is volleyball really a "mean girl" sport??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a sexist thread.

Calling bullies out isn’t sexist.

OP here. I am female, and for the record, I was a D1 athlete.

But no one enters middle and high school sports at a very high level. That comes later -- or doesn't. And along the way, there are social elements that are factors in the development of the kids I am raising.

So I am curious who is attracted to the sport. We'll move before my kids start high school most likely and frankly, I don't need to nurture a sport that is known to be mean girl sport all else equal.

Also, I know very little about volleyball, but I do think there may be a truism for whatever reason that certain sports attract on certain personality types, and that sports can also have an impact on who you are

There’s not a lot of running around in volleyball so that might attract some personality types. Maybe they played it on vacation and really liked it.

+1 (8:35 here, LOL)

I think the mean girl piece may also have something to do with the fact that girls tryout for their team every year. What I’m seeing is a lot of jockeying for position and not a lot of team mentality.

That’s every club or travel sports existing and new athletes try out for Team a,b,c. They’ll take your money no matter what.

High schools are large and I assume also run tryouts.

No one good wants to play with nee-to-the sport people. It’s frustrating and injury risk goes up.

[Anonymous]

It’s mean coaches, from what I’ve seen. And lots of very tall girls.

[Anonymous]

Unf girls programs still get second rate coaches whilst all the boys sports get the best coaching staff.

So sick of seeing this.

[Anonymous]

Where we live vball is very intense and parents want their kids to play in college no matter how rinky dink the d1 school- and there are 350+ of them.

They drill 2 hours a day and have quads of steel.

I’m not sure who keeps saying you stand around when you play volleyball but that must be rec level. In a good program everyone is diving and getting low every hit, jumping and getting high for double blocks and double fake/real hit attempts and the bumpers are diving and on the ground every 20 seconds.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe it's just their competitive nature being misunderstood.

Exactly. Athletic girls tend to have more confidence and take less crap than others.

That would be my dd. She’s at a ballet school that’s tough to get into and they tend to feel a little bit superior to girls who kick a ball around. My other dd plays basketball in middle school and has no attitudes either way.

That’s weird to out down other athletes
.
In our community there’s all around respect for any dancer, athlete, team sport or individual sport of you’re putting in the time, getting better, and highly competitive (ie winning).

I would LMAO if a ballet kid was even attempting to out down an AAU bball girl. Lmao.

Look there’s a sport for every body type and intensity level. Most kids do what their parents shoved them at early on.
Girls in particular will stick with a sport if they like the friend group. Some do out of sheer love of the sport.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a sexist thread.

Calling bullies out isn’t sexist.

OP here. I am female, and for the record, I was a D1 athlete.

But no one enters middle and high school sports at a very high level. That comes later -- or doesn't. And along the way, there are social elements that are factors in the development of the kids I am raising.

So I am curious who is attracted to the sport. We'll move before my kids start high school most likely and frankly, I don't need to nurture a sport that is known to be mean girl sport all else equal.

Also, I know very little about volleyball, but I do think there may be a truism for whatever reason that certain sports attract on certain personality types, and that sports can also have an impact on who you are

There’s not a lot of running around in volleyball so that might attract some personality types. Maybe they played it on vacation and really liked it.

So ignorant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like only girls that feel on the periphery of some made of social hierarchy they want to be part of call other girls “mean girls”

Girls that are confident in themselves and have independent thought don’t feel the need to tear others down

Completely agree. But why think of confident girls as complex, decent, flawed, normal, nice kids? Better to vilify them and blame them for everything that's going wrong!!

Girls who are mean are NOT confident. "Mean girl" behavior, including gossip, exclusion, ostracism, back-handed compliments and other forms of relational aggression, are ALL forms of insecurity. Girls who engage in this behavior feel insecure in themselves or their social position, usually both.

Girls who are just confident don't engage in any of these behaviors because they don't feel the need to. Why would they gossip? It's unkind and they have better things to talk about than what other students do. Why would they exclude others? Confident kids are inclusive because, hey, the person you rope into an activity might turn out to be cool or an interesting friend, why not? They don't ostracize because they don't feel the need to elevate themselves by putting a target on anyone else. And they don't engage in back-handed compliments or other passive-aggressive behaviors because confident kids say what they mean and mean what they say, and also have no reason to engage in put downs.

