PSA- Yes, you are a jerk if you don't invite your older parents to Christmas

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There said it. It is a few hours, stop trying to justify being a jerk. We all hate our in-laws and even some of our families, but you model being a decent person once a year.

If you had behaved in a manner that made your kids actually want to see you then you wouldn’t have to be here whining.

I agree with this. And I am not someone who excludes grandparents on holidays at all, despite not really liking either set. Both sets are constantly trying to tell DH and me (late 40's) what to do on every little thing like we are teenagers. One set is also racist and homophobic (though they would deny this strenuously) and I cannot tolerate that.

Weird assumption that the people who agree with OP are the parents. I for one am not, and I think parents and spouse parents should be invited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was inevitable this post would bring out all the whiny “I have trauma and boundaries” people. This post is not for you. We are not telling you to invite your abusive relative to Christmas. Stop making every damn post about you! Scroll along.

What you don't realize is that most people have difficult family members. It may not amount to a clinical definition of PTSD, but there is no reason to subject yourself to a grandparent's racist rants every holiday, or a mother's harping on every female relative's weight, including the young girls. It's not that you don't have some affection for these people, who despite their moral failings like you and have no doubt supported you in your life. But it doesn't follow that you would see them at a time when you most seek peace and quiet.

It's OK for everyone to choose how and when and where they interact with their relatives. I entirely agree with you that blood is thicker than water. I will contribute to eldercare, help out when someone is sick, send gifts to kids and spend precious summer vacation time with some of my relatives.

Christmas? No. I will enjoy my spiritual break in PEACE.

Case in point, Whiny Boundaries poster.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was inevitable this post would bring out all the whiny “I have trauma and boundaries” people. This post is not for you. We are not telling you to invite your abusive relative to Christmas. Stop making every damn post about you! Scroll along.

What you don't realize is that most people have difficult family members. It may not amount to a clinical definition of PTSD, but there is no reason to subject yourself to a grandparent's racist rants every holiday, or a mother's harping on every female relative's weight, including the young girls. It's not that you don't have some affection for these people, who despite their moral failings like you and have no doubt supported you in your life. But it doesn't follow that you would see them at a time when you most seek peace and quiet.

It's OK for everyone to choose how and when and where they interact with their relatives. I entirely agree with you that blood is thicker than water. I will contribute to eldercare, help out when someone is sick, send gifts to kids and spend precious summer vacation time with some of my relatives.

Christmas? No. I will enjoy my spiritual break in PEACE.

What you might not understand is that people can hear all of this and then still disagree and say nope, it’s one day a year, get your peace the other 364 days. It’s just a difference of opinion and that’s what message boards are all about. And this thread is about parents not other relatives.

As numerous people have pointed out, for many of us spending Christmas with parents or ILs is a minimum of 3-4 days because of the distance.

And here I will observe that the people I know who get to spend holidays with their kids and grandkids all the time are the people who have chosen to settle near their adult kids in retirement. And their kids welcomed those moves and were so grateful to have that family nearby and are happy to share holidays with them. Food for thought.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was inevitable this post would bring out all the whiny “I have trauma and boundaries” people. This post is not for you. We are not telling you to invite your abusive relative to Christmas. Stop making every damn post about you! Scroll along.

What you don't realize is that most people have difficult family members. It may not amount to a clinical definition of PTSD, but there is no reason to subject yourself to a grandparent's racist rants every holiday, or a mother's harping on every female relative's weight, including the young girls. It's not that you don't have some affection for these people, who despite their moral failings like you and have no doubt supported you in your life. But it doesn't follow that you would see them at a time when you most seek peace and quiet.

It's OK for everyone to choose how and when and where they interact with their relatives. I entirely agree with you that blood is thicker than water. I will contribute to eldercare, help out when someone is sick, send gifts to kids and spend precious summer vacation time with some of my relatives.

Christmas? No. I will enjoy my spiritual break in PEACE.

