Why racial segregation is unacceptable but socioeconomic segregation is ok in private schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

Maybe it's time for the rich people in publics to open their checkbooks and donate to their public schools the way private school parents do. There are quite a few of them according to PPs in here. Write those checks, and be the change. Don't they believe in their school enough to support it and help cover the needs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

Maybe it's time for the rich people in publics to open their checkbooks and donate to their public schools the way private school parents do. There are quite a few of them according to PPs in here. Write those checks, and be the change. Don't they believe in their school enough to support it and help cover the needs?

So true!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Interesting but not thought out. Maybe if public schools also got as much funding per pupil as private schools, this might make sense. But then there wouldn’t be very many private schools.

Wrong, public schools in Montgomery county receive over $22k per student each year, and they continue to keep asking for more. That’s much higher than Catholic schools spend per kid. Unfortunately, all of this money hasn’t had public schools any better, especially since the pandemic. MCPS had misspent and misused public money terribly, and they continue to push to raise taxes for more money without any better results.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

As it is now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Interesting but not thought out. Maybe if public schools also got as much funding per pupil as private schools, this might make sense. But then there wouldn’t be very many private schools.

Private schools cannot be forced to take vouchers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:As a rich person myself I cannot stand private school parents. They absolutely positively think their kids are too special to go to school with kids without money and don’t think their kids can possibly learn something and be better off from the experience. It’s pathetic.

That is why financial aid programs exist. Not sure what your beef is.

The top DC privates are not overrun with poor kids on financial aid and you know it.

Some of us would say so. Financial aid is extremely generous.

At Sidwell, 77 percent of student are full pay at $60k while the other 23 percent pay on average $20k. How “generous” is that? The average “poor” kid pays $20k a year for high school.

What a joke. These are rich kid schools. Full stop. And everyone knows it, including the kids. I did not want that for my own rich kids.

No one is making you send your kids to private schools. This seems like pages of absurdly obvious comments that gets extended by folks confirming the clear. Private schools are expensive and therefore exclusionary, but for financial aid. Hard stop. No one is under any kind of illusion that it's something different, it's that we are paying for a premium product because we think it's better and we can afford it. Nice restaurants don't offer financial aid and are filled with wealthy people. Is that equally problematic? I fly in business or first class...most don't. Is that an issue for you?

Wealthy people, rightly or wrongly but definitionally, can afford to purchase things that less wealthy folks cannot. Is that breaking news is some way?

Yes, but airlines or nice restaurants don’t print in their tickets or menus the label of social justice, so they are not deceiving anyone.

No idea why you think we care about social justice or socioeconomic equality.

This is just a school for our kids. We don’t care about that stuff. Move on.

But the schools you send your kids to pretend to. We prefer dealing with honest brokers.

My kids attend 2 different private school - I just reread their websites and mission statement- NOTHING about social justice. Maybe those are just the hippie dippie schools.

And you’re proud of that?

Nothing in my post says proud. We are not hypocrites. I don’t care if I choose to raise my kids in a bubble - why do you care so much how I raise my kids. We are NOT hypocrites and neither is our school.

Which schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Is it hypocritical to have a racially diverse student body that is disproportionately wealthy?

No. It’s to be expected. Does it state anywhere that people pretend to want SES mixing? Isn’t that why people move to “good” public schools too - with neighborhoods that are relatively homogenous? We all want better education for our children and pay in one way or another to get it.

Hypocrisy is the act of pretending to have beliefs, virtues, or feelings that one does not actually possess, often characterized by behavior that contradicts stated principles. It involves insincerity, such as condemning a behavior in others while practicing it oneself. Examples include people moving to public school for higher SES diversity but that school only drawing from a wealthy catchment area.

Who is the real hypocrite?

Such as a $60k school stating on its website that it seeks to make sure that diversity, social justice, and inclusivity are foundational principles. Just delete this language. It’s so obviously performative.

But they DO care about those things - just not in the way you want them to.

No, they don’t. Not in the way most of the world understands social justice.

The cognitive dissonance for the students must be deafening.

Right . . . Because YOU speak for the world and therefore define how people might feel about those things. Do you also tell minorities how they feel about treatment from a white perspective? Or do you mansplain how women should feel about feminism?

Interesting you think the PP is a white dude. Why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh boy, people do not like talking about this!

Private school is inherently elitist no matter the metric used for selection. We are more comfortable with elitism along economic lines than race. A lot of what you are buying with a private school education is cultural exclusivity and isn't really about academics and that has always been the case, though of course within the private school community, people will also compete for academic superiority (it is not enough for a hierarchy to exist between the wealthy and the poor, there must also be hierarchies among the wealthy, and academics are one though never the most important one).

