Harvard under Investigation

[Anonymous]

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-research-universities-2016/

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-liberal-arts-colleges-2016/

Overall vs. Black Acceptance Rate:

Emory- 25.2% vs 25.9%
Cornell- 14.1% vs 17.6%
UChicago- 7.9% vs 8.3%
Johns Hopkins- 11.9% vs 15.6%
USC- 16.6% vs 14.9%
Rice- 15.3% vs 16.7%
Pomona- 9.4% vs 16%
Wesleyan- 17% vs 12.9%
Davidson- 20.1% vs 13%
Colgate- 28.5% vs 16%
Vassar- 26.9% vs 26.8%
Barnard- 16.7% vs 14.1%

The gaps are not huge and often even lower (especially at LACs)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People need to stop getting so worked up about affirmative action. It seriously doesn't have as big of an impact as one might think it does.

And you know this how? Do you work in admissions at Harvard?

There are 2037 admission seats. If all 2037 were given to Asian students, I wonder how many lawsuits would there be to force Harvard to create a few thousand more seats? Bottom line is there will never be enough seats to admit all qualified students regardless of ethicists

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-research-universities-2016/

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-liberal-arts-colleges-2016/

Overall vs. Black Acceptance Rate:

Emory- 25.2% vs 25.9%
Cornell- 14.1% vs 17.6%
UChicago- 7.9% vs 8.3%
Johns Hopkins- 11.9% vs 15.6%
USC- 16.6% vs 14.9%
Rice- 15.3% vs 16.7%
Pomona- 9.4% vs 16%
Wesleyan- 17% vs 12.9%
Davidson- 20.1% vs 13%
Colgate- 28.5% vs 16%
Vassar- 26.9% vs 26.8%
Barnard- 16.7% vs 14.1%

The gaps are not huge and often even lower (especially at LACs)

You can’t be this dumb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People need to stop getting so worked up about affirmative action. It seriously doesn't have as big of an impact as one might think it does.

And you know this how? Do you work in admissions at Harvard?

There are 2037 admission seats. If all 2037 were given to Asian students, I wonder how many lawsuits would there be to force Harvard to create a few thousand more seats? Bottom line is there will never be enough seats to admit all qualified students regardless of ethicists

*ethnicity*

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-research-universities-2016/

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-liberal-arts-colleges-2016/

Overall vs. Black Acceptance Rate:

Emory- 25.2% vs 25.9%
Cornell- 14.1% vs 17.6%
UChicago- 7.9% vs 8.3%
Johns Hopkins- 11.9% vs 15.6%
USC- 16.6% vs 14.9%
Rice- 15.3% vs 16.7%
Pomona- 9.4% vs 16%
Wesleyan- 17% vs 12.9%
Davidson- 20.1% vs 13%
Colgate- 28.5% vs 16%
Vassar- 26.9% vs 26.8%
Barnard- 16.7% vs 14.1%

The gaps are not huge and often even lower (especially at LACs)

You can’t be this dumb.

And you can't be this obtuse.

[Anonymous]

How is it dumb?

So many people think that URMs have a MUCH higher acceptance rate at the expense of non URMs. At some schools, I won't deny it, yes- that is the case (the links make them clear)- but it's not many schools. Most of the Ivies and Stanford don't report their data, but I would guess their acceptance rates are similar as well akin to Cornell due to their status. They get enough qualified black applicants such that the vast majority are denied.

Yes, there's no context here. We don't know what the black students are like in terms of GPA and whatnot. I get that. But is it not superlative in context to rank in the 99% of the 150,000 black test takers? (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LLj12GK-70EJ:www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/highered/ra/sat/CR_M_%2520W_PercentileRanksGenderEthnicGroups.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us) A score of a 700 may be the bottom 25% at several elite schools, but it is a distinguished score for Mexican and American students.

[Anonymous]

*Mexican and African-American students

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How is it dumb?

So many people think that URMs have a MUCH higher acceptance rate at the expense of non URMs. At some schools, I won't deny it, yes- that is the case (the links make them clear)- but it's not many schools. Most of the Ivies and Stanford don't report their data, but I would guess their acceptance rates are similar as well akin to Cornell due to their status. They get enough qualified black applicants such that the vast majority are denied.

Yes, there's no context here. We don't know what the black students are like in terms of GPA and whatnot. I get that. But is it not superlative in context to rank in the 99% of the 150,000 black test takers? (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LLj12GK-70EJ:www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/highered/ra/sat/CR_M_%2520W_PercentileRanksGenderEthnicGroups.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us) A score of a 700 may be the bottom 25% at several elite schools, but it is a distinguished score for Mexican and American students.

