Cheating Scandal Triggering TJ Change

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What people fail to understand is that the Asian kid will knock the socks of the class in their base school, a whole heck of a lot easier than having to seriously amp up their academic game at TJ. If anything, this crazy scheme just ensured more Asian success because now many of those academically-focused Asian kids will be at their base schools and completely dwarfing any chance for success for the rest of the non-Asians. Where once you had the possibility for an AA or Hispanic or White valedictorian, or your child is in the top .5% of the graduating class, that'll now be all Asian irrespective of what high school you attend. The irony of this move will be baffling for most in a few years time.

What most are missing is that you can't keep an Asian kid down when it comes to academic success. It's being bred at home. And, if the AA or Hispanic or White races can't start that breeding at home, where it matters the most, you'll never fair better than an Asian child. It's as simple as that. Like the Russian poster noted, some have figured it out and have implemented the training early.

Why here? Why now?

If Asians will do well anywhere, what does it matter?

The US and especially FCPS is simply not 90% Asian.

It really doesn't matter! I think you may find some Asians truly bothered by it because they believe it's an unfair practice to single them out and there is an inherent Asian bias happening in most elite academic setting (as represented by the DOJ v Yale case and the SFA v Harvard case, and being litigated in some public school setting). So long term, it is a problem, and something that most Asians shouldn't totally disregard. I don't fully understand what you mean by "why here why now." I suppose I can say because we exist and are here. You seem to think that admissions rates to tier 1 programs should be correlated to the % of population in the area. Admissions to tier 1 most likely correlates with academic success (primary) and interest from the student (secondary). Everything else is a wash. TJ is 60%+ Asian because most Asian students academic success far overshadow that of a AA+Hispanic+White student. There's no other way to put this nicely. And it seems like everyone knows that, but then folks make silly arguments like "well we believe in a well rounded child, and would like them to build other interests" (or some variation of that, whether it's sports or whatever). There's no Asian making that sort of argument. Asians believe in academic success first and foremost. Then it's "other interest." So maybe instead of focusing on "why 90% Asian," perhaps maybe the AA+Hispanic+White races should get off their high pedestals and instill some academic rigor into your kids life starting in pre-school. Perhaps take the outlook that most Asian families have taken. Then you can sit and whine about why your kids aren't able to compete with the Asians. But, I'll tell you this, if you started with fostering the academic rigor from an early childhood perspective, your White+Black+Hispanic kid wouldn't need a lottery system to get in.

To the poster above, thanks for breaking it down. Couldn't agree more, and I'm not Asian.

It doesn't matter what the FCPS does or even what the VA Governor/legislature does. Any consideration of race in admission to selective schools or universities will be prohibited in the near future by the SCOTUS.

Are you a lawyer? The reason I am asking is because what you are saying does not make sense - I do not see any consideration of race in this new lottery admissions process. A more equitable system can be and should be the outcome, but they are not selecting based on race. I'm also sure FCPS has thought about and possibly consulted with lawyers on whether their new selection process would withstand a legal challenge.

In addition to 6-3 super majority conservative Justices salivating to strike down any admissions system that considers or has disparate impact on racial groups, Trump managed to appoint/confirm literally hundreds of District Court Judges and Court of Appeal Judges in 3.5 years and idiotic Democratic senators happily obliged.

The new TJ admissions system will be struck down by a district judge, appellate judge or ultimately by the ultra conservative supreme court. I have practiced law for decades and have followed affirmative action issue/use of race in selective schools issue for over 20 years.

Looks like Trump appointed about 53 judges to the Court of Appeals (4 to fourth circuit) and 159 District Court judges (3 to EDVA) and 2 to supreme court. There are about 46 additional District Court Judges waiting for confirmation to take place in September/October.

Why are Democrats allowing all these confirmations?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did somehow people cheat to get into the school?

In a nutshell, one prep company prepped 28% of this years freshman. That’s 133 kids. It’s insane given how competing the prep company market is in NVa. Two years ago, they got 51 kids in and last year it was around 80. The company has been around for YEARS, so such a massive increase raises eyebrows. The company (foolishly) posted the lists of first and last names TJ admits to their FB page each year, so it’s easy to verify.

THEN, current TJ students started posting online on various social media that the company HAD A COPY of the test ahead of time. This test is supposed to be “unpreppable” but the company got students to report back what the questions were after the test. Then they used that to help the students taking the test on the accommodations day, summer round admissions and of course for the next years class. Apparently FCPS and the owners of the TJ admissions test have been watching the company for a while, so this was a good opportunity to do something. This prep company is making millions off of gaming the TJ admissions process.

