Banneker versus School Without Walls

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's interesting because Sidwell has 57% students of color, 30% of students on aid (with a greater percentage in high school) and an average SAT score of close to 1500.

Sidewall is the real deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Average SAT scores:

Banneker

Math: 480
Verbal: 500
Total: 980

SWW:

Math: 630
Verbal: 650
Total: 1280

Wilson:

Math: 580
Verbal: 590
Total: 1170

I will say it again: SAT SCORES CORRELATE TO FAMILY SES. Banneker is a Title 1 school.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markkantrowitz/2021/05/21/how-admissions-tests-discriminate-against-low-income-and-minority-student-admissions-at-selective-colleges/

Correct! Families that can pay for tutoring will always have an advantage in regard to standardized testing. A lot of schools are considering making the testing optional. The results don't indicate how well a student will do college.

Give us a break. It's no secret that ANY diligent high school student with Internet access at home, school or a public library has been able to get great free tutoring via Khan Academy videos in the last several years. Khan even has a contract with the College Board/SAT organization to provide the tutoring.

Yes, some colleges have made the SAT optional, particularly in the last 18 months when the pandemic rendered in-person testing impossible in many locales. The SAT just isn't a very difficult test for students who read a lot for both school and pleasure, and work hard in algebra and geometry classes, to ace, including low-income students. The math tested in essentially 7th-9th grade math for the college-bound, no great mountain to climb. Deeply unimpressed with Banneker's average SAT scores given that admissions to the program is supposedly highly selective.

PS. I went to Title 1 schools then a NYC magnet HS, parents spoke English poorly and worked unstable blue collar jobs. I scored 700s, no tutoring.

If you think free tutoring from Khan equates to $125/hr personal tutoring, I have some swamp land I need to unload. Clearly you don't know how the game is played.

[Anonymous]

What if a HS GPA is earned at a school where easy As are the norm? The SAT has been a useful tool to help colleges assess what amounts to fairly basic literacy and numeracy for the college-bound since 1926.

My middle schooler needed to score at least 1200 on SATs in the spring to qualify to attend an academic camp between 7th and 8th grades. He was hardly alone - he attended the camp with some DCPS classmates. We didn't pay to have him tutored, he prepped himself effectively on-line.

Stop with the excuses already for Banneker's rueful SAT scores.

[Anonymous]

Complete nonsense. Free tutoring on Khan Academy is just fine if your kid is willing to work through the videos diligently.

Students who read a lot from a young age and study the test format generally ace the SAT verbal section, which isn't nearly as long or as difficult as it was pre 2019, when the test format changed yet again.

The math tested doesn't even go as far as trig, let alone calc. Nobody needs an expensive tutor to score high on the SATs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Average SAT scores:

Banneker

Math: 480
Verbal: 500
Total: 980

SWW:

Math: 630
Verbal: 650
Total: 1280

Wilson:

Math: 580
Verbal: 590
Total: 1170

I will say it again: SAT SCORES CORRELATE TO FAMILY SES. Banneker is a Title 1 school.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markkantrowitz/2021/05/21/how-admissions-tests-discriminate-against-low-income-and-minority-student-admissions-at-selective-colleges/

Correct! Families that can pay for tutoring will always have an advantage in regard to standardized testing. A lot of schools are considering making the testing optional. The results don't indicate how well a student will do college.

I actually agree that it's not a great indicator of success in college. I am an incredible test taker -- national merit scholar finalist (which means top 1 percent in sat/psat), 99th percentile IQ, ACT, GRE,etc -- and I had TERRIBLE grades in college. I ended being sort of successful but have a very unusual path.

GPA is a much better indicator of how well someone will do in college.

You must have failed statistics too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Average SAT scores:

Banneker

Math: 480
Verbal: 500
Total: 980

SWW:

Math: 630
Verbal: 650
Total: 1280

Wilson:

Math: 580
Verbal: 590
Total: 1170

I will say it again: SAT SCORES CORRELATE TO FAMILY SES. Banneker is a Title 1 school.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markkantrowitz/2021/05/21/how-admissions-tests-discriminate-against-low-income-and-minority-student-admissions-at-selective-colleges/

Correct! Families that can pay for tutoring will always have an advantage in regard to standardized testing. A lot of schools are considering making the testing optional. The results don't indicate how well a student will do college.

I actually agree that it's not a great indicator of success in college. I am an incredible test taker -- national merit scholar finalist (which means top 1 percent in sat/psat), 99th percentile IQ, ACT, GRE,etc -- and I had TERRIBLE grades in college. I ended being sort of successful but have a very unusual path.

GPA is a much better indicator of how well someone will do in college.

I am horrible at standardized tests and did poorly but graduated with honors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Average SAT scores:

Banneker

Math: 480
Verbal: 500
Total: 980

SWW:

Math: 630
Verbal: 650
Total: 1280

Wilson:

Math: 580
Verbal: 590
Total: 1170

I will say it again: SAT SCORES CORRELATE TO FAMILY SES. Banneker is a Title 1 school.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markkantrowitz/2021/05/21/how-admissions-tests-discriminate-against-low-income-and-minority-student-admissions-at-selective-colleges/

Correct! Families that can pay for tutoring will always have an advantage in regard to standardized testing. A lot of schools are considering making the testing optional. The results don't indicate how well a student will do college.

