Clustering of special Ed kids in gen Ed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

Least Restrictive Environment be like: do I mean nothing to you?

But what about the rights of the other students to learn?

They are still learning… it may not be at the pace you want but that isn’t specified by law. Admin and teachers have to follow the law before the needs of the the other kids. Sorry, it is what it is. You should lobby for more flexibility for students to be transferred to other programs/schools; because now, it is virtually impossible to do that without SPED parents suing the district.

+1 Hey, more opportunity to tell people about the law!!

Schools only must provide a “serviceable Chevrolet,” not a Cadillac, to afford a student a free appropriate public education (FAPE). The analogy is often associated with the seminal U.S. Supreme Court case known as Rowley, which said that public education requires only a “basic floor of opportunity,” not that schools “maximize” a child’s educational potential. The “Chevy vs. Cadillac” analogy was coined and used by lower courts after Rowley, and suggests that schools need only provide a bare minimum of services to afford a student FAPE.

I know about the law, but I do think that schools should maximize a child's educational potential. If that isn't the goal, then what is the goal? The dumbing down of society to the lowest common denominator? I truly want SPED kids to succeed, but I think for society we also need the gifted and advanced kids to suceed as well. One shouldn't be at the expense of the other. Currently the parents have to put in the extra work to get their normal kids to succeed.

My SPED kid has been highly successful in a gifted program during their entire schooling. Please stop equating special needs with not being very smart.

He/she is a unicorn then.

Not really. I teach at an AAP Center and have had about 15-18 SPED kids in the past 5 years. They were all successful, got 4s and almost all went into Algebra in 7th.

I have two and they are brilliant. The youngest tenured math professor at Stanford has autism and was in my applied math program at Brown. He's a genius.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:every kid with an IEP is different and I think it is unfair to all kids to have all the IEP kids in one classroom. No one is getting what they need with this scenario- especially the kids with the IEP. One of ours has an IEP and I had to fight this placement two years in a row.

Do you have a way to solve the problem with the shortage of teachers that FCPS (and the rest of the county) can implement?

It's going to be worse next year. This week is the last week for 7 teachers at my school. All are leaving the profession.

[Anonymous]

I had a student this year that required many evacuations and severely disruptive behavior. Part of the issue is that We can’t touch them if we aren’t trained. And we also can’t isolate them and make them leave. We basically have to let them destroy the room and work through the escalation. In addition to that, the process to work on the behaviors is lengthy and it can take months to move through and be at a place with an IEP. It can take a whole school year to open up the services to a different school (center). Even then, parents can deny that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

So kids in SPED classes can be ignored? Because SPED only classes tended to turn into warehouses for kids for many different reasons. And kids who are capable and can excel are left behind because they don't receive the resources and help that they need. The comments in this thread point to why that happens.

There are lots of SPED kids who do well in school with some help and are very successful in college. There are lots of SPED kids who do well in school and choose a Vo Tech field. There is a small percentage of SPED kids who are disruptive.

And some of those super disruptive kids in your kids Gen Ed classroom might very well not be SPED kids but kids who are acting out for a variety of reasons.

But we do need more specialized programs for the kids who are struggling in the classroom and who are acting out. And we do need a way to speed up moving kids to those environments so that they can get the help that they need. They are expensive and harder to find Teachers for.

I’m the pp. I thought it would be better for the sped students. It wasn’t supposed to be negative. I may be thinking of disabled children, not ADHD or a little on the spectrum.

I have a friend whose child is severely behind. I know she is really worried about sending her to kindergarten with NT kids. Child is nonverbal. Child may never talk, May never read, may never be potty trained. This is a different kind of sped student.

[Anonymous]

I always thought this was the case until 3rd or maybe 4th grade? Then Sped parents basically got to interview and pick the teacher they wanted their kid to be in.

[Anonymous]

There are kids with IEPs in AAP. Sped is such a broad range of kids. Kids on spectrum of autism and dyslexia are very different spectrums. Disabled children in wheelchairs, other born disabilities, ADHD, ADD, processing issues, speech issues. There are kids with IEPs you would not even know have IEPs. Can it really be possible for them all to be placed in one class? Behavior issues do not equal IEP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are kids with IEPs in AAP. Sped is such a broad range of kids. Kids on spectrum of autism and dyslexia are very different spectrums. Disabled children in wheelchairs, other born disabilities, ADHD, ADD, processing issues, speech issues. There are kids with IEPs you would not even know have IEPs. Can it really be possible for them all to be placed in one class? Behavior issues do not equal IEP.