What you might not understand is that people can hear all of this and then still disagree and say nope, it’s one day a year, get your peace the other 364 days. It’s just a difference of opinion and that’s what message boards are all about. And this thread is about parents not other relatives.

As numerous people have pointed out, for many of us spending Christmas with parents or ILs is a minimum of 3-4 days because of the distance.

And here I will observe that the people I know who get to spend holidays with their kids and grandkids all the time are the people who have chosen to settle near their adult kids in retirement. And their kids welcomed those moves and were so grateful to have that family nearby and are happy to share holidays with them. Food for thought.

Well don’t be surprised when your kids move away and don’t invite you for Christmas. That is the behavior you modeled.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was inevitable this post would bring out all the whiny “I have trauma and boundaries” people. This post is not for you. We are not telling you to invite your abusive relative to Christmas. Stop making every damn post about you! Scroll along.

What you don't realize is that most people have difficult family members. It may not amount to a clinical definition of PTSD, but there is no reason to subject yourself to a grandparent's racist rants every holiday, or a mother's harping on every female relative's weight, including the young girls. It's not that you don't have some affection for these people, who despite their moral failings like you and have no doubt supported you in your life. But it doesn't follow that you would see them at a time when you most seek peace and quiet.

It's OK for everyone to choose how and when and where they interact with their relatives. I entirely agree with you that blood is thicker than water. I will contribute to eldercare, help out when someone is sick, send gifts to kids and spend precious summer vacation time with some of my relatives.

Christmas? No. I will enjoy my spiritual break in PEACE.

What you might not understand is that people can hear all of this and then still disagree and say nope, it’s one day a year, get your peace the other 364 days. It’s just a difference of opinion and that’s what message boards are all about. And this thread is about parents not other relatives.

PP you replied to. Posters are taking issue with the insult in the titled. If you are OP, then you need to stop doing that if you seek a polite debate. If we simply disagree on which day to see our parents (note that I referred to my mother, who is skeletally thin and believes anyone who is not is de facto fat and stupid), then we can courteously stop the discussion there and each visit on our preferred days.

OP started the fight by being horribly rude, no doubt on purpose to get a rise out of people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I don’t think any of us disagree that you made a choice.

It’s not the default that a nuclear family dissolves as PP put it.

Anonymous wrote:+1. Many of us still see our parents and in-laws on a regular basis. My husband is even still very close with several of his first cousins.

By definition, a nuclear family dissolves as your kids become adults. Which is why we use the term extended family. You may still spend time with whichever relatives you want, but the family you had with young kids is gone forever. Which is also why you don't get to decide any more whom your adult kids spend their Christmas with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I don’t think any of us disagree that you made a choice.

It’s not the default that a nuclear family dissolves as PP put it.

Anonymous wrote:+1. Many of us still see our parents and in-laws on a regular basis. My husband is even still very close with several of his first cousins.

By definition, a nuclear family dissolves as your kids become adults. Which is why we use the term extended family. You may still spend time with whichever relatives you want, but the family you had with young kids is gone forever. Which is also why you don't get to decide any more whom your adult kids spend their Christmas with.

You are really salty today aren't you? I'm sorry you don't like your extended family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

By definition, a nuclear family dissolves as your kids become adults. Which is why we use the term extended family. You may still spend time with whichever relatives you want, but the family you had with young kids is gone forever. Which is also why you don't get to decide any more whom your adult kids spend their Christmas with.

Anonymous wrote:You are really salty today aren't you? I'm sorry you don't like your extended family.

Ha, not salty at all. Just clarifying for those who seem to think their nuclear family lasts forever and that they get to be in charge forever as well. Your adult kids have their own nuclear families now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I don’t think any of us disagree that you made a choice.

It’s not the default that a nuclear family dissolves as PP put it.

Anonymous wrote:+1. Many of us still see our parents and in-laws on a regular basis. My husband is even still very close with several of his first cousins.

By definition, a nuclear family dissolves as your kids become adults. Which is why we use the term extended family. You may still spend time with whichever relatives you want, but the family you had with young kids is gone forever. Which is also why you don't get to decide any more whom your adult kids spend their Christmas with.