So yes, confident girls exist and sometimes people are envious of their confidence. But when people talk about "mean girls," they are NOT talking about confident kids. The most confident kids in my high school, or my kid's high school, would never get this label because they don't engage in any of these behaviors.

Now, there are kids who are arrogant (not confident), rude, competitive, and constantly putting people down, and I'm sure some of their parents think "Oh wow, look how *confident* my DD is when she laughs at other girls and spreads rumors. I'm just overwhelmed with her confidence! So proud." But we all know what "confident" means in that situation.

Awesome post.

Copying and sending it to my tween daughters right now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is great at it. I feel silly even typing this out, but my older daughter was saying that "everyone knows" that the girls who play volleyball are "mean girls." I mostly rolled my eyes but a friend in another area said it's the same in their area. Is that really true?

It’s grade by grade where the Mean Girls gravitate. Or are pushed by their sorority girl Moms.

After living a few places and having daughters, the perceived “feminine” sports or activities have the propensity to have the most Mean Girls.

In the south the dance & drill teams are full of drama and sabotage.

Around here I could see it being some of the tennis and v ball girls.

Any sport that has tight short skirts, tanks and shorts will attract more Mean Girl moms and daughters. And vice versa. Except swimming. No mean girl will put in the time for that. No boys hanging out there at the 4 hour meet either.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is great at it. I feel silly even typing this out, but my older daughter was saying that "everyone knows" that the girls who play volleyball are "mean girls." I mostly rolled my eyes but a friend in another area said it's the same in their area. Is that really true?

It kind of is, not to say that all the girls on a team are mean girls, but just that mean girls gravitate toward it, much like cheer. Look at the outfits for volleyball and cheer compared to other girls' sports (except swim) and you will see why it attracts a certain type. Other girls' sports do not have such sexualized outfits. Most of what makes a "mean girl" mean is a desire to fight over the attention of boys.

Are you serious with saying volleyball uniforms are sexualized because of the shorts? Give me a break. So what about cross country and track and field? Are those uniforms sexualized, too? Not everything is, you know. Sometimes a uniform is just a uniform and shorts are short because they are easier to move in.

FWIW the girls I know playing volleyball are not mean girls. Please understand that there are at least some mean girls in every sport.

Basketball and soccer have more movement than volleyball and their uniforms are not the slightest bit sexual. Vb uniforms are way too tight and revealing for minors. If you wore a vb uniform to play bb, you would be sent to the locker room to change. Vb as a sport has a distinct culture around it and it is reflected in the uniform.

Tell me more about the distinct culture that is reflected in the uniforms. WTAF..stop sexualizing everything!

They wear bikini bottoms not shorts . Some teams wear bathing suits for beach volleyball. It makes it look like volleyball is just a game not a sport.

This was not the uniform. Maybe wore spandex shorts but some on the team wore leggings. The tops were all long sleeve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like only girls that feel on the periphery of some made of social hierarchy they want to be part of call other girls “mean girls”

Girls that are confident in themselves and have independent thought don’t feel the need to tear others down

Completely agree. But why think of confident girls as complex, decent, flawed, normal, nice kids? Better to vilify them and blame them for everything that's going wrong!!

Girls who are mean are NOT confident. "Mean girl" behavior, including gossip, exclusion, ostracism, back-handed compliments and other forms of relational aggression, are ALL forms of insecurity. Girls who engage in this behavior feel insecure in themselves or their social position, usually both.

Girls who are just confident don't engage in any of these behaviors because they don't feel the need to. Why would they gossip? It's unkind and they have better things to talk about than what other students do. Why would they exclude others? Confident kids are inclusive because, hey, the person you rope into an activity might turn out to be cool or an interesting friend, why not? They don't ostracize because they don't feel the need to elevate themselves by putting a target on anyone else. And they don't engage in back-handed compliments or other passive-aggressive behaviors because confident kids say what they mean and mean what they say, and also have no reason to engage in put downs.

