Anti aging and pedophilic patriarchy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

A man shaving everything off down there is weird, too. I really think it's the porn effect.

+1
I would be seriously grossed out if my husband did that. Or any man.

You're obviously 40+.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

But men are not told they are unclean or gross if they choose not to fully remove all their body and facial hair. A man may choose to shave or not, but it's an aesthetic choice and people are accepting either way. Men with beards are not given dirty looks or called gross. A woman who doesn't shave her armpits would get both.

Men go to the pool with hairy legs and arms and backs and chests, and no one says anything. They may even have hair on their stomachs or lower back that is likely an extension of pubic hair, and people would not really care because they are men and they are allowed to have body hair. A woman at the pool with visible leg hair or back hair, or some visible pubic hair, would be made fun of and avoided.

It's not the same. A lot of grooming is not a true choice for women unless they are willing to accept a limited social role or cover themselves up. Many women only shave and wax out of fear of judgement or to be socially acceptable, and not because it's a genuine choice they are making for personal preference only.

I've run into a few young women in their twenties who don't shave their body hair. They seem to intentionally wear revealing clothing to let everyone see where they stand. Fine.

I think those are the women who are flouting convention and saying a big F U to patriarchal views on beauty.

Yes, obviously. And yet, no one cares.
DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn't want to date a bald man with a paunch so guess there are biases on both sides.

Sure, but having some kind of bush = woman. Being bald down there = prepubescent.

Eh, give it a rest.

"Having some kind of facial hair = man. Being cleanshaven = prepubescent."

This gets boring so fast.

Yes, exactly. Lots of youthful looking men grow facial hair precisely for the reason that - they look prepubescent without facial hair.

But, if the man without the facial hair looks like an adult, it doesn't matter.

Unlike a man's face, you can't really tell the age of a woman by looking at her shaved pubic area. So, if she has no hair there, yes, it can look prepubescent.

Please stop shaving your armpits and legs immediately. You look prepubescent if you shave those. See how dumb you sound. Stop policing what women do with their bodies.

But if a woman didn't shave or wax her armpits or legs, she would be policed for it instantly. She would be called gross and unhygienic.

The policing is happening already, all the time.

All the more reason for other women to stop saying dumb shit about women who choose to wax.

Well said. Low IQ "feminist" sez "you were so brainwashed by the patriarchy that you can't think; therefore you wax". As if I'm that dumb. Fck off with your condescension. A beefy, hairy lesbian does not have more feminist credibility than I do just by virtue of her grooming and sex partner decisions.

Sigh. This comment. We will never rise above this level of less than.

Such a huge topic. Devolves into snitty waxing wars. We aren't seeing the forest for the trees.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

A man shaving everything off down there is weird, too. I really think it's the porn effect.

+1
I would be seriously grossed out if my husband did that. Or any man.

You're obviously 40+.

And?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 21 yo daughter and all her friends wax everything off. While it’s completely her choice, I do inwardly cringe when I think about how this is the expectation these days. She said she just likes to feel totally clean and not have to worry in her swimsuit, which I totally understand. I’ve always waxed my bikini line, but the idea of taking it *all* off is so extreme to me.

Oh well - it’s her body, not mine.

On the one hand, yes, your daughter and her friends of course get to make their own choices about their bodies.

On the other hadn't, think of how much time and money they will spend on removing all the hair from their bodies so that they can wear whatever skimpy bathing suit is in fashion and "not have to worry."

Think of what they could spend that time and money on instead.

Yes, of course. Not sure why you felt the need to tell me that - again, it’s her body and her money. She can do what she pleases. I’m sure you agree.

I agree she can do what she wants. But is it her money? She's 21, how much money does she have? A Brazilian is like $60-100 every time, and you have to keep it up once you do it because regrowth is painful. If she's also doing underarms, upper lip, and eyebrows, that's another 40-50 each time. If you do legs too, that's like another 70-80. That's going to add up quickly. Will you have money left for bikinis or vacations, at 21?

Or is someone else footing the bill for all this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn't want to date a bald man with a paunch so guess there are biases on both sides.

Sure, but having some kind of bush = woman. Being bald down there = prepubescent.

Eh, give it a rest.

"Having some kind of facial hair = man. Being cleanshaven = prepubescent."

This gets boring so fast.

Yes, exactly. Lots of youthful looking men grow facial hair precisely for the reason that - they look prepubescent without facial hair.

But, if the man without the facial hair looks like an adult, it doesn't matter.

Unlike a man's face, you can't really tell the age of a woman by looking at her shaved pubic area. So, if she has no hair there, yes, it can look prepubescent.

Please stop shaving your armpits and legs immediately. You look prepubescent if you shave those. See how dumb you sound. Stop policing what women do with their bodies.

But if a woman didn't shave or wax her armpits or legs, she would be policed for it instantly. She would be called gross and unhygienic.

The policing is happening already, all the time.

All the more reason for other women to stop saying dumb shit about women who choose to wax.

