Anyone else surprised by a lack of interest in William & Mary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Our oldest (sophomore) has already ruled out W&M and UVA. She's an honors student, and could be on track for both. She thinks W&M is a pressure cooker and UVA is too snobby. She's going with Virginia Tech.

Has she toured there?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I had three kids (all girls) apply to William & Mary at my insistence. None went. Two ended up at UVA, and the other went to a SLAC that offered lots of merit aid.

My oldest joked: "What do they do there on weekends? Make candles?"

I'm now seeing that only 1/3 of admitted in state applicants end up choosing William & Mary, whereas at UVA well over half end up going. Clearly UVA is the more popular choice.

UVA is much larger. In one sense it has to be the more popular choice. They have nearly 3X as many spots to fill.

Harvard is smaller than UVA but clearly more popular. It’s not just about size. UVA and W&M applicants have pretty much the same credentials, but when given the choice UVA more often than not wins out. That’s the point.

[Anonymous]

I would pin it on the current W&M president. All about woke and nothing else. Screwed up hire after hire and messing with the traditions that have made it a great institution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would pin it on the current W&M president. All about woke and nothing else. Screwed up hire after hire and messing with the traditions that have made it a great institution.

Can you expand on which traditions she messed up? Still have Yule log, bell ringing, convocation etc. I can’t think of one big tradition that is no longer there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

I visited a friend there and it was fratty with a lot of drinking and drugs.

Maybe it’s changed?

I don’t see why W&M would have less drinking than other schools…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

OP here: did your kid find it cutthroat and overly intense and competitive among students? Did they experience grade deflation?

The average GPA at W&M in 2014 was a 3.33 (https://gradeinflation.com/Williamandmary.html) ; I’m quite sure it’s gone up since then. It has a reputation for “grade deflation” but that doesn’t seem to be the case anymore. That said, it could still be cutthroat and intense I suppose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:W&M seems to have so much going for it--well regarded academically, smaller, historic, located in quaint town, and cost-effective if in-state VA. But my in-state DC (with stats to get in) has no interest, and none of their friends do either. They consider it high pressure, low fun. They have heard that it's cutthroat among students. They find the campus old and dated.

DC is applying to Wake Forest, Davidson, and W&L, among a few others. It seems to me that W&M should be right in that mix.

Does W&M have a branding problem? Or is there some truth to the perceptions? I'm pretty much going to insist that DC apply there, to have an in-state LAC option.

This IS the brand. "old and dated campus, high pressure and low fun". Also, sports are kinda not there like UVA or Tech. That IS how kids know W&M. My DS had it on his list but he was mostly a history nerd, who had never drank before going to college. He got into UVA ED so didn't end up considering it and is thrilled with his UVA experience. That said, its certainly the right place for the right type of person.

[Anonymous]

My kid is exactly the kind of kid who would like W&M, and she likely would have gotten in ED, but she just didn’t want to be in Williamsburg. She wanted to be closer to a big city.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

W&M has a greater no. of students participating in frats than UVA. Also, you can go to UVA for four years and never once step into a greek house - they are all off campus.

I am curious if anyone really turned down UVA to go to W&M if admitted to both?

Yes. UVA is very large and extremely competitive. Not everyone loves UVA contrary to popular opinion.

I literally don’t know anyone who has turned down UVA for W&M. Not. One.

My DS did it 2 years ago as did many of his current classmates. UVa is a fine school, but not for everyone. I know it's hard for some to imagine that.

y

My son did too. He liked the size and vibe of student body better than UVA. And he was a 35 ACT, uw 4.0/4.6w. He also is a liberal arts major.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M seems to have so much going for it--well regarded academically, smaller, historic, located in quaint town, and cost-effective if in-state VA. But my in-state DC (with stats to get in) has no interest, and none of their friends do either. They consider it high pressure, low fun. They have heard that it's cutthroat among students. They find the campus old and dated.

DC is applying to Wake Forest, Davidson, and W&L, among a few others. It seems to me that W&M should be right in that mix.

Does W&M have a branding problem? Or is there some truth to the perceptions? I'm pretty much going to insist that DC apply there, to have an in-state LAC option.

This IS the brand. "old and dated campus, high pressure and low fun". Also, sports are kinda not there like UVA or Tech. That IS how kids know W&M. My DS had it on his list but he was mostly a history nerd, who had never drank before going to college. He got into UVA ED so didn't end up considering it and is thrilled with his UVA experience. That said, its certainly the right place for the right type of person.

Alum and parent of a current junior here. This couldn't be more wrong. I'm really not sure how this got started or why some people feel the need to keep pushing this idea, but for those of us who actually know the school these comments look silly, as is wondering if people would actually choose it over UVa. My kid did, as did many others. It's more surprising to me that people are shocked that kids with the same qualifications can prefer different schools. Kids who get into multiple Ivies have to make choices too, and usually they decide based on school culture, feeling on campus, preference for size, what they hear from other kids, etc. It's really not shocking that kids who get into both UVa and William and Mary will divide according to their personal preferences.