So yes, confident girls exist and sometimes people are envious of their confidence. But when people talk about "mean girls," they are NOT talking about confident kids. The most confident kids in my high school, or my kid's high school, would never get this label because they don't engage in any of these behaviors.

Now, there are kids who are arrogant (not confident), rude, competitive, and constantly putting people down, and I'm sure some of their parents think "Oh wow, look how *confident* my DD is when she laughs at other girls and spreads rumors. I'm just overwhelmed with her confidence! So proud." But we all know what "confident" means in that situation.

this is BS calculated to make us feel sorry for the bullies. poor things, they are only doing it because they feel so bad about themselves.

in reality, kids with low self esteem do not have capacity or social support to execute exclusion, bullying etc. it is led by the confident girls, with the assistance of the cowardly ones.

I'm the PP and I don't say this to make anyone feel sorry for bullies. I say it so that parents understand that when their kids engage in these behaviors, it is not a sign of "confidence." It's a sign that these kids don't feel good about themselves and will therefore tear down others to elevate themselves. It is not a compliment or even a plea for empathy. It's information.

And it's true. Though I'll also note that not all insecure kids become bullies. I think insecurity manifests two ways -- externalized and internalized. Some kids internalize their insecurity and these kids become very self-critical, often shy or meek-mannered. What is disturbing is that in really toxic "mean girl" dynamics (which can also exist with boys though it's more insidious with girls who are socialized for passive aggression and fake niceness) is that it's usually one group of insecure kids terrorizing another group of insecure kids. And often there is movement in the groups, and the terrorized can become the terrorizers. But it's just a group of insecure kids working out their insecurities on each other.

I blame parents, and to a lesser extent schools and other institutions working with these kids, for failing to understand and address the behavior. But as the kids get older I think you also have to hold them accountable. There are plenty of bullies in adulthood too, and they are also insecure. But they need to do something about it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe it's just their competitive nature being misunderstood.

Exactly. Athletic girls tend to have more confidence and take less crap than others.

That would be my dd. She’s at a ballet school that’s tough to get into and they tend to feel a little bit superior to girls who kick a ball around. My other dd plays basketball in middle school and has no attitudes either way.

That’s weird to out down other athletes
.
In our community there’s all around respect for any dancer, athlete, team sport or individual sport of you’re putting in the time, getting better, and highly competitive (ie winning).

I would LMAO if a ballet kid was even attempting to out down an AAU bball girl. Lmao.

Look there’s a sport for every body type and intensity level. Most kids do what their parents shoved them at early on.
Girls in particular will stick with a sport if they like the friend group. Some do out of sheer love of the sport.

I didn’t say it was right it’s just the way girls are everywhere. It bothered me.

Based on the many posts being about mean girls I don’t think too many communities have all around respect. Plus all the posts about rec teams being full of uncoordinated unreliable un athletic kids and how their kid can’t play with them are over the top.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is great at it. I feel silly even typing this out, but my older daughter was saying that "everyone knows" that the girls who play volleyball are "mean girls." I mostly rolled my eyes but a friend in another area said it's the same in their area. Is that really true?

It kind of is, not to say that all the girls on a team are mean girls, but just that mean girls gravitate toward it, much like cheer. Look at the outfits for volleyball and cheer compared to other girls' sports (except swim) and you will see why it attracts a certain type. Other girls' sports do not have such sexualized outfits. Most of what makes a "mean girl" mean is a desire to fight over the attention of boys.

Are you serious with saying volleyball uniforms are sexualized because of the shorts? Give me a break. So what about cross country and track and field? Are those uniforms sexualized, too? Not everything is, you know. Sometimes a uniform is just a uniform and shorts are short because they are easier to move in.

FWIW the girls I know playing volleyball are not mean girls. Please understand that there are at least some mean girls in every sport.

Basketball and soccer have more movement than volleyball and their uniforms are not the slightest bit sexual. Vb uniforms are way too tight and revealing for minors. If you wore a vb uniform to play bb, you would be sent to the locker room to change. Vb as a sport has a distinct culture around it and it is reflected in the uniform.

Tell me more about the distinct culture that is reflected in the uniforms. WTAF..stop sexualizing everything!

They wear bikini bottoms not shorts . Some teams wear bathing suits for beach volleyball. It makes it look like volleyball is just a game not a sport.

