Clustering of special Ed kids in gen Ed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

Least Restrictive Environment be like: do I mean nothing to you?

But what about the rights of the other students to learn?

They are still learning… it may not be at the pace you want but that isn’t specified by law. Admin and teachers have to follow the law before the needs of the the other kids. Sorry, it is what it is. You should lobby for more flexibility for students to be transferred to other programs/schools; because now, it is virtually impossible to do that without SPED parents suing the district.

No, honey. We aren't sacrificed our kids' educations for yours. Sorry, it is what it is.

I’m the PP and my kid is a non-SPED student and a HS senior, but good job trying to deflect your issues on to me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child's worst year was when a supposedly NT child kept having behavioral issues and the teacher was at a loss to handle because the parents denied anything was wrong. This child continually lost it in class, was defiant and disruptive to everyone and the parents did nothing to control the behavior.

It's not the kids with IEPs that are the issue. Having an IEP means the school and the parents recognize there's a challenge and are working on it. The worst is those parents who deny anything is going on.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

You realize their a federal law against that, right?

Yes, and that needs to change and yes, it can change.

Now that would be a sight to see. An entitled parent from an anonymous forum changing a law that’s been around for 50 years!

[Anonymous]

It's better for them to disturb one classroom of kids than three classrooms of kids. I'm all for them being corralled in one class!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

At our ES, one SN child was asking that my son be in his class. A compliment I know, but that meant my son was with her son and the other SN students year after year. It wasn't random. The SN's parents were allowed "a say". I was not and didn't know this was happening until years later.


Parents like you are horrible for sns parents to deal with. Assuming that the class with a sns kid is somehow undesirable is vile.

I'm in favor of inclusion but should it affect my son's placement EVERY year? The other Mother determines his placement every year? Without me knowing about it

Exactly. I have a type-A rule follower and he was routinely sat next to the most disruptive kids to be a “peer model” until I asked for it to stop. Non-identified kids have needs too

I have one of these kids too and I only heard a slight grumble once early on about Larlo being difficult to work with. I quickly put a stop to that saying that it's part of school and learning for DC to work with all kinds of kids including those who don't do as well in cooperation or who may struggle with certain tasks. Sometimes kids with some types of SN think more creatively or out of the box than others and if have a partner who can pull those ideas out of that child you may one day have a cure for cancer or AIDS or global warming.

I would never ask a teacher to "stop" this grouping because it's just part of normal school and teacher's job trying to create groups that will be productive.

As a teacher, I would say you are paying a huge disservice to the kid who is supposed to serve as a peer model. I try different kinds of groupings, myself, but I like to put the motivated ones who challenge each other, together. I also place all the ones who don’t do any work together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's better for them to disturb one classroom of kids than three classrooms of kids. I'm all for them being corralled in one class!

Yeah, I just feel bad for the teacher who has that class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

You can advocate all you want, it doesn’t mean you’ll be successful. Cope.

We did. We were successful. Cope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's better for them to disturb one classroom of kids than three classrooms of kids. I'm all for them being corralled in one class!

Yeah, I just feel bad for the teacher who has that class.

Some schools alternate that teacher with that class yearly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

You can advocate all you want, it doesn’t mean you’ll be successful. Cope.

We did. We were successful. Cope.

Who cares? It’s just your word because it’s an anonymous forum and you’re coming off like a jacka$$.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

At our ES, one SN child was asking that my son be in his class. A compliment I know, but that meant my son was with her son and the other SN students year after year. It wasn't random. The SN's parents were allowed "a say". I was not and didn't know this was happening until years later.


Parents like you are horrible for sns parents to deal with. Assuming that the class with a sns kid is somehow undesirable is vile.

I'm in favor of inclusion but should it affect my son's placement EVERY year? The other Mother determines his placement every year? Without me knowing about it

Exactly. I have a type-A rule follower and he was routinely sat next to the most disruptive kids to be a “peer model” until I asked for it to stop. Non-identified kids have needs too

I have one of these kids too and I only heard a slight grumble once early on about Larlo being difficult to work with. I quickly put a stop to that saying that it's part of school and learning for DC to work with all kinds of kids including those who don't do as well in cooperation or who may struggle with certain tasks. Sometimes kids with some types of SN think more creatively or out of the box than others and if have a partner who can pull those ideas out of that child you may one day have a cure for cancer or AIDS or global warming.

I would never ask a teacher to "stop" this grouping because it's just part of normal school and teacher's job trying to create groups that will be productive.

As a teacher, I would say you are paying a huge disservice to the kid who is supposed to serve as a peer model. I try different kinds of groupings, myself, but I like to put the motivated ones who challenge each other, together. I also place all the ones who don’t do any work together.

Glad to hear I’m not the only one who does that. 😊

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

At our ES, one SN child was asking that my son be in his class. A compliment I know, but that meant my son was with her son and the other SN students year after year. It wasn't random. The SN's parents were allowed "a say". I was not and didn't know this was happening until years later.


Parents like you are horrible for sns parents to deal with. Assuming that the class with a sns kid is somehow undesirable is vile.

