Do men really not care about a woman’s career?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Alex botez would be an ideal woman that high power guys would love.

She’s very attractive but not IG model hot, smart, got into Stanford kinda unhooked (shes good at chess but not fgm level, dabbled in the startup scene, now is Ft chess streamer on twitch, speaks multiple languages.)

She's gorgeous IMO. The probability that she will SAH is very low, as both her parents are educated and Romanians look down at SAHMs. It's usually a trait of the lower class in Romania.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I think in reality that if a woman looked exactly like Meagan Fox, but worked as a Nanny she could still get any man she wanted.

Because overall men are very visually stimulated.

Not all > but most. 😉

I don’t know. I don’t think the male fantasy is that she looks like Meagan Fox and works as a nanny. I think the male fantasy is that she looks cute enough, but also that because she is a nanny she has no ambition or desires in life, and will happily spend her days washing his dirty socks and cooking his favorite meals, then have hot sex by night. I think in this fantasy she also has close friends and family that she can talk to about her problems, so she doesn’t have to bother him with them, but he never ever has to meet them, and she won’t mind moving away from them forever if that’s what’s best for him or his career.
I think that she also has children, but they don’t take away from her devotion to him, and he only has to see them for an hour a day after they are bathed and fed (until, of course, they reach adolescence. Then he will attend all of their games where they are the star player).

I don’t know a single UMC guy with the fantasy to marry someone who works as a nanny. If you’re educated and of an aspirational class, you have a nanny to do the laundry and prep dinner while your wife kicks ass at her amazing dream job. You’re capable of cooking amazing gourmet meals yourself and can afford the best restaurants. And you spend a lot of your free time with your children because it’s a privilege to get to know them.

Not much talk about problems and hot sex, sure. Though most of the men I meet socially in this class seem to pride themselves on being emotionally and intellectually available for deeper conversation.

What you’re describing sounds pretty basic and retrograde. It might be if guys are not very educated they don’t care what their wife does or they have this idea that women should be caretakers, but most men of a certain class want to be married to women who are “self-actualized” and can be an “equal companion” professionally and intellectually. That makes the whole family have a higher status. They have also internalized higher standards for themselves, because they think real intimacy involves connecting with your partner in a deeper way. Not saying any of this is better, necessarily, just saying that this is how these guys think. I went to school at Ivy+ and those guys might bang a nanny in the summer but they all dream of marrying a woman who is brilliant, accomplished, and beautiful and kind and all the rest. They dream of being a power couple.

Both of these fantasies involve a woman doing all of the caretaking. Whether it’s the nanny turned wife or the nanny acting as nanny, there seems to be an assumption that there are many, many women out there who want nothing more than to take care of all of the mundane aspects of some man’s life in order to support his flourishing career.
These fantasy female caretakers don’t even seem to want a social life of their own. They are available 24/7, do everything to a high standard, never complain, and are happy to just support from the background.

Big difference between being a nanny and being a woman who’s expected to fill that role after marriage.

Nanny gets a pay check and goes home at night. Nanny can quit at any time and get a different job, even start a different career. It’s not the same thing. For some people being a nanny is the best job they can get given the labor market so that’s the job they want. Very few UMC women, who are educated into a sense of unlimited life possibilities, dream of being a SAHM and not realizing any of their own talents and dreams. Very few women who have any sense of what’s out there will be happy indefinitely as SAHMs.

No one wants this life as a nanny or a wife.
But I guarantee you that this is what men mean when they say they want someone who is kind and creates a peaceful home.

Well, similarly educated women from stable families are not unkind or unable to creat a peaceful home.

Notice — educated and family background are the key criteria here.

Not employment status.

So what are you saying? That if a woman has parents that worked in service jobs they are unqualified?

Depends on what else they did, the woman's upbringing, and her own abilities.

[Anonymous]

Well, a job is a necessity now, even if its shuffling papers or pushing pencil or entering data because society looks down upon SAHMs and even more so on SAHDs and most marriages disintegrate within 10 years. Its just not a real option any more even if one income can support a family which is only possible for a very tiny percentage of privileged people who are not lurking on internet forums.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think in reality that if a woman looked exactly like Meagan Fox, but worked as a Nanny she could still get any man she wanted.

Because overall men are very visually stimulated.

Not all > but most. 😉

I don’t know. I don’t think the male fantasy is that she looks like Meagan Fox and works as a nanny. I think the male fantasy is that she looks cute enough, but also that because she is a nanny she has no ambition or desires in life, and will happily spend her days washing his dirty socks and cooking his favorite meals, then have hot sex by night. I think in this fantasy she also has close friends and family that she can talk to about her problems, so she doesn’t have to bother him with them, but he never ever has to meet them, and she won’t mind moving away from them forever if that’s what’s best for him or his career.
I think that she also has children, but they don’t take away from her devotion to him, and he only has to see them for an hour a day after they are bathed and fed (until, of course, they reach adolescence. Then he will attend all of their games where they are the star player).

