At a loss with classroom behavior issues

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was instructed to not leave specific notes about student X in my sub plans because his parents believe he is being targeted by staff. So I had to make a generic note to watch students near the door. The last time I was out, student x intentionally shut a classmate’s hand in the door —something he has attempted with other kids before. Now the injured kid’s parents are irate that the sub let it happen.

Here is the crux of the issue. The sub didn’t “let” anything happen. The child purposely shut the door on someone’s else’s hand. Blame is misplaced in schools these days.

So, I have to ask--how is that kid's IEP formulated to address this behavior, given that you know it has been attempted with other kids? And would that IEP, as written, have imposed any requirements on whoever was working in the classroom that day as the classroom teacher? And if so, how were those requirements communicated or otherwise addressed re: having a sub?

Where did she mention that the kid had an IEP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

[Anonymous]

My principal’s kid has Down Syndrome and it took nearly two years for him to get a one-on-one and she knows the system. Plus, how many people want that minimum wage job where you are physically abused and spend your days dealing with kids who take off running. No thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

[Anonymous]

Teacher here. If your child gets hurt you need to call the police and report it. If you are a teacher, you need to file a police report if you are hurt. That is what it will take to get the disruptive kid into a more appropriate setting. You absolutely have the right to do this. The other children in the class are suffering from secondary trauma by all this upheaval. You must contact the school board and your principal’s supervisor. The disruptive child’s parents seem to have more rights than the others in these situations, and it’s not okay.

It is so hard to find aides, and they are typically not trained beyond a high school education.

[Anonymous]

You need to inmmediately complain and say your child is scared and anxious. Tell your child if the classroom is evacuated and they witness and aggression or unsafe behavior to go to nurse and say they don't feel well and to beg to call you. Go immediately to pick up your child and keep them home the next day. Call and complain again to principal and demand your child be moved classrooms or the other child be moved.

In the end if your child's cohort is filled with kids like this I would move my kid to Catholic school or a private school where discipline is enforced. I have 3 kids and my oldest child's cohort was amazing. No major behavior problems, nice parents, etc. My younger child's cohort was a nightmare. Several kids so out of control they would evaluate classrooms. Not so nice moms, bratty kids, cliquish behavior. I moved him in second grade around November after his class was repeatedly evacuated. Another kid ran out if the classroom, another kid wouldn't keep quiet and would never stop talking, etc.

I visited 2 Catholic schools about equidistant from my house. I asked people I knew who had kids there what cohort for my child's grade was better.

[Anonymous]

This is one of the many reasons why teachers quit. They are abused at work and there is nothing they can do about it.

[Anonymous]

OP I had a similar problem with my DD in 4th grade. After complaints were not addressed and actually I was reprimanded by the principal, I pulled DD. Paid 14K for private school in Colorado (where we live). It was worth it as DD had a bad knee and some of the wild children put her physical safety at risk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

Its life in public school. Not all kids are as perfect as yours. Most kids who need attention and supports don't get it and many of us pay a fortune privately in services or have to hire advocates or attorneys and basically sue. You can always transfer to a private.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

Its life in public school. Not all kids are as perfect as yours. Most kids who need attention and supports don't get it and many of us pay a fortune privately in services or have to hire advocates or attorneys and basically sue. You can always transfer to a private.

Oh for goodness sake. OP doesn't need to transfer her child. OP needs to make some complaints to her child's principal and to any school board member who will listen. She needs to focus on 1) her child feels unsafe and scared, and 2) her child is developing school reluctance. This other child has needs that are not being met if the child is such a disruption in the classroom. If OP raises enough stink the child hopefully will be placed in a self-contained environment that is more suitable for him and his current classmates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

I'm the PP from a different school, but parents complaining actually did get the child an aide, which I'm told has made things much better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

Its life in public school. Not all kids are as perfect as yours. Most kids who need attention and supports don't get it and many of us pay a fortune privately in services or have to hire advocates or attorneys and basically sue. You can always transfer to a private.

So could you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

Its life in public school. Not all kids are as perfect as yours. Most kids who need attention and supports don't get it and many of us pay a fortune privately in services or have to hire advocates or attorneys and basically sue. You can always transfer to a private.

He is not perfect. But he is also not throwing books across the room at other children and screaming daily at the top of his lungs while he kicks chairs. I don't have money for private school; is it unreasonable to expect that his needs are as important as any other child's?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

Why doesn't a child who needs this much help have an aide? 1) If a child is new to a school with no paperwork from an old school, new to the country or most often, new to school in general in kindergarten, a school cannot hold a domain meeting requesting an evaluation for 45 school days. 2) A crap ton of documentation and RTI has to happen before most evaluations will happen. 3) A 1:1 aide in a gen ed room, in my school at least, is considered the MOST restrictive environment, even more so than say being placed in an ED/BD room, that is possible. So schools don't like to use that option. 4) Aides are expensive. Districts don't like to pay for them 5) It is VERY difficult to find an aide to work with some of the kids who need them. When that aide has to follow a detailed BIP or crisis plan, it takes tremendous patience. It can also mean that aide putting themself in harm's way each day. How many people are just dying to get paid $11 an hour and get spit on or kicked? And then add in if you have a district that just doesn't want to deal with all this for one reason or the other? It means the kid in question doesn't get the help they need, the other kids and the staff suffers and it is a lose-lose situation.

OP here. I didn't know any of this--thank you. I didn't realize how hard it is for a child to be assigned an aide and how hard it is to find one. What is the answer here? A teacher already stretched thin with the demands of a full classroom, plus at least one or two kids whose needs and behavior dominate their attention--that feels terribly unfair to the teacher, the kids who need the extra assistance, and the rest of the class. My kid says the outburts are loud, sudden, and last a long time--he's on edge waiting for it, even when it isn't happening. I wonder how many other kids in the class feel the same? Not to mention all the hours of instruction interrupted.

Its life in public school. Not all kids are as perfect as yours. Most kids who need attention and supports don't get it and many of us pay a fortune privately in services or have to hire advocates or attorneys and basically sue. You can always transfer to a private.

OP is a taxpayer and should not have to put her kid in private. Kids should not routinely have their hands smashed in classroom doors. Kids should not routinely have their classroom evacuated because of a child who is unable to function in a classroom setting. The other 99% of the children should get a safe learning enrironment as well as the teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another teacher here. I can tell you when parents start calling meeting with admin and making it clear a kid in class is having huge impact, that’s when they address it. Make clear the teacher is doing what they can but your son is still impacted negatively. I have seen this myself; we as teachers can’t do anything about their placement even if we say it’s impacting the other kids but when you get 3-4 parents getting loud about it, it moves the needle.

OP here. This is possibly what got this child moved into a new classroom—parents in his original classroom going to admin. Did not consider that before. So what do they do: just move kids with extreme behavior disruptions from classroom to classroom as infinitum? Why doesn’t a child who needs this much help regulating impulses and emotions have an aide? This must be such drain on teachers and also no real help to the child.

I'm the PP from a different school, but parents complaining actually did get the child an aide, which I'm told has made things much better.

Do you realize how hard it is to get a good IEP and special classrooms/help for kids?