You can re read the nuclear family dissolves post to understand the context and what she was referring to. And again, some of us are posting AS the adult kids and agreeing they should include their parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few hours? More like they spend 4 days and nights as our houseguests, making things difficult and generally making me dread Christmas. Not this year, sorry. They have 3 other grown children they can spread the love this year and visit one of them for once.

You’re an adult and can say not to hosting for four days. It doesn’t mean you can’t offer up your home for Christmas brunch. Use your words and be firm about what the invite entails.

This assumes people live close enough to just come for brunch. Or can afford to stay in a hotel and will entertain themselves while you do things you'd prefer to do with just your nuclear family, or do traditions they cannot or will not engage in.

Both my parents and ILs live too far away to just come over for one meal. If they come, we are 100% hosting them for a minimum of 3 days -- every meal, entertainment, accommodations in our house, etc. It means my kids having to be on "grandparent behavior" the entire time.

We always travel for Thanksgiving specifically because we want to spend Christmas at home, just us. I think a lot of families make this compromise.

When I was a kid we always spent Christmas at home. I can only think of two Christmases when my grandmother was present and it was just her (her husband died long before I was born) and she only spent Christmas Eve with us and then went to my aunt's house where she spend Christmas morning -- no one just hosted her for the entire holiday.

The problem with this scenario (both of them) is that it becomes normal to always be "just the nuclear family"--and one day you won't be part of that. Then you'll be spending Christmas along while your kids do what you grew up doing, and what they grew up with. That's fine if that's what you want, but many of us do not.

So, even though your kids want to stay home and enjoy Christmas with their own kids, they should invite the extended family, because that is what the grandparents want???? Why are their wants more important than anyone else’s?

It is also not about “what’s normal”, it’s about what individual couples want to do. For some, that means spending it with extended family, for others it means spending it with nuclear family only. Even if you model spending time with extended family Christmas to your children, it doesn’t mean they will want the same thing as you. Their married life may be completely different than yours. Part of being a parent to adult children is respecting their values and individual choices, even when they differ from yours or how they were raised.

I haven’t spent Christmas with my parents in many years for a variety of reasons (mostly bc I wanted my kids to wake up on Christmas in their own home). They don’t live nearby. They never complained or whined. I invited them this year (I paid for their tickets) and genuinely want to see them, host them, and make memories this Christmas. I’m actually thrilled they are coming and I attribute it to the fact that they respected my choices and values.

Would you rather have regular forced holidays with family that are done out of obligation and guilt or have your kids invite you because they genuinely want to spend time with you?

+1 this.

My parents and unmarried sister in her 40s invite themselves to my house. We never even get a chance to discuss what we want to/can/can’t handle. My mother just declares, we’re coming, buys tickets, books a hotel for her and my father snd a room for my sister and they come out and park at our house. My mother never offers to cook, pretends she’s incompetent at various things but wants a traditional Christmas meal. We’ve played caterer and cooked while she sits in the living room making a mess with our kids. This year I asked her what she’ll be doing while she’s here since we’re not cooking up a meal. Crickets. We don’t fly out to their house because we have small children and my hometown costs a fortune and is a PITA to get to with layovers and traffic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It was inevitable this post would bring out all the whiny “I have trauma and boundaries” people. This post is not for you. We are not telling you to invite your abusive relative to Christmas. Stop making every damn post about you! Scroll along.

What you don't realize is that most people have difficult family members. It may not amount to a clinical definition of PTSD, but there is no reason to subject yourself to a grandparent's racist rants every holiday, or a mother's harping on every female relative's weight, including the young girls. It's not that you don't have some affection for these people, who despite their moral failings like you and have no doubt supported you in your life. But it doesn't follow that you would see them at a time when you most seek peace and quiet.

It's OK for everyone to choose how and when and where they interact with their relatives. I entirely agree with you that blood is thicker than water. I will contribute to eldercare, help out when someone is sick, send gifts to kids and spend precious summer vacation time with some of my relatives.