Added on top of that the this prep company virtually ONLY preps students of one specific background. Added to that almost no Hispanic or black students were admitted and girls were sorely underrepresented as well. It just looks disgusting and simply cannot continue.

Our very own Varsity Blues-type scandal for FCPS. Awesome, thanks cheaters for creating a problem during a time when there are already plenty of problems.

None of what you described is cheating.

Prepping using non-public information about the contents of the test is absolutely cheating. Not even a close call.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Did somehow people cheat to get into the school?

In a nutshell, one prep company prepped 28% of this years freshman. That’s 133 kids. It’s insane given how competing the prep company market is in NVa. Two years ago, they got 51 kids in and last year it was around 80. The company has been around for YEARS, so such a massive increase raises eyebrows. The company (foolishly) posted the lists of first and last names TJ admits to their FB page each year, so it’s easy to verify.

THEN, current TJ students started posting online on various social media that the company HAD A COPY of the test ahead of time. This test is supposed to be “unpreppable” but the company got students to report back what the questions were after the test. Then they used that to help the students taking the test on the accommodations day, summer round admissions and of course for the next years class. Apparently FCPS and the owners of the TJ admissions test have been watching the company for a while, so this was a good opportunity to do something. This prep company is making millions off of gaming the TJ admissions process.

Added on top of that the this prep company virtually ONLY preps students of one specific background. Added to that almost no Hispanic or black students were admitted and girls were sorely underrepresented as well. It just looks disgusting and simply cannot continue.

Our very own Varsity Blues-type scandal for FCPS. Awesome, thanks cheaters for creating a problem during a time when there are already plenty of problems.

None of what you described is cheating.

Prepping using non-public information about the contents of the test is absolutely cheating. Not even a close call.

Too bad your obsessive postings will mean absolutely nothing since lot has changed since yesterday.

[Anonymous]

Prepping using non-public information about the contents of the test is absolutely cheating. Not even a close call.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This. But, kids should not need a prep class to get in. FCPS should figure out a way to eliminate those classes. I suspect the demographics would not change much.

Can the county ban any testing center that preps kids for TJ? If they did, then there will be illegal prep centers cropping up in basements. How to solve this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:TJ needs to reflect the population more. Asians are not inherently smarter. They just prepping more. TJ needs to be more balanced.

What dataset are you looking at?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Understand that in many white, AA, and Hispanic homes other things are valued rather than prep at all cost. Many are involved in their houses of worship, league sports, helping out in the family business at a young age, working a job at age 15 etc. "Prepping" at all costs is not the norm for American kids nor has it ever been.

This is the definition of a racist. My asian kids are involved with their church, help out with family business , work a summer job. At the same time, they value their education very much and make studying (not prepping) their priority . They don't play league sports because they just are not qualified enough. Ironically, nobody has a problem with sports (where there is an obvious lack of Asian representation) being able to select by merit, but god forbid, asian kids being a majority in a magnet school and everybody gets their panties in a twist.

There are lots of different sports opportunities out there for kids to participate in. A kid who isn’t participating in sports in some way is either not interested or hasn’t been exposed to sports by the parents. Just as some kids need encouragement in their academics, some kids need encouragement in athletics and it is up to the parents to make sure kids are developing physically as well as mentally.

Except most Asian families aren't going to promote sports over academics. That's just not how they roll. If their Asian kid is interested in playing soccer or basketball, sure they'll sign them up for it. But the minute it jeopardizes their grades, or they see the kid doesn't have enough time to do both, guess what gets the ax. Whereas in other races, the parents may opt to keep the kids in sports and ask them to do try harder with school. It's a different mentality. I think that is the distinction that non-Asians should understand.

I'm the PP whose kids do not play league sports. I never said my kids do not participate in sports. They just do it recreationally. No competition because they don't qualify and frankly aren't all that interested in competing. They choose to focus on academics because that's where they shine and where their interests lie. I introduced my kids to many different sports, but if they are not good enough to make a team, I am not going to jump up and down demanding that they be let in in the name of diversity (for example, their middle school basketball team was made up of Blacks/Whites, not a single Asian kid. Those kids were picked for their abilities and I am fine with it. Why was it that those kids were better than my asian kids? Well, I know for a fact that most of them played for travel teams and my kids didn't. Why would travel team not be an unfair advantage?)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Understand that in many white, AA, and Hispanic homes other things are valued rather than prep at all cost. Many are involved in their houses of worship, league sports, helping out in the family business at a young age, working a job at age 15 etc. "Prepping" at all costs is not the norm for American kids nor has it ever been.