A private school that was selective based purely on academics, with scholarships for those who could not afford it, is interesting in theory but ignores the fact that being able to choose your kids' peers' parents is one of the things people like most about private.

Regis in NYC is real, not a theory. Wouldn’t it be interesting if there was such a school in DC? Let’s talk social justice and Quaker values! An STA where every boy applies for 9th grade and it’s free!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a rich person myself I cannot stand private school parents. They absolutely positively think their kids are too special to go to school with kids without money and don’t think their kids can possibly learn something and be better off from the experience. It’s pathetic.

That is why financial aid programs exist. Not sure what your beef is.

The top DC privates are not overrun with poor kids on financial aid and you know it.

Some of us would say so. Financial aid is extremely generous.

At Sidwell, 77 percent of student are full pay at $60k while the other 23 percent pay on average $20k. How “generous” is that? The average “poor” kid pays $20k a year for high school.

What a joke. These are rich kid schools. Full stop. And everyone knows it, including the kids. I did not want that for my own rich kids.

No one is making you send your kids to private schools. This seems like pages of absurdly obvious comments that gets extended by folks confirming the clear. Private schools are expensive and therefore exclusionary, but for financial aid. Hard stop. No one is under any kind of illusion that it's something different, it's that we are paying for a premium product because we think it's better and we can afford it. Nice restaurants don't offer financial aid and are filled with wealthy people. Is that equally problematic? I fly in business or first class...most don't. Is that an issue for you?

Wealthy people, rightly or wrongly but definitionally, can afford to purchase things that less wealthy folks cannot. Is that breaking news is some way?

Yes, but airlines or nice restaurants don’t print in their tickets or menus the label of social justice, so they are not deceiving anyone.

No idea why you think we care about social justice or socioeconomic equality.

This is just a school for our kids. We don’t care about that stuff. Move on.

But the schools you send your kids to pretend to. We prefer dealing with honest brokers.

My kids attend 2 different private school - I just reread their websites and mission statement- NOTHING about social justice. Maybe those are just the hippie dippie schools.

And you’re proud of that?

Nothing in my post says proud. We are not hypocrites. I don’t care if I choose to raise my kids in a bubble - why do you care so much how I raise my kids. We are NOT hypocrites and neither is our school.

Right. Just a bunch of elitists who think money makes you better than others. Exactly what I, also with money, did not want for my kids.

Why do I care? Because the rest of humanity has to deal with your spoiled and clueless offspring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a rich person myself I cannot stand private school parents. They absolutely positively think their kids are too special to go to school with kids without money and don’t think their kids can possibly learn something and be better off from the experience. It’s pathetic.

That is why financial aid programs exist. Not sure what your beef is.

The top DC privates are not overrun with poor kids on financial aid and you know it.

Some of us would say so. Financial aid is extremely generous.

At Sidwell, 77 percent of student are full pay at $60k while the other 23 percent pay on average $20k. How “generous” is that? The average “poor” kid pays $20k a year for high school.

What a joke. These are rich kid schools. Full stop. And everyone knows it, including the kids. I did not want that for my own rich kids.

No one is making you send your kids to private schools. This seems like pages of absurdly obvious comments that gets extended by folks confirming the clear. Private schools are expensive and therefore exclusionary, but for financial aid. Hard stop. No one is under any kind of illusion that it's something different, it's that we are paying for a premium product because we think it's better and we can afford it. Nice restaurants don't offer financial aid and are filled with wealthy people. Is that equally problematic? I fly in business or first class...most don't. Is that an issue for you?

Wealthy people, rightly or wrongly but definitionally, can afford to purchase things that less wealthy folks cannot. Is that breaking news is some way?

Yes, but airlines or nice restaurants don’t print in their tickets or menus the label of social justice, so they are not deceiving anyone.

No idea why you think we care about social justice or socioeconomic equality.

This is just a school for our kids. We don’t care about that stuff. Move on.

But the schools you send your kids to pretend to. We prefer dealing with honest brokers.

My kids attend 2 different private school - I just reread their websites and mission statement- NOTHING about social justice. Maybe those are just the hippie dippie schools.

And you’re proud of that?

Nothing in my post says proud. We are not hypocrites. I don’t care if I choose to raise my kids in a bubble - why do you care so much how I raise my kids. We are NOT hypocrites and neither is our school.

Which schools?

The poster will never tell. Too embarrassed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

As it is now.