Christmas? No. I will enjoy my spiritual break in PEACE.

What you might not understand is that people can hear all of this and then still disagree and say nope, it’s one day a year, get your peace the other 364 days. It’s just a difference of opinion and that’s what message boards are all about. And this thread is about parents not other relatives.

PP you replied to. Posters are taking issue with the insult in the titled. If you are OP, then you need to stop doing that if you seek a polite debate. If we simply disagree on which day to see our parents (note that I referred to my mother, who is skeletally thin and believes anyone who is not is de facto fat and stupid), then we can courteously stop the discussion there and each visit on our preferred days.

OP started the fight by being horribly rude, no doubt on purpose to get a rise out of people.

PP here and I get the point and agree it was rude of OP to call people jerks. I still think parents and in laws should be invited outside of abuse or other unusual circumstance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few hours? More like they spend 4 days and nights as our houseguests, making things difficult and generally making me dread Christmas. Not this year, sorry. They have 3 other grown children they can spread the love this year and visit one of them for once.

You’re an adult and can say not to hosting for four days. It doesn’t mean you can’t offer up your home for Christmas brunch. Use your words and be firm about what the invite entails.

This assumes people live close enough to just come for brunch. Or can afford to stay in a hotel and will entertain themselves while you do things you'd prefer to do with just your nuclear family, or do traditions they cannot or will not engage in.

Both my parents and ILs live too far away to just come over for one meal. If they come, we are 100% hosting them for a minimum of 3 days -- every meal, entertainment, accommodations in our house, etc. It means my kids having to be on "grandparent behavior" the entire time.

We always travel for Thanksgiving specifically because we want to spend Christmas at home, just us. I think a lot of families make this compromise.

When I was a kid we always spent Christmas at home. I can only think of two Christmases when my grandmother was present and it was just her (her husband died long before I was born) and she only spent Christmas Eve with us and then went to my aunt's house where she spend Christmas morning -- no one just hosted her for the entire holiday.

The problem with this scenario (both of them) is that it becomes normal to always be "just the nuclear family"--and one day you won't be part of that. Then you'll be spending Christmas along while your kids do what you grew up doing, and what they grew up with. That's fine if that's what you want, but many of us do not.

So, even though your kids want to stay home and enjoy Christmas with their own kids, they should invite the extended family, because that is what the grandparents want???? Why are their wants more important than anyone else’s?

It is also not about “what’s normal”, it’s about what individual couples want to do. For some, that means spending it with extended family, for others it means spending it with nuclear family only. Even if you model spending time with extended family Christmas to your children, it doesn’t mean they will want the same thing as you. Their married life may be completely different than yours. Part of being a parent to adult children is respecting their values and individual choices, even when they differ from yours or how they were raised.

I haven’t spent Christmas with my parents in many years for a variety of reasons (mostly bc I wanted my kids to wake up on Christmas in their own home). They don’t live nearby. They never complained or whined. I invited them this year (I paid for their tickets) and genuinely want to see them, host them, and make memories this Christmas. I’m actually thrilled they are coming and I attribute it to the fact that they respected my choices and values.

Would you rather have regular forced holidays with family that are done out of obligation and guilt or have your kids invite you because they genuinely want to spend time with you?

+1 this.

My parents and unmarried sister in her 40s invite themselves to my house. We never even get a chance to discuss what we want to/can/can’t handle. My mother just declares, we’re coming, buys tickets, books a hotel for her and my father snd a room for my sister and they come out and park at our house. My mother never offers to cook, pretends she’s incompetent at various things but wants a traditional Christmas meal. We’ve played caterer and cooked while she sits in the living room making a mess with our kids. This year I asked her what she’ll be doing while she’s here since we’re not cooking up a meal. Crickets. We don’t fly out to their house because we have small children and my hometown costs a fortune and is a PITA to get to with layovers and traffic.