I get what you're saying, and I'm not the person who was criticizing waxing, but I actually agree with them that we should ask ourselves what the norms are and why. I don't judge a woman who waxes, but I do question a man who prefers it. And I do wonder about the way we talk about hair on women (other than their heads) as unclean or unhygienic. It's worth discussing.

Certainly it is women who don't conform to a hairless standard who get criticism cause zed more than the other way around, yes?

Because hair is seen as masculine, but I don’t think it has anything to do with pedophilia.

What a load of bs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

DP - I hear you!! I also have very dark hair and fair skin and the armpits and bikini area have been a lifelong struggle for me. I finally decided to do laser about ten years ago and it has been life changing. I do not say that lightly. I spend countless hours of my life waxing, shaving, etc. and was always thinking about it. Laser was expensive, but the best thing I’ve ever done for myself. I didn’t “take it all off,” but did an extensive bikini area and underarms. I’m so much more confident now in situations like you describe.

I’m this poster ^^ and I just wanted to add that removing unwanted hair was *very much* for ME and MY comfort - not for any man, to include my husband. I wonder if the poster who keeps lecturing others on “feminism” and “the patriarchy” understands what that means. It means I have agency to do whatever I want to my own body without having to seek approval from any other person, to include her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

A man shaving everything off down there is weird, too. I really think it's the porn effect.

+1
I would be seriously grossed out if my husband did that. Or any man.

You're obviously 40+.

And?

Younger men groom. I get that they would gross you out, but that's the world now. It also cuts against the argument that grooming is patriarchal, because for the younger generation, most men also choose to groom. Most young women expect it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 21 yo daughter and all her friends wax everything off. While it’s completely her choice, I do inwardly cringe when I think about how this is the expectation these days. She said she just likes to feel totally clean and not have to worry in her swimsuit, which I totally understand. I’ve always waxed my bikini line, but the idea of taking it *all* off is so extreme to me.

Oh well - it’s her body, not mine.

On the one hand, yes, your daughter and her friends of course get to make their own choices about their bodies.

On the other hadn't, think of how much time and money they will spend on removing all the hair from their bodies so that they can wear whatever skimpy bathing suit is in fashion and "not have to worry."

Think of what they could spend that time and money on instead.

Yes, of course. Not sure why you felt the need to tell me that - again, it’s her body and her money. She can do what she pleases. I’m sure you agree.

I agree she can do what she wants. But is it her money? She's 21, how much money does she have? A Brazilian is like $60-100 every time, and you have to keep it up once you do it because regrowth is painful. If she's also doing underarms, upper lip, and eyebrows, that's another 40-50 each time. If you do legs too, that's like another 70-80. That's going to add up quickly. Will you have money left for bikinis or vacations, at 21?

Or is someone else footing the bill for all this?

Wow, it’s highly entertaining to see you fret over other people’s lives, money, and choices. She pays for her Brazilians all by her little self. She doesn’t wax any other areas. She’s currently on spring break, probably wearing a tiny bikini, and the entire bill was footed by her and her friends.

So to answer your truly inane questions, she can do whatever she wants with her own body and her own money. Don’t you fret. Oh, and mind your own business.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 21 yo daughter and all her friends wax everything off. While it’s completely her choice, I do inwardly cringe when I think about how this is the expectation these days. She said she just likes to feel totally clean and not have to worry in her swimsuit, which I totally understand. I’ve always waxed my bikini line, but the idea of taking it *all* off is so extreme to me.

Oh well - it’s her body, not mine.

On the one hand, yes, your daughter and her friends of course get to make their own choices about their bodies.

On the other hadn't, think of how much time and money they will spend on removing all the hair from their bodies so that they can wear whatever skimpy bathing suit is in fashion and "not have to worry."

Think of what they could spend that time and money on instead.

Yes, of course. Not sure why you felt the need to tell me that - again, it’s her body and her money. She can do what she pleases. I’m sure you agree.

I agree she can do what she wants. But is it her money? She's 21, how much money does she have? A Brazilian is like $60-100 every time, and you have to keep it up once you do it because regrowth is painful. If she's also doing underarms, upper lip, and eyebrows, that's another 40-50 each time. If you do legs too, that's like another 70-80. That's going to add up quickly. Will you have money left for bikinis or vacations, at 21?

Or is someone else footing the bill for all this?

Wow, it’s highly entertaining to see you fret over other people’s lives, money, and choices. She pays for her Brazilians all by her little self. She doesn’t wax any other areas. She’s currently on spring break, probably wearing a tiny bikini, and the entire bill was footed by her and her friends.

So to answer your truly inane questions, she can do whatever she wants with her own body and her own money. Don’t you fret. Oh, and mind your own business.

Great response. Previous poster somehow blind to the irony of shaming a woman because of the cost of her grooming choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

A man shaving everything off down there is weird, too. I really think it's the porn effect.

+1
I would be seriously grossed out if my husband did that. Or any man.

You're obviously 40+.

And?

Younger men groom. I get that they would gross you out, but that's the world now. It also cuts against the argument that grooming is patriarchal, because for the younger generation, most men also choose to groom. Most young women expect it.

I’m not one of the posters claiming any grooming is patriarchal. Quite the opposite, in fact. Women can choose what to do with their own bodies.