Here are some facts on discrimination against Asian students.

http://myemail.constantcontact.com/UGLY-facts-on-discrimination-against-Asian-Am--youth-.html?soid=1118092496488&aid=x-th2T546TE

[Anonymous]

I have a mother of Hispanic descent. I never wrote Hispanic on any applications. I identify as white. But our college counselor said it would be to our advantage to have DS identify as Hispanic (even though we don't speak Spanish in the household) because he is 25% Hispanic. So there's that. We are a white family living in an affluent part of metro DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the Justice Department threatening a lawsuit constitutes escalating.

Anyone can threaten a lawsuit, that doesn't mean the suit is meritorious.

Escalating and meritorious are two different things.

That is true. You are correct that the Justice Department is escalating its threats. Nothing else has changed about whether their case has any merit, so really this isn't news beyond showing how the Justice Department is flailing.

I think it shows how Harvard is stonewalling. If they have nothing to hide then why not produce the requested documents.

If you read the whole thing, it's clear that part of their refusal is because the requested disclosures might be personally identifying for certain students and thus may be a FERPA violation. Further, if the division isn't properly authorized to conduct the investigation, Harvard ought to be challenging that kind of government overreach.

If their grounds for refusal are not legitimate, the DOJ can file suit and let the court determine that and order compliance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How is it dumb?

So many people think that URMs have a MUCH higher acceptance rate at the expense of non URMs. At some schools, I won't deny it, yes- that is the case (the links make them clear)- but it's not many schools. Most of the Ivies and Stanford don't report their data, but I would guess their acceptance rates are similar as well akin to Cornell due to their status. They get enough qualified black applicants such that the vast majority are denied.

Yes, there's no context here. We don't know what the black students are like in terms of GPA and whatnot. I get that. But is it not superlative in context to rank in the 99% of the 150,000 black test takers? (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:LLj12GK-70EJ:www.collegeboard.com/prod_downloads/highered/ra/sat/CR_M_%2520W_PercentileRanksGenderEthnicGroups.pdf+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us) A score of a 700 may be the bottom 25% at several elite schools, but it is a distinguished score for Mexican and American students.

Comparing acceptance rate of two different groups (one URM and one not URM) without keeping the GPA and SAT/ACT constant is meaningless in determining the size of the boost provided by URM status.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-research-universities-2016/

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-liberal-arts-colleges-2016/

Overall vs. Black Acceptance Rate:

Emory- 25.2% vs 25.9%
Cornell- 14.1% vs 17.6%
UChicago- 7.9% vs 8.3%
Johns Hopkins- 11.9% vs 15.6%
USC- 16.6% vs 14.9%
Rice- 15.3% vs 16.7%
Pomona- 9.4% vs 16%
Wesleyan- 17% vs 12.9%
Davidson- 20.1% vs 13%
Colgate- 28.5% vs 16%
Vassar- 26.9% vs 26.8%
Barnard- 16.7% vs 14.1%

The gaps are not huge and often even lower (especially at LACs)

How is admit rat relevant to anything? Show me the stats of the admitted students.....that would be very revealing.

[Anonymous]

All of the elite American colleges WE built and our tax breaks and tax grants support should be taken over by international and first generation Asian swots! Yes!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All of the elite American colleges WE built and our tax breaks and tax grants support should be taken over by international and first generation Asian swots! Yes!

Racist much?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-research-universities-2016/

https://www.jbhe.com/2017/01/black-first-year-students-at-the-nations-leading-liberal-arts-colleges-2016/

Overall vs. Black Acceptance Rate:

Emory- 25.2% vs 25.9%
Cornell- 14.1% vs 17.6%
UChicago- 7.9% vs 8.3%
Johns Hopkins- 11.9% vs 15.6%
USC- 16.6% vs 14.9%
Rice- 15.3% vs 16.7%
Pomona- 9.4% vs 16%
Wesleyan- 17% vs 12.9%
Davidson- 20.1% vs 13%
Colgate- 28.5% vs 16%
Vassar- 26.9% vs 26.8%
Barnard- 16.7% vs 14.1%

The gaps are not huge and often even lower (especially at LACs)

Why are we rolling out the scores of black students? The real competition is between Asian and white students. There are not enough Black students at Harvard to make a difference in this argument. The Ivy league has decided that 7-8% of African Americans is all that they will let in. - I bet you'd see roughly the same percentages for Asians across the Ivy League, as well. I think there is a type of collusion going on.

I'm black and I think what is being done to Asians is wrong - but to say that is because they are letting in black students with lower credentials is a foolish game designed to pit minorities against each other. It's the legacy and athletic hooks that hurt Asians the most. My DC will be applying to two Ivies DCs credentials are in the middle 50% for those schools. I don't consider it to be a slam dunk at all.