It still comes down to staffing. If the have an IEP then they are receiving some type of support, even if it’s 2 hours a week. They don’t have enough SPED teachers for these students to be in multiple classes across the grade. We have 1 SPED teacher at my school to support K-2 and 2 teachers to support 3-6. We do have 1 self contained room with a SPED teacher. She has 4 FULL time students that really need 1:1 academic support. Which they obviously aren’t getting because there is one of her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

So kids in SPED classes can be ignored? Because SPED only classes tended to turn into warehouses for kids for many different reasons. And kids who are capable and can excel are left behind because they don't receive the resources and help that they need. The comments in this thread point to why that happens.

There are lots of SPED kids who do well in school with some help and are very successful in college. There are lots of SPED kids who do well in school and choose a Vo Tech field. There is a small percentage of SPED kids who are disruptive.

And some of those super disruptive kids in your kids Gen Ed classroom might very well not be SPED kids but kids who are acting out for a variety of reasons.

But we do need more specialized programs for the kids who are struggling in the classroom and who are acting out. And we do need a way to speed up moving kids to those environments so that they can get the help that they need. They are expensive and harder to find Teachers for.

I’m the pp. I thought it would be better for the sped students. It wasn’t supposed to be negative. I may be thinking of disabled children, not ADHD or a little on the spectrum.

I have a friend whose child is severely behind. I know she is really worried about sending her to kindergarten with NT kids. Child is nonverbal. Child may never talk, May never read, may never be potty trained. This is a different kind of sped student.

The non-verbal students with mobility and toileting issues are often placed in Cat B room, not a Gen Ed classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

You realize their a federal law against that, right?

Yes, and that needs to change and yes, it can change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter had a horrible third grade experience because there were a few kids who were very badly behaved with special needs. The teacher was experienced but she could not handle it and she would yell at all the kids or just disappear into the copy room. She quit the next year. It was very unfair that my well-behaved and academic daughter was sacrificed as were the many other kids in the class who behaved and didn’t have issues. The school clearly put all the easy kids with the challenging kids in that class.

Your daughter is not that “academic” if she can’t handle a few special needs kids in her classroom. Fact.

This makes no sense whatsoever.

I think the point PP is trying to make is this is your daughter's issue and that she can't be that academic if she's bothered by something that's really normal and that is part of real life.

Sorry, no. These kinds of ongoing disruptive behaviors keeping other students from being able to access their own education are not "normal" and "part of real life," no matter how many words you use to try to normalize them. No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

Go ahead and bark at the wrong tree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There should be sped schools, the way they have AAP centers.

Least Restrictive Environment be like: do I mean nothing to you?

But what about the rights of the other students to learn?

They are still learning… it may not be at the pace you want but that isn’t specified by law. Admin and teachers have to follow the law before the needs of the the other kids. Sorry, it is what it is. You should lobby for more flexibility for students to be transferred to other programs/schools; because now, it is virtually impossible to do that without SPED parents suing the district.

No, honey. We aren't sacrificed our kids' educations for yours. Sorry, it is what it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

Go ahead and bark at the wrong tree.

What wrong tree? We complained. Our child was moved to.a classrooms without constantly disruptive, out of control kids and started learning again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The best years my gen Ed kid has had have been in inclusion classrooms. The unfounded judgment of kids with IEPs is disgusting.

It's not unfounded for many kids in these inclusive classrooms who have had very negative, even traumatic experiences.

My kid had to see a therapist for anxiety related to going to school in her inclusive class. Why? Because two students in the class regularly had meltdowns that caused the classroom to be evacuated. These meltdowns included lots of yelling, throwing items, and in a few cases, outright assault on the teacher and aide.

It got to the point where their class was evacuating the classroom weekly. The one student's behavior just got more and more destructive to the point where he trashed a classroom one time and the kids had to finish out the day in neighboring classrooms.

That's UNACCEPTABLE behavior for anyone. My kid shouldn't have been scared of going to school because of two students who, and I will just keep it real, are never going to amount to anything. One student is mostly nonverbal with significant delays. I cannot think of any job that he can do in his future. It's sad, but it is what it is.

When I was in school, these types of students were in their own classrooms. That's how it should be. If you're a disruptive student, you don't get to be mainstreamed.

You are a disgusting person.

Nope. Sorry. We are going to continue to advocate for our kids and keep them out of the classes like the ones described above and no, we do not have to, and will not, "go private or homeschool" to do so. Cope.

You can advocate all you want, it doesn’t mean you’ll be successful. Cope.