This is the definition of a racist. My asian kids are involved with their church, help out with family business , work a summer job. At the same time, they value their education very much and make studying (not prepping) their priority . They don't play league sports because they just are not qualified enough. Ironically, nobody has a problem with sports (where there is an obvious lack of Asian representation) being able to select by merit, but god forbid, asian kids being a majority in a magnet school and everybody gets their panties in a twist.

There are lots of different sports opportunities out there for kids to participate in. A kid who isn’t participating in sports in some way is either not interested or hasn’t been exposed to sports by the parents. Just as some kids need encouragement in their academics, some kids need encouragement in athletics and it is up to the parents to make sure kids are developing physically as well as mentally.

Except most Asian families aren't going to promote sports over academics. That's just not how they roll. If their Asian kid is interested in playing soccer or basketball, sure they'll sign them up for it. But the minute it jeopardizes their grades, or they see the kid doesn't have enough time to do both, guess what gets the ax. Whereas in other races, the parents may opt to keep the kids in sports and ask them to do try harder with school. It's a different mentality. I think that is the distinction that non-Asians should understand.

I'm the PP whose kids do not play league sports. I never said my kids do not participate in sports. They just do it recreationally. No competition because they don't qualify and frankly aren't all that interested in competing. They choose to focus on academics because that's where they shine and where their interests lie. I introduced my kids to many different sports, but if they are not good enough to make a team, I am not going to jump up and down demanding that they be let in in the name of diversity (for example, their middle school basketball team was made up of Blacks/Whites, not a single Asian kid. Those kids were picked for their abilities and I am fine with it. Why was it that those kids were better than my asian kids? Well, I know for a fact that most of them played for travel teams and my kids didn't. Why would travel team not be an unfair advantage?)

How much time do your kids spend on sports each day? Recreational sports tend to take less time and involve less physical exertion than other forms of sports that are available.

[Anonymous]

Maybe TJ will be different, but that doesn't mean it will be "destroyed."

Making TJ different sounds like something we need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe TJ will be different, but that doesn't mean it will be "destroyed."

Making TJ different sounds like something we need.

Exactly. Especially if it's not full of cheaters or the product of testing centers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe TJ will be different, but that doesn't mean it will be "destroyed."

Making TJ different sounds like something we need.

Exactly. Especially if it's not full of cheaters or the product of testing centers.

I thought hundreds of people criminally charged and convicted and sentenced for the most egregious cheating involving schools were conniving and scheming white ass people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe TJ will be different, but that doesn't mean it will be "destroyed."

Making TJ different sounds like something we need.

Exactly. Especially if it's not full of cheaters or the product of testing centers.

I thought hundreds of people criminally charged and convicted and sentenced for the most egregious cheating involving schools were conniving and scheming white ass people.

How cute. A cheater defending your actions by re-directing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a white TJ graduate and I would be FINE if the percentage of white students stayed the same or (even better) went down, while the percentages of other under-represented minorities became more balanced across the board. I definitely don't care about making TJ white again. I do care about giving black and brown students (esp from disadvantaged backgrounds) a chance.

And, since I obv have no skin in the game as an old person alumni, I'll say that if my kid was applying to TJ (he isn't; we don't live in Fx anymore), I'd be fine if he wasn't accepted so that a student of color could attend. My kid gets lots of privilege from his parents' status as white people, and, while TJ might be a great opportunity for him, it's perfectly acceptable to me to give up a "spot" so others without that kind of systemic privilege have more opportunity.

Please don't assume that all alumni (or even most) support admission reform b/c they want TJ to be more white again.

I think it is about making TJ less Asian, than more white. This is systemic racism towards Asians. Most Asians are immigrants with no family money or white privilege backing them. They are not large enough to have a voice being still a minority community and many still have language barriers and poor writing skills. FCPS should not try to bring down one population at the expense of another.

Asians are in the wealthiest racial group in the country.

Only a racist could believe that. The wealthiest racial group in this country is white.

[Anonymous]

Rampant racism on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Cheating is not a racist issue.

Our children deserve a learning environment that fuels integrity, not one that discourages it.