FCPS HS Boundary

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

Why would you be getting a brand new car with all the bells and whistles if your spouse was still driving an old car built over 15 years ago. Makes you sound selfish.

Maybe the Pp had an even older car. My car is 15 years older than my spouse’s car.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

It would all depend on the model, no? You’re just assuming your new car is a BMW and your spouse is driving a Corolla.

I'm that PP. And this scenario actually did happen recently. We both drive Hondas and - as anyone would expect - my new Honda is much nicer than his old one. This is not difficult to comprehend.

If everyone was only getting Hondas that would be a credible analogy. That’s not how things have worked in FCPS. They changed their approach to school renovations so that, if you really want to stick with the car analogies, they switched from entry-level Hondas to Acuras. So, sure, the Acuras are nicer, but it’s not only because they are newer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

Why would you be getting a brand new car with all the bells and whistles if your spouse was still driving an old car built over 15 years ago. Makes you sound selfish.

Maybe the Pp had an even older car. My car is 15 years older than my spouse’s car.

+1
The PP doesn't sound especially bright.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

It would all depend on the model, no? You’re just assuming your new car is a BMW and your spouse is driving a Corolla.

I'm that PP. And this scenario actually did happen recently. We both drive Hondas and - as anyone would expect - my new Honda is much nicer than his old one. This is not difficult to comprehend.

If everyone was only getting Hondas that would be a credible analogy. That’s not how things have worked in FCPS. They changed their approach to school renovations so that, if you really want to stick with the car analogies, they switched from entry-level Hondas to Acuras. So, sure, the Acuras are nicer, but it’s not only because they are newer.

Ok, then wait in the queue like everyone else to receive your Acura.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

“First class” in what sense? lol

Anyway, all schools should be maintained in good repair, buildings, fields, and hardscaping. They don’t all need to be the same size.

If they were all the same size, that would mean expanding every school to 3000 seats like West Potomac and, soon, Centreville. Clearly that isn't going to happen.

On the other hand, several schools that are overcrowded. yet have closer to 2000 than 3000 seats, should be expanded to keep kids near their homes but get them out of the trailers and modulars.

Expansions are not necessary if there are seats elsewhere in the system.

Expansions are fiscally responsible stewardship of taxpayer dollars when the district is doing a full renovation of any high school.

Your statement makes sense for elementary schools, where there is practically one every mile.

But it is completely wrong and misguided when you are talking about high schools, which have expansive boundaries and host thousands of students.

Expand when doing a full gut and you save money and time in the long run. Any tradesperson, structural engineer, accountant or architect can tell you this. Construction 101.

Sure, from a purely logistics perspective. But from an educational view, it is well-researched and understood that high school sizes should be smaller in the <2000 students range. This benefits psychosocial development, safety, and quality of relationships which are all critical for excelling academically.

Exactly! Plus, there are more barriers to getting into clubs and leadership roles (eg, music, sports, NHS, etc).

Lewis couldn’t even field a baseball team a year ago. So many extra opportunities!

You know, MLB has some issues with filling stadiums too. It isn’t quite the draw if was in the old days.

PP referred to sports opportunities.

Yes, but lack of baseball may be a function of a lack of interest.

The goal should be for all FCPS schools to offer at least all the basic VHSL sports (i.e. not the special outlier sports like rifle or crew). That defines equity regarding the athletic opportunities. There may have been kids at Lewis that really wanted to play baseball but couldn’t due to lack of interest. And it is against VHSL policy to transfer to another school just to play sports.

[Anonymous]

If the McLean HS facility is a crummy 1982 Volkswagen Rabbit, then Annandale HS is a 1990 Saturn. Both are total lemons and the campuses need a serious reboot. MCPS has been continuously rebuilding all their old high schools now for decades (or gutting and restoring the historic ones like B-CC HS 25 years ago). FCPS needs to get with the program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

It would all depend on the model, no? You’re just assuming your new car is a BMW and your spouse is driving a Corolla.

I'm that PP. And this scenario actually did happen recently. We both drive Hondas and - as anyone would expect - my new Honda is much nicer than his old one. This is not difficult to comprehend.

If everyone was only getting Hondas that would be a credible analogy. That’s not how things have worked in FCPS. They changed their approach to school renovations so that, if you really want to stick with the car analogies, they switched from entry-level Hondas to Acuras. So, sure, the Acuras are nicer, but it’s not only because they are newer.

Ok, then wait in the queue like everyone else to receive your Acura.