Yes, but worse. The wealthy public school kids will flee - what we are already seeing in TX - and the non-legacy kids will have to fight with those legacy children whose parents went to private but choose the send their kids public. Because the public schools will retain the kids whose parents chose/couldnt logistically/ or don’t care to apply out. Plus if your kid is in a school where the teachers aren’t fully engaged or know your child personally (because there’s 35 of them) then teacher recommendations will not equal those at better schools all else being equal. Family recommendations from within the community also carry weight - not available for underprivileged or MC people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am new to dc and I noticed the stark difference between the two types of segregation. Private schools are happy if they are racially diverse, but not so happy to be diverse in terms of socioeconomic groups. If find this attitude a bit schizophrenic. Do you think this is ok?

It’s okay because they need wealthy families who can afford to pay tuition.

How is this hard to understand?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way for private schools to be more economically diverse in this area to offer school vouchers so that any kid can go to any school they want and are capable of getting in. The vouchers would have to be enough to at least the tuition amount of the lowest private school. This program would force public schools to shape up their curriculum and quality if they want to stay open. Open competition is always a good thing.

Texas is starting this program next year and you can already see the MC families gaming the system to get their kids priority. Private school applications at my kids’ school was up 270% this year. Really it is taking money away from the public schools and sponsoring MC families to go to private school. My kid was already in private with ADHD - we have parents pay tuition so this is just a discount for already wealthy people. The politicians know this.

It's not taking money away, the money follows the kids. If the MC kid isn't there, the school doesn't get the money. The school that kid goes to gets instead. What's the problem?

Let me explain - I’ll make the math easy.

Say a public school gets 10k for a 10 kid class now. With the vouchers 5 of those public school kids go to private school and augment that 2x. The public school now has 5k and the private (now with 10k extra) can raise their tuition 7%, plus they still have large endowments to buy extras that the public school cannot afford. The private school kids get much much more, while the public schools suffer more. It’s really very simple.

It will pass legislation because people like me want the discount and people like you think you can get a better education. It’s already got my vote and my kids would be attending private anyway. So my tax money earmarked for a public school I don’t use is now going to subsidize my kid instead of yours.

Forgot to mention - those private schools that will accept he influx of ex-public kids will just get harder to get into, so they’ll rely more on legacy and recommendations - so if you’re not already upper class the door will shut tight and be sealed.

As it is now.

Yes, but worse. The wealthy public school kids will flee - what we are already seeing in TX - and the non-legacy kids will have to fight with those legacy children whose parents went to private but choose the send their kids public. Because the public schools will retain the kids whose parents chose/couldnt logistically/ or don’t care to apply out. Plus if your kid is in a school where the teachers aren’t fully engaged or know your child personally (because there’s 35 of them) then teacher recommendations will not equal those at better schools all else being equal. Family recommendations from within the community also carry weight - not available for underprivileged or MC people.

How’s that for socal justice? And this is coming from a private school parent with the ability to see the whole Chan of events.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:As a rich person myself I cannot stand private school parents. They absolutely positively think their kids are too special to go to school with kids without money and don’t think their kids can possibly learn something and be better off from the experience. It’s pathetic.

That is why financial aid programs exist. Not sure what your beef is.

The top DC privates are not overrun with poor kids on financial aid and you know it.

Some of us would say so. Financial aid is extremely generous.

At Sidwell, 77 percent of student are full pay at $60k while the other 23 percent pay on average $20k. How “generous” is that? The average “poor” kid pays $20k a year for high school.

What a joke. These are rich kid schools. Full stop. And everyone knows it, including the kids. I did not want that for my own rich kids.

No one is making you send your kids to private schools. This seems like pages of absurdly obvious comments that gets extended by folks confirming the clear. Private schools are expensive and therefore exclusionary, but for financial aid. Hard stop. No one is under any kind of illusion that it's something different, it's that we are paying for a premium product because we think it's better and we can afford it. Nice restaurants don't offer financial aid and are filled with wealthy people. Is that equally problematic? I fly in business or first class...most don't. Is that an issue for you?

Wealthy people, rightly or wrongly but definitionally, can afford to purchase things that less wealthy folks cannot. Is that breaking news is some way?

Yes, but airlines or nice restaurants don’t print in their tickets or menus the label of social justice, so they are not deceiving anyone.

No idea why you think we care about social justice or socioeconomic equality.

This is just a school for our kids. We don’t care about that stuff. Move on.

But the schools you send your kids to pretend to. We prefer dealing with honest brokers.

My kids attend 2 different private school - I just reread their websites and mission statement- NOTHING about social justice. Maybe those are just the hippie dippie schools.

And you’re proud of that?

Nothing in my post says proud. We are not hypocrites. I don’t care if I choose to raise my kids in a bubble - why do you care so much how I raise my kids. We are NOT hypocrites and neither is our school.

Right. Just a bunch of elitists who think money makes you better than others. Exactly what I, also with money, did not want for my kids.

Why do I care? Because the rest of humanity has to deal with your spoiled and clueless offspring.

How so? Aren’t they segregated for life?