I don’t know a single UMC guy with the fantasy to marry someone who works as a nanny. If you’re educated and of an aspirational class, you have a nanny to do the laundry and prep dinner while your wife kicks ass at her amazing dream job. You’re capable of cooking amazing gourmet meals yourself and can afford the best restaurants. And you spend a lot of your free time with your children because it’s a privilege to get to know them.

Not much talk about problems and hot sex, sure. Though most of the men I meet socially in this class seem to pride themselves on being emotionally and intellectually available for deeper conversation.

What you’re describing sounds pretty basic and retrograde. It might be if guys are not very educated they don’t care what their wife does or they have this idea that women should be caretakers, but most men of a certain class want to be married to women who are “self-actualized” and can be an “equal companion” professionally and intellectually. That makes the whole family have a higher status. They have also internalized higher standards for themselves, because they think real intimacy involves connecting with your partner in a deeper way. Not saying any of this is better, necessarily, just saying that this is how these guys think. I went to school at Ivy+ and those guys might bang a nanny in the summer but they all dream of marrying a woman who is brilliant, accomplished, and beautiful and kind and all the rest. They dream of being a power couple.

Both of these fantasies involve a woman doing all of the caretaking. Whether it’s the nanny turned wife or the nanny acting as nanny, there seems to be an assumption that there are many, many women out there who want nothing more than to take care of all of the mundane aspects of some man’s life in order to support his flourishing career.
These fantasy female caretakers don’t even seem to want a social life of their own. They are available 24/7, do everything to a high standard, never complain, and are happy to just support from the background.

Big difference between being a nanny and being a woman who’s expected to fill that role after marriage.

Nanny gets a pay check and goes home at night. Nanny can quit at any time and get a different job, even start a different career. It’s not the same thing. For some people being a nanny is the best job they can get given the labor market so that’s the job they want. Very few UMC women, who are educated into a sense of unlimited life possibilities, dream of being a SAHM and not realizing any of their own talents and dreams. Very few women who have any sense of what’s out there will be happy indefinitely as SAHMs.

No one wants this life as a nanny or a wife.
But I guarantee you that this is what men mean when they say they want someone who is kind and creates a peaceful home.

Well, similarly educated women from stable families are not unkind or unable to creat a peaceful home.

Notice — educated and family background are the key criteria here.

Not employment status.

So what are you saying? That if a woman has parents that worked in service jobs they are unqualified?

Depends on what else they did, the woman's upbringing, and her own abilities.

Yup. Actually a driven girl from an underprivileged background has higher odds for getting admitted to elite colleges, getting a top degree on financial aid's dime and getting good jobs needing diverse representation. Middle class high achievers ends up at state schools on scholarships because they don't get enough aid at top colleges and parents cant afford the cost and no bank gives loans this high to college freshmen.

[Anonymous]

DH is a partner in a financial services firm. All of the partners and senior associates are married to someone with at least a bachelor's degree, and all of the partners and senior associates who are under 50 are married to someone with an advanced degree (doctor, lawyer, MBA, and nonprofit). Purely anecdotal, but that's our experience. I see a similar sampling among our friends, but admittedly most of my closest girlfriends are from school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’ve noticed the only men who are “into” a woman’s career are insecure themselves and intelligensia-type status seeking. For example, the one who has a middling career and lives in the least expensive house in a hoity neighborhood and needs to bring up 47 times that his wife is an NPR reporter.

This is oddly specific.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In my circles, men marry the hot women with the great career. If you are in a highly educated professional group, you will see many of these women have it all: smoking hot, athletic, smart as a whip and a career to match (even if they mommy track or step back a bit when kids come along).

Those are the type of genetics intelligent men look for in a mate.

Now--if we are talking about a no-strings thing or frivolous temporary girlfriends, they don't care if they are as dumb as a bunch of rocks.

GD can we please retire smart as a whip? It makes you sound stupid, it is only used for women and never men, and is about as old and dusty as calling a women a "badass." You might as well use the term rockstar while you're at it.

Haha this post had a lot of buzzwords: “my circles,” “genetics,” “mate,” and yes, “smart as a whip”….

You silly broads .

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH is a partner in a financial services firm. All of the partners and senior associates are married to someone with at least a bachelor's degree, and all of the partners and senior associates who are under 50 are married to someone with an advanced degree (doctor, lawyer, MBA, and nonprofit). Purely anecdotal, but that's our experience. I see a similar sampling among our friends, but admittedly most of my closest girlfriends are from school.

For the 100th time, please separate the degree from employment status.

Are all partners and senior associates married to someone who work in those jobs?

Remember, hbs alumna sahm more than ttt mba alumna.

The op asked about employment status not educational level.

Too many in this thread of mixing the two.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Alex botez would be an ideal woman that high power guys would love.