So you never take the time to fly out to see your mom and you resent when she comes to visit you? Do you not want your kids to have a relationship with her? Because if you don’t come to her because of small kids, the only option other than her coming to you is to not have them get to know her.

[Anonymous]

Calling people jerks will only confirm to the host that they were right to not invite. Who wants to spend a holiday with name-callers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Calling people jerks will only confirm to the host that they were right to not invite. Who wants to spend a holiday with name-callers?

Huh? OP isn’t referring to her relatives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A few hours? More like they spend 4 days and nights as our houseguests, making things difficult and generally making me dread Christmas. Not this year, sorry. They have 3 other grown children they can spread the love this year and visit one of them for once.

You’re an adult and can say not to hosting for four days. It doesn’t mean you can’t offer up your home for Christmas brunch. Use your words and be firm about what the invite entails.

This assumes people live close enough to just come for brunch. Or can afford to stay in a hotel and will entertain themselves while you do things you'd prefer to do with just your nuclear family, or do traditions they cannot or will not engage in.

Both my parents and ILs live too far away to just come over for one meal. If they come, we are 100% hosting them for a minimum of 3 days -- every meal, entertainment, accommodations in our house, etc. It means my kids having to be on "grandparent behavior" the entire time.

We always travel for Thanksgiving specifically because we want to spend Christmas at home, just us. I think a lot of families make this compromise.

When I was a kid we always spent Christmas at home. I can only think of two Christmases when my grandmother was present and it was just her (her husband died long before I was born) and she only spent Christmas Eve with us and then went to my aunt's house where she spend Christmas morning -- no one just hosted her for the entire holiday.

The problem with this scenario (both of them) is that it becomes normal to always be "just the nuclear family"--and one day you won't be part of that. Then you'll be spending Christmas along while your kids do what you grew up doing, and what they grew up with. That's fine if that's what you want, but many of us do not.

So, even though your kids want to stay home and enjoy Christmas with their own kids, they should invite the extended family, because that is what the grandparents want???? Why are their wants more important than anyone else’s?

It is also not about “what’s normal”, it’s about what individual couples want to do. For some, that means spending it with extended family, for others it means spending it with nuclear family only. Even if you model spending time with extended family Christmas to your children, it doesn’t mean they will want the same thing as you. Their married life may be completely different than yours. Part of being a parent to adult children is respecting their values and individual choices, even when they differ from yours or how they were raised.

I haven’t spent Christmas with my parents in many years for a variety of reasons (mostly bc I wanted my kids to wake up on Christmas in their own home). They don’t live nearby. They never complained or whined. I invited them this year (I paid for their tickets) and genuinely want to see them, host them, and make memories this Christmas. I’m actually thrilled they are coming and I attribute it to the fact that they respected my choices and values.

Would you rather have regular forced holidays with family that are done out of obligation and guilt or have your kids invite you because they genuinely want to spend time with you?

+1 this.

My parents and unmarried sister in her 40s invite themselves to my house. We never even get a chance to discuss what we want to/can/can’t handle. My mother just declares, we’re coming, buys tickets, books a hotel for her and my father snd a room for my sister and they come out and park at our house. My mother never offers to cook, pretends she’s incompetent at various things but wants a traditional Christmas meal. We’ve played caterer and cooked while she sits in the living room making a mess with our kids. This year I asked her what she’ll be doing while she’s here since we’re not cooking up a meal. Crickets. We don’t fly out to their house because we have small children and my hometown costs a fortune and is a PITA to get to with layovers and traffic.

So you never take the time to fly out to see your mom and you resent when she comes to visit you? Do you not want your kids to have a relationship with her? Because if you don’t come to her because of small kids, the only option other than her coming to you is to not have them get to know her.

We’ve visited them but not over the holidays because traveling is horrible. Spending more than $5k to get stuck overnight at O’Hare and drive in a blizzard to eat ham, sleep on my 30 year old twin bed (because there are no hotels where I’m from) and listen to my father pontificate about politics doesn’t appeal to us. It’s more tolerable when the plane tickets go down and the weather is better.