However, I do disagree with your assertion that “younger men groom.” I’m sure plenty do, but definitely not the majority.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are the anti-hair people also against eyebrow grooming and facial hair removal?

You’re so dense. You’re being asked to consider why. Stop being defensive and look at the bigger picture. Look at what we are doing to our children.

Simple question: are you suggesting we should keep our unibrows, mustaches, and chin hairs?

DP but I think people are just suggesting we start asking WHY we do some of this stuff, who it is for, and who benefits.

Today I had an appointment for my ortho, where I had to do some practical physical tests, so I wore workout clothes. It's warm today, so I wanted short sleeves, but I discovered I only had long sleeve or tank workout tops that were clean. The thing about a tank is that when I do these tests at my ortho, I have to reach above my head and stretch my arms out, and people can see my underarms. Now, I shave my underarms. But I just feel sort of uncomfortable about how they look. I have dark hair and pale skin, so even with shaving, there's a little shadow there. If I were at the gym I'd wouldn't worry about it, but I was thinking about being in an office with people looking at my body and watching me do these tests, and I felt uncomfortable about it. I wound up wearing the tank but then wearing a hoody over it, so that I could keep the hoody on for the tests, even though honestly I felt hot in the hoody.

Maybe you never worry about stuff like that, but reread this thread. Hair on women is "masculine", "untidy", "gross." Hairy and beefy thrown around as insults (along with lesbian). Women should be "clean" and "tidy" which means hairless except on their heads.

You can say I'm neurotic for feeling bad about how my *shaved* armpits look due to the fact that I'm a human being who has hair follicles in my armpit, but I look at this conversation and am like "yup, that's exactly why I felt weird about it and didn't want people to see it."

It's worth talking about. I'm not going to stop shaving my armpits (obviously! that would only make me feel worse and more self conscious) but that doesn't mean I don't recognize the way these expectations around how women's bodies are "supposed" to look (which is so different from how our bodies look naturally, especially as we age) can be a prison for us.

Why can't it just be a personal choice? Men choose whether to shave their faces, just as I choose to get my eyebrows, mustache, and chin hairs threaded. It's how I like to groom myself, much like my husband prefers to shave his face every morning.

? the PP is saying it's a personal choice. This thread is just discussing WHY the standard of beauty is set such that women feel thy need to wax their pubes off (which sounds incredibly painful).

Men groom, too, though.

A man shaving everything off down there is weird, too. I really think it's the porn effect.

+1
I would be seriously grossed out if my husband did that. Or any man.

You’re a child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a woman who has always looked young for my age and spent my 20s and early 30s looking like a 13 yr old girl (almost no curves, very thin, very young looking face), I already knew this.

In my 20s, I very rapidly learned that my appearance had a tendency to attract men who had straight up pedophilia leanings. I got hit on and asked out by older men a lot, and quickly started self selecting only towards men my own age or even a couple years younger as a safety precaution. Many men were extremely open about what they found appealing about me and my body, including just telling me that my size and appearance made them feel "powerful" or "like a protector". I was sexually assaulted when I was 26 which made me incredibly wary of men in general but especially any man who was physically much bigger than I was or seemed sexually aggressive in any way.

I'm much older now (mid-40s) and no longer have this look. I've had kids and look more womanly and my face has aged. I have never had any desire to try and preserve my youthful appearance and actually love that I look mature and adult now. I have a lot of emotional scars from my experiences, not just with sexual assault but with a whole variety of of manipulative and exploitative relationships (especially in work settings) that in retrospect I think had a lot to do with how young and innocent I looked, which I think drew in people who have these impulses to dominate and overpower other people (men AND women, btw, anyone who thinks there are no women with these impulses is wrong).

The entire Epstein case has been both upsetting for me, dragging up old trauma, but it also feels like a relief in many ways. Listening to people talk about how they had no idea so many people were so interested in young women, or felt comfortable with the exploitation of young women whether they participated or not, feels deeply validating.

People like to "other" sexual predators, but I view it as all part of a big continuum that many people you know and encounter every day are on. A lot of people just want to be able to force other people to do what they want, and a lot of people settle on young women (either actual girls or just young adult women who they feel they can physically and emotionally control) as a target for those desires.

The answer is empowerment of women and of children. The answer is a culture of consent. This means a lot of people, including people who think they are feminist or would never endorse exploitation but who regularly uphold systems that disempower women, children, immigrants, and others, need to rethink what they think they know about the world. I hope the Epstein files are a step in that direction.

Thank you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Bikini wax is 100% related to this.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Oh please. My botox just kicked in and I can finally look at myself without cringing. It's for me. Same with bikini wax. All for me. Stop acting like we don't have agency over what we actually like on our own bodies.

I don't like crop tops like the younger girls wear so I don't wear them. I don't like long hair barrel curls so I don't do those.

It’s all for you because you learned to hate the way you look naturally. Where did you learn it?

This is the dumbest post in a while. I get a Brazilian because I don't like that sweat and pee get trapped in the hair and produce the smell. I was single for 5 years and still got Brazilians. It's not even about the look.

This must be from a man.