[Anonymous]

Huh. Di en that no one wants to attend, it’s strange that their stats are nearly identical to UVAs. And, in fact, have risen faster in the last 5 years than UVAs. Any idea why that would be, if no one wants to go?

Ps: all the posters insisting it’s a miserable place to attend school don’t make much sense given that one list after list WM is top 10 in student happiness.

To op— after 4 years start a new thread. WM has gotten a lot more competitive in the last 5 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M seems to have so much going for it--well regarded academically, smaller, historic, located in quaint town, and cost-effective if in-state VA. But my in-state DC (with stats to get in) has no interest, and none of their friends do either. They consider it high pressure, low fun. They have heard that it's cutthroat among students. They find the campus old and dated.

DC is applying to Wake Forest, Davidson, and W&L, among a few others. It seems to me that W&M should be right in that mix.

Does W&M have a branding problem? Or is there some truth to the perceptions? I'm pretty much going to insist that DC apply there, to have an in-state LAC option.

This IS the brand. "old and dated campus, high pressure and low fun". Also, sports are kinda not there like UVA or Tech. That IS how kids know W&M. My DS had it on his list but he was mostly a history nerd, who had never drank before going to college. He got into UVA ED so didn't end up considering it and is thrilled with his UVA experience. That said, its certainly the right place for the right type of person.

Alum and parent of a current junior here. This couldn't be more wrong. I'm really not sure how this got started or why some people feel the need to keep pushing this idea, but for those of us who actually know the school these comments look silly, as is wondering if people would actually choose it over UVa. My kid did, as did many others. It's more surprising to me that people are shocked that kids with the same qualifications can prefer different schools. Kids who get into multiple Ivies have to make choices too, and usually they decide based on school culture, feeling on campus, preference for size, what they hear from other kids, etc. It's really not shocking that kids who get into both UVa and William and Mary will divide according to their personal preferences.

+1. Parent of a kid working very hard, but feeling less pressure than at her competing FCPS HS. And having a blast. So thankful she ended up at the exact right school for her.

[Anonymous]

I don’t think that much has changed at W&M over the decades. It attracts some really smart kids who want a quieter atmosphere than UVA. They tend to be politically liberal, though not always, and more socially conservative. But it doesn’t seem particularly vibrant or cutting-edge, so a lot of smart kids won’t consider it at all and overall UVA, VT, and other schools will continue to appeal to more top applicants.

And that’s OK. There are a lot of schools out there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M seems to have so much going for it--well regarded academically, smaller, historic, located in quaint town, and cost-effective if in-state VA. But my in-state DC (with stats to get in) has no interest, and none of their friends do either. They consider it high pressure, low fun. They have heard that it's cutthroat among students. They find the campus old and dated.

DC is applying to Wake Forest, Davidson, and W&L, among a few others. It seems to me that W&M should be right in that mix.

Does W&M have a branding problem? Or is there some truth to the perceptions? I'm pretty much going to insist that DC apply there, to have an in-state LAC option.

This IS the brand. "old and dated campus, high pressure and low fun". Also, sports are kinda not there like UVA or Tech. That IS how kids know W&M. My DS had it on his list but he was mostly a history nerd, who had never drank before going to college. He got into UVA ED so didn't end up considering it and is thrilled with his UVA experience. That said, its certainly the right place for the right type of person.

Alum and parent of a current junior here. This couldn't be more wrong. I'm really not sure how this got started or why some people feel the need to keep pushing this idea, but for those of us who actually know the school these comments look silly, as is wondering if people would actually choose it over UVa. My kid did, as did many others. It's more surprising to me that people are shocked that kids with the same qualifications can prefer different schools. Kids who get into multiple Ivies have to make choices too, and usually they decide based on school culture, feeling on campus, preference for size, what they hear from other kids, etc. It's really not shocking that kids who get into both UVa and William and Mary will divide according to their personal preferences.

um I think you are reading too much into my post. My DS was torn between UVA and W&M for ED, so he went with UVA ED1 and was going to do W&M ED2. There were three reasons he landed on UVA. 1. The cost. 2. The distance/drive from where we live (NOVA) 3. More of a sports atmosphere.

ABSOLUTELY I agree 1000% that there are people who choose W&M over UVA and the other way around. It's not really a competition becuse they do attract very different populations. My point is that the "brand" of W&M is what it is because it's different than what UVA or tech offers. They each have their own distinct personalities. My DS would have been happy and successful i am sure at W&M. My DD who did not like W&M's setting and dorms AT ALL, didn't even have it on her list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our oldest (sophomore) has already ruled out W&M and UVA. She's an honors student, and could be on track for both. She thinks W&M is a pressure cooker and UVA is too snobby. She's going with Virginia Tech.

Has she toured there?

DP here. Students tend to shy away from those schools because it feels too much like High School 2.0. I have heard from current students that UVA is easier than their HS and WM is not.