Cursing during arguments

[Anonymous]

I wouldn’t consider saying “f*ck, why are we even fighting about this” or even “why the f*ck did you do x?” To be verbal abuse. It might be disrespectful, depending on what exactly you say. But not verbal abuse.

But it doesn’t matter if everyone on DCUM agrees that it’s not verbal abuse. It bothers your wife, so stop doing it. It seems like a minor thing to change, so why don’t you? As I said before, is this the hill you want to die on?

And no, I’m not perfect with my spouse, and change everything just because my spouse asked me to. But I try my best to honor his emotional land mines. If I know something sets him off or escalates a situation, I figure out a way not to do that.

[Anonymous]

As a person who has actually been a victim of verbal abuse, your wife is taking it way out of proportion.

[Anonymous]

OP, do you realize looking for validation here is pointless? How will any of this help you? Are you going to show her the thread as proof she shouldn’t feel the way she does? Everyone and every marriage is different.
BTW, DH and I have said F off over the course of an almost 30 year marriage. It has to be an intense argument, but we both have done it. We don’t harbor resentment. Does that matter to you or your wife (or anyone else reading this)? No.

[Anonymous]

Just go for the jugular... Tell her she’s a f’n c&@t

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hello. My wife and I have been having an ongoing issue for many many years. (In my opinion) She is extremely sensitive to any cursing. I have always been trying to limit it, but she expects (demands) it to be completely zero, and I don't think that is possible in a relationship where two adults live together for 20 years and have arguments. She says that I am the crazy one and that in all other families nobody curses when they argue. So I want to know what the truth is.

The cursing that comes out of my mouth is just "f_ck" and various variations of it - e.g. this is "f_cking b_llshit". I'd say probably the worst that comes out is "oh f_ck off", but very rarely, if i had to guess maybe once a month or so. I definitely never say anything personally demeaning, along the lines of "b_tch" etc. Only what I personally consider "cursing out of general frustration", not "cursing at her". However, to her any curse word, like just using "f_ck" anywhere in the heat of argument, is "verbal abuse". So I want to know - how are the arguments in other real families? Do you guys and gals curse? Are the examples that I mention "verbal abuse", or is this just what happens during fights? Do people really not curse during fights AT ALL? If i'm the crazy one - I do want to know. I only ask that people don't pick sides, like "team husband" vs "team wife".   

You've known her for more than 20 years. She's been sensitive to cursing for more than 20 years. She's been asking you to stop for MORE THAN 20 YEARS.

This isn't about whether it is "normal" or not. Or if "Nobody" or "Everybody" curses when they argue. You know it isn't that black & white. It doesn't matter what other families do. What matters is that it is affecting your wife, and you are not treating her discomfort with cursing with respect. Do you care more about cursing in anger than you do about cultivating a strong relationship with your wife? Maybe you do, and in that case, keep doing what you have been doing for the last 20 years: putting your cursing above her discomfort. But if you do actually respect your wife, and want to have a good relationship, work on curbing the cursing.

[JL41]

OP here. Ok, a lot of very useful lectures here from people who have never met me or my wife, thank you! I'm actually very surprised that not a single lecturing person asked whether my wife ever curses during an argument? She actually does! A lot less often than me, I agree with that, but certainly does, and not like "once a year". What, it has never happened in history of marriage that a person always finds an excuse when they do X, but when the other spouse does it, it's completely unacceptable? I figured you'd ask before jumping to conclusions and lectures.

It seems like a minor thing to change, so why don’t you? As I said before, is this the hill you want to die on?

If this was a hill I was willing to die on, we'd be divorced a decade ago. I AM most definitely doing my best, as far as it is practically possible. But a heated argument is a heated argument. If am VERY upset by something she said, things slip. Have you never yelled at your kids when you're angry, even though you wish you didn't? Since I now told you that it's a bad thing, can you now commit to never ever doing it in future? I'm not saying that cursing is ok. It's not. In a perfect world it would never happen, but humans are not perfect.

But it doesn’t matter if everyone on DCUM agrees that it’s not verbal abuse.

Well, I think it does matter actually. It does make a difference whether the situation is "I'm a verbally abusive husband and she's the victimized wife", or whether it is "I am doing my best to reach the unreasonably high bar that she set, mostly getting there, but occasionally I slip and say FK in a heat of an argument". I think if you were the one being labeled a "verbally abusive spouse", it would matter to you too. Like i said, i AM doing my best to reach the bar that she set for me, but I don't think I'm a verbal abuser if I slip once in awhile. Or maybe I am - that was the whole point of asking this question.

[Anonymous]

Cursing is fine. Saying F off to your wife is NOT. Wow

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hello. My wife and I have been having an ongoing issue for many many years. (In my opinion) She is extremely sensitive to any cursing. I have always been trying to limit it, but she expects (demands) it to be completely zero, and I don't think that is possible in a relationship where two adults live together for 20 years and have arguments. She says that I am the crazy one and that in all other families nobody curses when they argue. So I want to know what the truth is.

The cursing that comes out of my mouth is just "f_ck" and various variations of it - e.g. this is "f_cking b_llshit". I'd say probably the worst that comes out is "oh f_ck off", but very rarely, if i had to guess maybe once a month or so. I definitely never say anything personally demeaning, along the lines of "b_tch" etc. Only what I personally consider "cursing out of general frustration", not "cursing at her". However, to her any curse word, like just using "f_ck" anywhere in the heat of argument, is "verbal abuse". So I want to know - how are the arguments in other real families? Do you guys and gals curse? Are the examples that I mention "verbal abuse", or is this just what happens during fights? Do people really not curse during fights AT ALL? If i'm the crazy one - I do want to know. I only ask that people don't pick sides, like "team husband" vs "team wife".   