No one suggested otherwise. Of course, some of the Hondas got new tires and engines outside the queue at various times, and others didn’t, even when they needed new tires and engines more.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

It would all depend on the model, no? You’re just assuming your new car is a BMW and your spouse is driving a Corolla.

I'm that PP. And this scenario actually did happen recently. We both drive Hondas and - as anyone would expect - my new Honda is much nicer than his old one. This is not difficult to comprehend.

If everyone was only getting Hondas that would be a credible analogy. That’s not how things have worked in FCPS. They changed their approach to school renovations so that, if you really want to stick with the car analogies, they switched from entry-level Hondas to Acuras. So, sure, the Acuras are nicer, but it’s not only because they are newer.

Ok, then wait in the queue like everyone else to receive your Acura.

No one suggested otherwise. Of course, some of the Hondas got new tires and engines outside the queue at various times, and others didn’t, even when they needed new tires and engines more.

Yes, I remember when McLean got those spiffy radial tires and high-octane engine out of queue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If the McLean HS facility is a crummy 1982 Volkswagen Rabbit, then Annandale HS is a 1990 Saturn. Both are total lemons and the campuses need a serious reboot. MCPS has been continuously rebuilding all their old high schools now for decades (or gutting and restoring the historic ones like B-CC HS 25 years ago). FCPS needs to get with the program.

It was easier for them to do what some posters on this thread wanted and redistrict the hell out of Annandale - moving kids in single-family areas to Falls Church, Lake Braddock, Woodson, and Edison - over the years than step up and invest appropriately in AHS.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

No one should be expanding HS around here. They are already too large. Kids don’t even know half their classmates let alone their classmates’ names.

In any case, the SB is too politically driven to give a wit about education. They are all about their next political position and won’t actually do anything on this topic. I wish they’d stop wasting everyone’s time and emotional capital on boundaries.

Some recent expansions to a design capacity of at least 2500 seats include: Herndon (2779), Madison (2503), Oakton (2646), South Lakes (2717), West Potomac (3049), and West Springfield (2505)

Some ongoing and planned expansions include: Falls Church (2500), Justice (2500), and Centreville (3000)

Schools that were built large include: Lake Braddock (3124), Robinson (2752), South County (2500), and Westfield (2823)

So that cat is out of the bag, and they obviously struggle mightily to find acceptable sites for any new high school. Given all that, it's more than a bit late to start claiming no other schools should be expanded, regardless of their circumstances.

BS. There is no need for size equity.

It's not especially important at the ES or MS level, but it's certainly a consideration at the HS level.

Spending to expand some high schools while blowing off others with an even greater need for additional seats would be the epitome of unfair treatment.

You fill until you hit the limit. Then you decide is it better to cozy up or send your kid elsewhere. Move if you have to. Stop with your calls for equity. Stop wasting tax followers on buildings.

^tax dollars

Spending to ensure HS facilities are generally comparable is an investment in kids and communities. There are huge disparities in facilities within FCPS, just as there are among when it comes to student achievement. A School Board that wants a first-class system pays attention to both.

Smaller schools are more desirable. They also make them more exclusive. Why would anyone want a mega school?

Yes, those smaller, neglected schools like Annandale, Lewis, and Mount Vernon are so desirable compared to Woodson, West Springfield, and West Potomac.

Please explain what you mean by neglected and in what ways expansions will improve students overall mental health and academic outcomes.

NP I interpreted that the PP was referring to the schools that got crappy renovations, like McLean, Annandale, Lewis, and Woodson. Unlike the schools with over the top facilities such as, Fairfax, Herndon, Oakton, West Springfield, Langley.

DP. "Over the top facilities"? Schools being renovated - after waiting decades in the queue - are not somehow now "over the top." What are you talking about?

DP. Compared to some public schools elsewhere in the country, the more recent renovations of FCPS high schools aren't "over the top." That doesn't change the fact that schools built later in FCPS got considerably nicer renovations than schools built earlier - both in terms of the quality of the renovations and expansions - which only served to increase the disparities among schools when it comes to facilities. FCPS needs to do better.

So "over the top" was entirely inaccurate. The schools renovated more recently simply received more up-to-date renovations, as one would expect.

That’s your gloss, but it doesn’t acknowledge that the schools renovated earlier were effectively short-changed. The amounts spent on those “renovations,” even in inflation-adjusted dollars, was much lower.

Give it a rest already. It’s not like the renovations helped students. Also, unless the schools are all renovated at the same time, there will be differences.

+1
If my spouse has a 2000 car and I get a new, 2024 car, it would be expected that my brand new car would be a lot nicer than the older one.

It would all depend on the model, no? You’re just assuming your new car is a BMW and your spouse is driving a Corolla.

