at 3,500 ft. elevation, where the temperatures we are assuming from the El Portal station were at 2,000 ft elevation. They may have judged the conditions by feel from the cooler temps at their house. Savage/Lundy and Devil's Gulch were probably hotter than both.

The poor moderators on Websleuths are clearly working overtime on this case. While I absolutely respect their "victim friendly" posting rule, I thought this post from them was hysterical, and I'm glad we have a bit more freedom here.

"Again: Websleuths is victim-friendly and speculation has to be fact-based.

No more lifestyle speculation based on donut orders.

Any discussion of obsessions or compulsions has to be based on stronger evidence than someone ordering a gluten-free (or even a sugar-free) donut. Someone buying a donut from a donut store does not mean they consider themselves morally and/or intellectually superior to others, nor does the type of donut purchased constitute evidence of an eating disorder, grandiose ideation or a sense of entitlement.

As we wait for more validated information, please keep the speculation based on the evidence we have so far. Thank you."

This is an EXCELLENT guideline.

Wish DCUM braintrust would follow that instead of actively finding ways to disparage the victims.

You can just go to Web Sleuths if that is more your speed. Victims aren't being disparaged here. Speculations are being made. Some with fact, some with fiction but the story is so crazy and odd and little information has been released that speculation is all anyone even Web Sleuths have to go on!

The story is not crazy. What makes it unusual is that the child and the family dog died as well. The assumptions being made are dumb to ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

I don't know how you heat stroke people are still denying that there is clearly something funny. There is now way they would close trails NOW if they didn't have some inclination of that. Again, people die of heat stroke out in the world all the time and it doesn't shut down parks. And they didn't only close the path in question so I do not think this is about looky loos.

Its a one in a million chance of winning the lottery, but a 100% chance someone wins it. Weird stuff happens, someone has to be the one in a million/billion that some freak incident happens to.

And before you all crow at me, it is not that I think it would be impossible or unlikely that they would die of heatstroke on a day like that. But the police are NOT acting in a way that implies that this is a straightforward heatstroke case. They just aren't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t know that it was simultaneous. If the wife went ahead to get help but collapsed the husband wouldn’t. Know. He may have been sitting there for a while.

They could have split up further back with the wife looking for help and the husband was trying to alternate resting and moving forward. My guess is that husband was trying to carry the dog in his arms and baby in the carrier.

All within a few minutes of each other is pretty much simultaneous. And wouldn't either of them who saw the other collapsing tried to use the cell phone? You people just come up with wacky scenarios when its more likely they were victims of something toxic that got them all at once or it's a murder/suicide.

You seem incapable of absorbing information. This has been discussed many times but you remain oblivious to any change to educate yourself.

You seem to think that DCUM discussing something is the actual truth. You are oblivious on how options are considered and analyzed and just follow DCUM-groupthink and postings of dramatic depictions of how the events unfolded. Try to use that brain of yours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don’t know that it was simultaneous. If the wife went ahead to get help but collapsed the husband wouldn’t. Know. He may have been sitting there for a while.

They could have split up further back with the wife looking for help and the husband was trying to alternate resting and moving forward. My guess is that husband was trying to carry the dog in his arms and baby in the carrier.

All within a few minutes of each other is pretty much simultaneous. And wouldn't either of them who saw the other collapsing tried to use the cell phone? You people just come up with wacky scenarios when its more likely they were victims of something toxic that got them all at once or it's a murder/suicide.

You seem incapable of absorbing information. This has been discussed many times but you remain oblivious to any change to educate yourself.

You seem to think that DCUM discussing something is the actual truth. You are oblivious on how options are considered and analyzed and just follow DCUM-groupthink and postings of dramatic depictions of how the events unfolded. Try to use that brain of yours.

Nah. Legitimately stupid ideas are being given too much air here. This used to be unusual for this site.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think buying a sugar free or gluten free so it if no celiac or diabetes absolutely does characterize a person! But I digress. DP

It's very Californian, TBH.

It’s very DC too - for anyone who tries to stay fit.

District Donut in DC has gluten free donuts. So it's not just a California thing.
And gluten free is for people who's digestive systems cannot tolerate gluten. Others opt for gluten free because it's anti-inflammatory compared to regular wheat. It has nothing to do with diabetes and spiking insulin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think buying a sugar free or gluten free so it if no celiac or diabetes absolutely does characterize a person! But I digress. DP

It's very Californian, TBH.

It’s very DC too - for anyone who tries to stay fit.

District Donut in DC has gluten free donuts. So it's not just a California thing.
And gluten free is for people who's digestive systems cannot tolerate gluten. Others opt for gluten free because it's anti-inflammatory compared to regular wheat. It has nothing to do with diabetes and spiking insulin.

The diabetes/insulin thing people are talking about has to do with the sugar free donuts, I think.

[Anonymous]

Other than temp, what harm or events led to heat stroke? They're not mutually exclusive, and the latter doesn't necessarily overpower the former. Can we agree on this? - I'm the "summon the spirit reader" pp. Haven't posted since.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Other than temp, what harm or events led to heat stroke? They're not mutually exclusive, and the latter doesn't necessarily overpower the former. Can we agree on this? - I'm the "summon the spirit reader" pp. Haven't posted since.

Perhaps dehydration, but its called heat stroke its about the heat.

I agree that it might have been one bad encounter that made them sick and therefore more susceptible to heat stroke but I also think that the part service closing the area today means there is an environmental danger we haven't been informed of yet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Other than temp, what harm or events led to heat stroke? They're not mutually exclusive, and the latter doesn't necessarily overpower the former. Can we agree on this? - I'm the "summon the spirit reader" pp. Haven't posted since.

I'm not sure, but on the Facebook thread someone was asking about the source of water for their home and if they were using a well. I'd so they mentioned the possibility of arsenic in the water.

[Anonymous]

I have read a lot about this case and it seems to me that a bunch of circumstances have come together with tragic results.

Inexperienced hikers who overestimated their abilities and perhaps did not plan properly, brutal temperatures, perhaps something unforeseen like taking the wrong trail or the dog not being able to walk and needing to carried. And from then on things went south rapidly as often happens in similar cases.

The trail being closed certainly complicates things but it may really just be to keep people from snooping around and possibly getting into trouble themselves.