Yikes. I was on your side (I curse like a sailor) until I got to the bolded. You tell your wife to f*** off once a MONTH and think that's "very rarely"??

This is not a healthy relationship. You aren't cursing in general, you're cursing at her. Routinely. Stop that.

[Anonymous]

OP.

Yikes. I was on your side (I curse like a sailor) until I got to the bolded. You tell your wife to f*** off once a MONTH and think that's "very rarely"??

This is not a healthy relationship. You aren't cursing in general, you're cursing at her. Routinely. Stop that.

Fair enough. I will do my absolute best to never say it. Was already doing my best, will try even harder. Problem solved, let's move on to the question that I actually asked.

The problem is that ANY time i say FK during an argument - that's it, argument is over, she won, that was "verbal abuse". I don't think that's a correct interpretation of what "verbal abuse" is. If you heard somewhere that "she was a victim of constant verbal abuse", would your first thought be "wow, he must have used a word FK during arguments"? I find that hard to believe.

[Anonymous]

OP, do you similarly struggle to not use profanity at work? If so, it sounds like you could use some better anger management tools. If not, it’s worth considering why your wife is seemingly worthy of less respect than your co-workers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP again. Also, “eff off” was provided as an example of THE worst thing I would ever say. Everyone seems to jump on it and interpret it as that’s what is said all the time, or even often.

Anyway, my main question is - is saying “f_uck” or “wtf” during argument a verbal abuse? That sounds like a really extreme view to me, but maybe I’m wrong.

The question is, do you say it TO YOUR WIFE? Because if you do say that - EVER - to any family member, much less your wife, well yes, that is not acceptable. That's not "cursing during arguments"; it's verbal abuse directed at the person you vowed to love, honor, and cherish.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn’t consider saying “f*ck, why are we even fighting about this” or even “why the f*ck did you do x?” To be verbal abuse. It might be disrespectful, depending on what exactly you say. But not verbal abuse.

But it doesn’t matter if everyone on DCUM agrees that it’s not verbal abuse. It bothers your wife, so stop doing it. It seems like a minor thing to change, so why don’t you? As I said before, is this the hill you want to die on?

And no, I’m not perfect with my spouse, and change everything just because my spouse asked me to. But I try my best to honor his emotional land mines. If I know something sets him off or escalates a situation, I figure out a way not to do that.

I agree with you.

Saying "eff off" is vastly different from the examples you give, however. Your examples are "cursing during an argument," whereas saying "eff off" to (TO) your spouse during an argument is cursing *directed at your spouse*. Not the same thing at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn’t consider saying “f*ck, why are we even fighting about this” or even “why the f*ck did you do x?” To be verbal abuse. It might be disrespectful, depending on what exactly you say. But not verbal abuse.

But it doesn’t matter if everyone on DCUM agrees that it’s not verbal abuse. It bothers your wife, so stop doing it. It seems like a minor thing to change, so why don’t you? As I said before, is this the hill you want to die on?

And no, I’m not perfect with my spouse, and change everything just because my spouse asked me to. But I try my best to honor his emotional land mines. If I know something sets him off or escalates a situation, I figure out a way not to do that.

I agree with you.

Saying "eff off" is vastly different from the examples you give, however. Your examples are "cursing during an argument," whereas saying "eff off" to (TO) your spouse during an argument is cursing *directed at your spouse*. Not the same thing at all.

+1

[Anonymous]

We’ve been married 33 years and maybe once or twice one of us cursed during an argument. It is absolutely unacceptable but it’s ok to think it.

[Anonymous]

JL41 wrote:OP here. Ok, a lot of very useful lectures here from people who have never met me or my wife, thank you! I'm actually very surprised that not a single lecturing person asked whether my wife ever curses during an argument? She actually does! A lot less often than me, I agree with that, but certainly does, and not like "once a year". What, it has never happened in history of marriage that a person always finds an excuse when they do X, but when the other spouse does it, it's completely unacceptable? I figured you'd ask before jumping to conclusions and lectures.

It seems like a minor thing to change, so why don’t you? As I said before, is this the hill you want to die on?

If this was a hill I was willing to die on, we'd be divorced a decade ago. I AM most definitely doing my best, as far as it is practically possible. But a heated argument is a heated argument. If am VERY upset by something she said, things slip. Have you never yelled at your kids when you're angry, even though you wish you didn't? Since I now told you that it's a bad thing, can you now commit to never ever doing it in future? I'm not saying that cursing is ok. It's not. In a perfect world it would never happen, but humans are not perfect.

But it doesn’t matter if everyone on DCUM agrees that it’s not verbal abuse.

Well, I think it does matter actually. It does make a difference whether the situation is "I'm a verbally abusive husband and she's the victimized wife", or whether it is "I am doing my best to reach the unreasonably high bar that she set, mostly getting there, but occasionally I slip and say FK in a heat of an argument". I think if you were the one being labeled a "verbally abusive spouse", it would matter to you too. Like i said, i AM doing my best to reach the bar that she set for me, but I don't think I'm a verbal abuser if I slip once in awhile. Or maybe I am - that was the whole point of asking this question.

I don’t believe you, that you are doing your best. Do you curse at work? What’s that, you say? You don’t?

You are capable of control at home. You can exercise the same control at home that you do elsewhere.