I actually agree that it's not a great indicator of success in college. I am an incredible test taker -- national merit scholar finalist (which means top 1 percent in sat/psat), 99th percentile IQ, ACT, GRE,etc -- and I had TERRIBLE grades in college. I ended being sort of successful but have a very unusual path.

GPA is a much better indicator of how well someone will do in college.

Not in most schools in DCPS where there is grade inflation, easy courses with easy A’s, and low standards, rigor, and expectations.

Niece not in DCPS but at school with easy A’s. Bombed the PSAT this past year.

You can be an incredible test taker and be lazy, unmotivated and not do well in school. But you are an outlier on the bell shape curve.

[Anonymous]

GPAs are so inflated in DCPS (and many public districts) at this point that I find a GPA as an indicator questionable. Perhaps in the past when there were actual grading standards but at this point when you can turn in total nonsense and get a 63%? I doubt it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Average SAT scores:

Banneker

Math: 480
Verbal: 500
Total: 980

SWW:

Math: 630
Verbal: 650
Total: 1280

Wilson:

Math: 580
Verbal: 590
Total: 1170

I will say it again: SAT SCORES CORRELATE TO FAMILY SES. Banneker is a Title 1 school.



https://www.forbes.com/sites/markkantrowitz/2021/05/21/how-admissions-tests-discriminate-against-low-income-and-minority-student-admissions-at-selective-colleges/

Correct! Families that can pay for tutoring will always have an advantage in regard to standardized testing. A lot of schools are considering making the testing optional. The results don't indicate how well a student will do college.

I actually agree that it's not a great indicator of success in college. I am an incredible test taker -- national merit scholar finalist (which means top 1 percent in sat/psat), 99th percentile IQ, ACT, GRE,etc -- and I had TERRIBLE grades in college. I ended being sort of successful but have a very unusual path.

GPA is a much better indicator of how well someone will do in college.

You must have failed statistics too.

I got poor grades not from lack of understanding but because I was having too much fun having sex. I did discover a major I became obsessed with late in college and did well in that, and learned how to work hard later in my twenties and now I'm doing just fine!

This is totally tangential, though I will say I don't think SAT is the foolproof indicator some hope. DC is full of very successful people who had middling SAT scores.

[Anonymous]

Middling SAT scores, OK, but 480 math and 500 verbal the averages at a test-in magnet HS?

Those scores aren't middling, they're subpar, nudging disgraceful, no matter how "far from opportunity" students might be.

It sounds like Banneker admins and teachers aren't very interested in helping students prep for SATS, just not on their agenda.

[Anonymous]

NP. My DH does horribly on standardized tests. 900 on the SAT, yet graduated from an excellent private high school with a 3.9 GPA. He was offered a full ride to college based on merit. Majored in chemistry. Graduated at the top of his class and was offered a full ride to med school. The SAT says NOTHING about future college performance or future success.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. My DH does horribly on standardized tests. 900 on the SAT, yet graduated from an excellent private high school with a 3.9 GPA. He was offered a full ride to college based on merit. Majored in chemistry. Graduated at the top of his class and was offered a full ride to med school. The SAT says NOTHING about future college performance or future success.

NP and while I don’t think the SAT is the end all be all of future success, one anecdote is not actual data to support either side of the argument. Good for your DH, doesn’t tell me anything about the SAT and it’s ability to predict college performance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. My DH does horribly on standardized tests. 900 on the SAT, yet graduated from an excellent private high school with a 3.9 GPA. He was offered a full ride to college based on merit. Majored in chemistry. Graduated at the top of his class and was offered a full ride to med school. The SAT says NOTHING about future college performance or future success.

Your DH is an extreme outlier.

FYI

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:NP. My DH does horribly on standardized tests. 900 on the SAT, yet graduated from an excellent private high school with a 3.9 GPA. He was offered a full ride to college based on merit. Majored in chemistry. Graduated at the top of his class and was offered a full ride to med school. The SAT says NOTHING about future college performance or future success.

Hopefully your kids got his smarts because your anecdote says nothing about whether the SAT is statistically a good predictor of college or future performance. I am sure your husband would be happy to explain to you why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP. My DH does horribly on standardized tests. 900 on the SAT, yet graduated from an excellent private high school with a 3.9 GPA. He was offered a full ride to college based on merit. Majored in chemistry. Graduated at the top of his class and was offered a full ride to med school. The SAT says NOTHING about future college performance or future success.

Your DH is an extreme outlier.

FYI

The odd teenager is always going to freeze up on standardized tests, even if they could answer most of the questions correctly in a low-pressure setting. Colleges know this, helping explain why the Test Optional movement is steadily gaining ground nationally.

I'm just not buying that the SAT says "nothing" about future college performance, because the test just isn't difficult for a HS student who's well read and did OK in MS or HS algebra and geometry. SATs are pitched at an 8th or 9th grade level for strong students who aren't geniuses or prodigies.

If high SAT scores were out of reach for cohorts of the best-prepped low-SES minority students, there's no way that average scores at the 9 NYC magnet test-in high schools, where at-risk/FARMs students are strongly represented, would be 1200+. What's obviously happening at Banneker, and Eastern, Dunbar, Ballou, Anacostia, is that the the most able low SES students in the system seldom get the essential support/prep they need to score high.

The fact that the depressing status quo works for our politicians, ed leaders, and the bleeding hearts and apologists for DCPS' failings on this thread is shameful.