She’s very attractive but not IG model hot, smart, got into Stanford kinda unhooked (shes good at chess but not fgm level, dabbled in the startup scene, now is Ft chess streamer on twitch, speaks multiple languages.)

She's gorgeous IMO. The probability that she will SAH is very low, as both her parents are educated and Romanians look down at SAHMs. It's usually a trait of the lower class in Romania.

She won’t sahm but she won’t work FT in some grindy job either (twitch streaming is very grindy, it isn’t easy) either if she ends up with some tech/vc/crypto billionaire.

She’ll transition into being a pt dabbling in self actualizing stuff

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve noticed the only men who are “into” a woman’s career are insecure themselves and intelligensia-type status seeking. For example, the one who has a middling career and lives in the least expensive house in a hoity neighborhood and needs to bring up 47 times that his wife is an NPR reporter.

This is oddly specific.

I know the type of men pp is talking about.

They also have androgynous voices aka “neoliberal voice”

Low T

Straight but you are really not quite sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH is a partner in a financial services firm. All of the partners and senior associates are married to someone with at least a bachelor's degree, and all of the partners and senior associates who are under 50 are married to someone with an advanced degree (doctor, lawyer, MBA, and nonprofit). Purely anecdotal, but that's our experience. I see a similar sampling among our friends, but admittedly most of my closest girlfriends are from school.

For the 100th time, please separate the degree from employment status.

Are all partners and senior associates married to someone who work in those jobs?

Remember, hbs alumna sahm more than ttt mba alumna.

The op asked about employment status not educational level.

Too many in this thread of mixing the two.

In the younger (under 50) families, yes all the women are working.
In the older generation, no.
There are some rockstar female associates too, and everyone is rooting for them.

I'm not going to ask DH this question directly, but my sense is that he cares about things like education, status and athleticism, and definitely other things like physical attraction and sex, but not very much about earning power. And I care about all those things, too, but I care more about his earning power than he cares about mine.

[Anonymous]

i think many men want someone attractive and intelligent but don't care about career at all, and have a slightly preference for a woman who is willing to do more childcare when the kids are young.

my anecdotes:

my very hot but assholey ex-boyfriend (lawyer who owns his own firm now) once told me: "you are the perfect woman because you are really smart but not ambitious." I have to think he was saying out loud what many men actually think. Not ambitious was a perk for him because he didn't have to alter his career ambitions in any way but could still have a partner

(he is now married to someone who doesn't work, and I am actually much more ambitious now! and married to someone who gives me freedom to do whatever.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve noticed the only men who are “into” a woman’s career are insecure themselves and intelligensia-type status seeking. For example, the one who has a middling career and lives in the least expensive house in a hoity neighborhood and needs to bring up 47 times that his wife is an NPR reporter.

This is oddly specific.

I know the type of men pp is talking about.

They also have androgynous voices aka “neoliberal voice”

Low T

Straight but you are really not quite sure.

I haven't met one woman working at NPR without a sizable trust, so those guys did well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH is a partner in a financial services firm. All of the partners and senior associates are married to someone with at least a bachelor's degree, and all of the partners and senior associates who are under 50 are married to someone with an advanced degree (doctor, lawyer, MBA, and nonprofit). Purely anecdotal, but that's our experience. I see a similar sampling among our friends, but admittedly most of my closest girlfriends are from school.

For the 100th time, please separate the degree from employment status.

Are all partners and senior associates married to someone who work in those jobs?

Remember, hbs alumna sahm more than ttt mba alumna.

The op asked about employment status not educational level.

Too many in this thread of mixing the two.

Same experience as pp but agree with the above point. Education and “pedigree”, for a lack of a better word, matter much more often than actual career. Everyone I know is married to someone with similar educational levels but I know many couples where DH is the breadwinner and wife is working part time/not at all/or in a low paying position. Their wives are well educated and work at nonprofits etc, not great looking women with HS degrees who work at target.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH is a partner in a financial services firm. All of the partners and senior associates are married to someone with at least a bachelor's degree, and all of the partners and senior associates who are under 50 are married to someone with an advanced degree (doctor, lawyer, MBA, and nonprofit). Purely anecdotal, but that's our experience. I see a similar sampling among our friends, but admittedly most of my closest girlfriends are from school.

For the 100th time, please separate the degree from employment status.

Are all partners and senior associates married to someone who work in those jobs?

Remember, hbs alumna sahm more than ttt mba alumna.

The op asked about employment status not educational level.

Too many in this thread of mixing the two.

You can’t group all men together.

Dh and I met in grad school so most people we associate with are graduate school educated. We met in school so I didn’t even have a career when we met. I was ambitious and had a good career. I out earned him when we got married. Now he makes a seven figure income and I stay home.

Dh is successful as are most of his colleagues. I don’t think anyone really cares about anyone else’s wife. We are all educated. I went to Harvard. Others went to Penn or Columbia. No one cares.