This was not the uniform. Maybe wore spandex shorts but some on the team wore leggings. The tops were all long sleeve.

Many of the college teams wear bikini bottoms. Olympic players wear bikini bottoms and beach volleyball has swimsuits.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is great at it. I feel silly even typing this out, but my older daughter was saying that "everyone knows" that the girls who play volleyball are "mean girls." I mostly rolled my eyes but a friend in another area said it's the same in their area. Is that really true?

It kind of is, not to say that all the girls on a team are mean girls, but just that mean girls gravitate toward it, much like cheer. Look at the outfits for volleyball and cheer compared to other girls' sports (except swim) and you will see why it attracts a certain type. Other girls' sports do not have such sexualized outfits. Most of what makes a "mean girl" mean is a desire to fight over the attention of boys.

Are you serious with saying volleyball uniforms are sexualized because of the shorts? Give me a break. So what about cross country and track and field? Are those uniforms sexualized, too? Not everything is, you know. Sometimes a uniform is just a uniform and shorts are short because they are easier to move in.

FWIW the girls I know playing volleyball are not mean girls. Please understand that there are at least some mean girls in every sport.

Basketball and soccer have more movement than volleyball and their uniforms are not the slightest bit sexual. Vb uniforms are way too tight and revealing for minors. If you wore a vb uniform to play bb, you would be sent to the locker room to change. Vb as a sport has a distinct culture around it and it is reflected in the uniform.

Tell me more about the distinct culture that is reflected in the uniforms. WTAF..stop sexualizing everything!

They wear bikini bottoms not shorts . Some teams wear bathing suits for beach volleyball. It makes it look like volleyball is just a game not a sport.

This was not the uniform. Maybe wore spandex shorts but some on the team wore leggings. The tops were all long sleeve.

Many of the college teams wear bikini bottoms. Olympic players wear bikini bottoms and beach volleyball has swimsuits.

Okay, but I thought this thread was asking if teens that play volleyball are mean girls and about their outfits. Most do not play in college and even fewer play in the Olympics. Beach isn’t as popular around here as indoor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe it's just their competitive nature being misunderstood.

Exactly. Athletic girls tend to have more confidence and take less crap than others.

That would be my dd. She’s at a ballet school that’s tough to get into and they tend to feel a little bit superior to girls who kick a ball around. My other dd plays basketball in middle school and has no attitudes either way.

That’s weird to out down other athletes
.
In our community there’s all around respect for any dancer, athlete, team sport or individual sport of you’re putting in the time, getting better, and highly competitive (ie winning).

I would LMAO if a ballet kid was even attempting to out down an AAU bball girl. Lmao.

Look there’s a sport for every body type and intensity level. Most kids do what their parents shoved them at early on.
Girls in particular will stick with a sport if they like the friend group. Some do out of sheer love of the sport.

I didn’t say it was right it’s just the way girls are everywhere. It bothered me.

Based on the many posts being about mean girls I don’t think too many communities have all around respect. Plus all the posts about rec teams being full of uncoordinated unreliable un athletic kids and how their kid can’t play with them are over the top.

Rec team participation drops off after 3rd grade as kids go into 2-3 day a week practices for their 1 or 2 primary sports or activities.
Sure you can still do parent coach rec sports once a week with your neighborhood if anyone’s left to make the game or if there is one practice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My daughter is great at it. I feel silly even typing this out, but my older daughter was saying that "everyone knows" that the girls who play volleyball are "mean girls." I mostly rolled my eyes but a friend in another area said it's the same in their area. Is that really true?

Your kid should be able to figure it out soon and then go to a sport with nicer kids if needed.

Track, X country, swimming had the smartest, nicest normal kids across the board everywhere we’re been.

Soccer was the sporty smart girls too.

Vball can be.

Softball is awesome if you put the technicals time in and like it. Body shapes of all sizes.

Basketball had all body shapes too but often the girls with older brothers and need to be tough if the team is competitive.

Tennis was a mix of mean girls and just girls who played really well their whole life.

LAX always seems a mystery to me and wasn’t around much in Chicago where I grew up.

Hockey here in Team Maryland is down to earth, fun and hard working.