I'm that PP. And this scenario actually did happen recently. We both drive Hondas and - as anyone would expect - my new Honda is much nicer than his old one. This is not difficult to comprehend.

If everyone was only getting Hondas that would be a credible analogy. That’s not how things have worked in FCPS. They changed their approach to school renovations so that, if you really want to stick with the car analogies, they switched from entry-level Hondas to Acuras. So, sure, the Acuras are nicer, but it’s not only because they are newer.

Ok, then wait in the queue like everyone else to receive your Acura.

No one suggested otherwise. Of course, some of the Hondas got new tires and engines outside the queue at various times, and others didn’t, even when they needed new tires and engines more.

Yes, I remember when McLean got those spiffy radial tires and high-octane engine out of queue.

The only thing McLean and Annandale got out of queue was equivalent to a new cup holder (a cheap modular). Other schools got the spiffy stuff.

[Anonymous]

Will creating more larger schools help more struggling kids read and do math at grade level? Or will they become one of many more faceless students at these mega schools? Will these mega schools help or hinder efforts to improve chronic absenteeism and truancy? If it’s not a great idea in the first place, why perpetuate it with schools that haven’t been super-sized? Any blips should be temporary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Will creating more larger schools help more struggling kids read and do math at grade level? Or will they become one of many more faceless students at these mega schools? Will these mega schools help or hinder efforts to improve chronic absenteeism and truancy? If it’s not a great idea in the first place, why perpetuate it with schools that haven’t been super-sized? Any blips should be temporary.

Someone could look through the data and break down the test scores, but I believe free lunch students are actually scoring better at the 3000-plus student high schools like Chantilly than at the smaller FCPS schools with high levels of poverty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Will creating more larger schools help more struggling kids read and do math at grade level? Or will they become one of many more faceless students at these mega schools? Will these mega schools help or hinder efforts to improve chronic absenteeism and truancy? If it’s not a great idea in the first place, why perpetuate it with schools that haven’t been super-sized? Any blips should be temporary.

The county can’t just continue to ignore some schools, when they have projections that some already crowded schools could pick up hundreds of additional kids and there’s no obvious place to build a new school. They didn’t worry about “blips” when they expanded other, less crowded schools.

Their priority should be a new renovation queue, not getting folks agitated about a county-wide boundary study they
wouldn’t have the chops to implement successfully.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Will creating more larger schools help more struggling kids read and do math at grade level? Or will they become one of many more faceless students at these mega schools? Will these mega schools help or hinder efforts to improve chronic absenteeism and truancy? If it’s not a great idea in the first place, why perpetuate it with schools that haven’t been super-sized? Any blips should be temporary.

The county can’t just continue to ignore some schools, when they have projections that some already crowded schools could pick up hundreds of additional kids and there’s no obvious place to build a new school. They didn’t worry about “blips” when they expanded other, less crowded schools.

Their priority should be a new renovation queue, not getting folks agitated about a county-wide boundary study they
wouldn’t have the chops to implement successfully.

Before coming up with solutions costing $100s of millions that would take a decade to plan out and build, the easiest approach that can address issues by this September is to simply move neighborhoods at the edges of boundaries to neighboring schools with capacity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:None of the situations are necessary. If you don’t like your kids bumping elbows with other kids, move. There are less crowded options with plenty of seats inside and outside the county.

Good luck moving for better schools when you're suddenly underwater on your mortgage because FCPS shifted your home to a school with a 30% ESL rate and your property value tanked by 25%.

Oh well. This is what we’ve voted for in our state and county. Suck it up buttercup. You’re probably wealthier than 95% of the country.

DP, but as pointed out before no one campaigned for county or state office saying they were committed to large-scale school boundary revisions in FCPS.

It's not an issue where you can predict someone's views based on party affiliation. The far left would redistrict to balance demographics in the name of equity. The far right would redistrict to minimize future taxes and spending on facilities. And most people who aren't either far left or far right would probably say only change school boundaries when it's absolutely necessary and continue to renovate and expand schools in the ordinary course to meet current needs and anticipate future ones.

It’s “far right” not to want to raise taxes for unnecessary expansions and new construction now.

*sigh*

The "right" is a sliding scale of priorities. The center-right want to keep the poor kids segregated while also being in favor of taxpayers subsidizing renovations for their personal school. Perhaps they're more liberal than they think they are.

Going too far right means the possibility of mixing in poor kids through fiscally responsible boundary decisions instead of renovations.

If there’s one thing upon which the nominal right and left upper middle class agree, it’s school boundaries lol.

It never fails.