I'm in favor of inclusion but should it affect my son's placement EVERY year? The other Mother determines his placement every year? Without me knowing about it

Exactly. I have a type-A rule follower and he was routinely sat next to the most disruptive kids to be a “peer model” until I asked for it to stop. Non-identified kids have needs too

I have one of these kids too and I only heard a slight grumble once early on about Larlo being difficult to work with. I quickly put a stop to that saying that it's part of school and learning for DC to work with all kinds of kids including those who don't do as well in cooperation or who may struggle with certain tasks. Sometimes kids with some types of SN think more creatively or out of the box than others and if have a partner who can pull those ideas out of that child you may one day have a cure for cancer or AIDS or global warming.

I would never ask a teacher to "stop" this grouping because it's just part of normal school and teacher's job trying to create groups that will be productive.

As a teacher, I would say you are paying a huge disservice to the kid who is supposed to serve as a peer model. I try different kinds of groupings, myself, but I like to put the motivated ones who challenge each other, together. I also place all the ones who don’t do any work together.

Glad to hear I’m not the only one who does that. 😊

Oh, gosh. That is a terrible approach. You've pretty much given up and guaranteed failure for those kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At our school they seem to put all the special Ed kids in one Gen Ed class. It’s not fair to the other regular kids who get placed in with that group. The class is usually poorly behaved and the teacher is overwhelmed. This is called clustering and I thought this practice was outdated and frowned upon. Why are elementary schools clustering special Ed kids now in one class instead of spreading them out among 3 different Gen Ed classes? Can parents request for their child not to be put in the special Ed class?

This is my first year working in a school (fcps elementary school). If it makes you feel better, behaviors are an effing nightmare across the board, not just the “iep” kids.

+1 … very true, but this thread is about sped clustering. I believe most parents here (including myself) have no problem whatsoever with sped students and their integration, but with the way clustering is done at some and maybe many FCPS schools. When adequate support is provided, everyone benefits. But this starts with FCPS funding, creativity and transparency of principals and quality of teachers (although honestly teachers seem to be the least of the issues in the entire mess). Parents of non-sped students are rightfully upset, because the way things are set up, if placed in sped classroom, their kids don’t get the same quality of learning environment and instruction. This is not the fault of sped students, but FCPS issue.

Until they hire significantly more SPED teachers (beyond what is already posted online), clustering will continue to happen.

We are losing very experienced Sped teachers at my LCPS school. Clustering will continue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At our school they seem to put all the special Ed kids in one Gen Ed class. It’s not fair to the other regular kids who get placed in with that group. The class is usually poorly behaved and the teacher is overwhelmed. This is called clustering and I thought this practice was outdated and frowned upon. Why are elementary schools clustering special Ed kids now in one class instead of spreading them out among 3 different Gen Ed classes? Can parents request for their child not to be put in the special Ed class?

And you know this because…?

DP here...Uh have you never volunteered in your school? I volunteer for lunch, in the classroom, grade wide parties. Yes, there is an aide but there is only so much they can do. You have 4-5 special ed kids some with severe emotional management issues, some who really aren't getting the curriculum etc etc. And one aide trying to put out fires, catch fires before they spread and keep this kids somewhat engaged. Meanwhile as these repeated and loud disturbances happen the teacher is trying to keep the rest of the class focused. It does breed resentment among parents and the students. My DS in 3rd grade can't stand the disruptions, the random shouting, singing, anger outbursts. As the teacher has to help the aide get these kids under control the rest of the class is left to twiddle their thumbs. We requested not to be put in an inclusion classroom. I don't see how it's fair that a handful of kids get to derail the education of the majority.

Do a have a suggestion besides for a separate school or classroom - because those are against the law?

The law needs to be revisited or, at the very least, fully funded by the Federal Government so it can be properly implemented.

+1
The situation with SPED is not sustainable

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They don’t have enough aides

+1

They use the well behaved kids to try to outweigh the not so much. The well behaved kids become the aides.

In my training on gifted students, it is an absolute no-no to use them as TA’s, yet I see it happen at my school more often than not. That’s how bad the teacher shortage is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

At our ES, one SN child was asking that my son be in his class. A compliment I know, but that meant my son was with her son and the other SN students year after year. It wasn't random. The SN's parents were allowed "a say". I was not and didn't know this was happening until years later.


Parents like you are horrible for sns parents to deal with. Assuming that the class with a sns kid is somehow undesirable is vile.

I'm in favor of inclusion but should it affect my son's placement EVERY year? The other Mother determines his placement every year? Without me knowing about it

Exactly. I have a type-A rule follower and he was routinely sat next to the most disruptive kids to be a “peer model” until I asked for it to stop. Non-identified kids have needs too

I have one of these kids too and I only heard a slight grumble once early on about Larlo being difficult to work with. I quickly put a stop to that saying that it's part of school and learning for DC to work with all kinds of kids including those who don't do as well in cooperation or who may struggle with certain tasks. Sometimes kids with some types of SN think more creatively or out of the box than others and if have a partner who can pull those ideas out of that child you may one day have a cure for cancer or AIDS or global warming.

I would never ask a teacher to "stop" this grouping because it's just part of normal school and teacher's job trying to create groups that will be productive.

I’m a SPED teacher, my kid knows a lot about what I do, the highs and the lows. One of his parents has learning disabilities, the other a physical disability. We’ve talked a lot about strengths, compassion and inclusion.
He’s not sitting in a group with kids who rip up his paper and throw things. It’s not his job to teach kids about cooperation or help them with certain tasks. I’ve never asked for him to be moved from class but I won’t hesitate in the future.