Vent - I hate talking to my dad

[Anonymous]

OP,

You have my sympathies. I know how you feel. It seems like your father is very set in his ways and views a lot of things through the lens of his Hungarian background. While my dad doesn't have political conspiracy theories, my parents also came to the States from another country. Ever since my mom passed away some 14 years ago, I've dreaded talking to my dad as well. He also is a pessimist, and every conversation generally revolves around how much pity we should have for him because of all the things he must endure. Ironically, he's in the top income bracket for his country and has really good health, so I'm not sure how much more he is looking to get from life. It's really exhausting, particularly because it feels so one-sided to have to show interest in his life when he doesn't show much in his grandkids, etc.

I know there is no solution for this. Just know that I understand what you mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's not made up. Hungarian and Mongolian are linguistically somilar languages because Genghis came through there and raped and pillaged.

The Mongols did come through in the 13th century and basically burned everything to the ground. One of the many tragedies to befall the great Hungarian nation, as my dad would say. Along with the Turkish occupation, the 1848 revolution (which they lost), two world wars (on the losing side for both), Communism, and the 1956 revolution (also lost). I swear, the Hungarian national anthem is like a funeral dirge. Most countries have uplifting national anthems - Hungary's anthem tells of the suffering of the nation. Hence the melancholy and pessimism!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP,

You have my sympathies. I know how you feel. It seems like your father is very set in his ways and views a lot of things through the lens of his Hungarian background. While my dad doesn't have political conspiracy theories, my parents also came to the States from another country. Ever since my mom passed away some 14 years ago, I've dreaded talking to my dad as well. He also is a pessimist, and every conversation generally revolves around how much pity we should have for him because of all the things he must endure. Ironically, he's in the top income bracket for his country and has really good health, so I'm not sure how much more he is looking to get from life. It's really exhausting, particularly because it feels so one-sided to have to show interest in his life when he doesn't show much in his grandkids, etc.

I know there is no solution for this. Just know that I understand what you mean.

Thank you - I figured there would be some children of immigrants out there who can relate!

[Anonymous]

This is a terrible thing to have to experience. I do think a lot of this is a product of age and lack of back and forth interaction (that one may get from a spouse). MIL isn't beligerent, but has almost no interest in your opinions or positions. Asks questions, but never bothers to listen to an answer and CONSTANTLY repeats the same information. Oh, and she talks to us like we don't know anyone else in the family, 'Well you know Bob and (BIL) his wife, Dottie (SIL), they just moved. Yes, we were just at their house two weeks ago... Why wouldn't we know their names????

And she's been tested for dementia and Alzheimer's.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a terrible thing to have to experience. I do think a lot of this is a product of age and lack of back and forth interaction (that one may get from a spouse). MIL isn't beligerent, but has almost no interest in your opinions or positions. Asks questions, but never bothers to listen to an answer and CONSTANTLY repeats the same information. Oh, and she talks to us like we don't know anyone else in the family, 'Well you know Bob and (BIL) his wife, Dottie (SIL), they just moved. Yes, we were just at their house two weeks ago... Why wouldn't we know their names????

And she's been tested for dementia and Alzheimer's.

My dad's got plenty of interaction with his girlfriend. He and my mom divorced after 26 years of marriage and he's been with his girlfriend for over 17 years now. They recently moved in together. She's probably 10 years younger than he is but they have the exact same political views. They feed off each other!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not made up. Hungarian and Mongolian are linguistically somilar languages because Genghis came through there and raped and pillaged.

The Mongols did come through in the 13th century and basically burned everything to the ground. One of the many tragedies to befall the great Hungarian nation, as my dad would say. Along with the Turkish occupation, the 1848 revolution (which they lost), two world wars (on the losing side for both), Communism, and the 1956 revolution (also lost). I swear, the Hungarian national anthem is like a funeral dirge. Most countries have uplifting national anthems - Hungary's anthem tells of the suffering of the nation. Hence the melancholy and pessimism!

So this sums it up. Interesting reading this because growing up we had an elderly Hungarian neighbor who was a negative nelly. As a high schooler, walking my dog we'd stop and chat and walk together for a while and the whole convo was complaints and 'I noticed this bad thing...' kind of stream of conscious... he was just so sullen and miserable and he seemed to hate and be offended by everything. He'd even turn the conversation to my dog to find problems but my dog ignored him... He liked my old English sheepdog because he reminded him of a Komondor (Hungarian sheepdog)...then I'd go home and feel 70 years older than I did when I started the walk. Anyway, my parents told me that the older generation who knew him, my grandfather who had worked with him said that his mantra about everything was "ISSS NOOO F*CKING GOOOOOD!!" Ever after I was told this I noticed that he would say "Isss nooo ff ff ff...... GOOD!!" to me, and it became a catchphrase in my house whenever something was broken/needing to be fixed/done.

Anyway, the world takes all types, even the cranksters and I just wanted to say that it's refreshing to even be that cranky and to not be a boastful person. Of all the neighbours I'd run into, he was one of the few who talk to me like an adult and didn't shine up his philosophy for me. He never bragged. Something about certain cultures will complain rather than boast, and it's almost a protection against bad things happening if you don't talk about the good, if you understand. Like if you keep complaining the sky will fall, the most important things will be kept safe. I just nodded my head and listened along and found him interesting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not made up. Hungarian and Mongolian are linguistically somilar languages because Genghis came through there and raped and pillaged.

The Mongols did come through in the 13th century and basically burned everything to the ground. One of the many tragedies to befall the great Hungarian nation, as my dad would say. Along with the Turkish occupation, the 1848 revolution (which they lost), two world wars (on the losing side for both), Communism, and the 1956 revolution (also lost). I swear, the Hungarian national anthem is like a funeral dirge. Most countries have uplifting national anthems - Hungary's anthem tells of the suffering of the nation. Hence the melancholy and pessimism!

So this sums it up. Interesting reading this because growing up we had an elderly Hungarian neighbor who was a negative nelly. As a high schooler, walking my dog we'd stop and chat and walk together for a while and the whole convo was complaints and 'I noticed this bad thing...' kind of stream of conscious... he was just so sullen and miserable and he seemed to hate and be offended by everything. He'd even turn the conversation to my dog to find problems but my dog ignored him... He liked my old English sheepdog because he reminded him of a Komondor (Hungarian sheepdog)...then I'd go home and feel 70 years older than I did when I started the walk. Anyway, my parents told me that the older generation who knew him, my grandfather who had worked with him said that his mantra about everything was "ISSS NOOO F*CKING GOOOOOD!!" Ever after I was told this I noticed that he would say "Isss nooo ff ff ff...... GOOD!!" to me, and it became a catchphrase in my house whenever something was broken/needing to be fixed/done.

Anyway, the world takes all types, even the cranksters and I just wanted to say that it's refreshing to even be that cranky and to not be a boastful person. Of all the neighbours I'd run into, he was one of the few who talk to me like an adult and didn't shine up his philosophy for me. He never bragged. Something about certain cultures will complain rather than boast, and it's almost a protection against bad things happening if you don't talk about the good, if you understand. Like if you keep complaining the sky will fall, the most important things will be kept safe. I just nodded my head and listened along and found him interesting.

Love this....thank you! I do a lot of nodding and mm-hmming when he's on one of his tangents. The "isss nooo f***ing goooood" mantra is perfect. That's my dad to a T! He and his girlfriend are both major complainers - they can always find something to grouse about. Definitely glass half empty types. My brother and I were both born in the U.S. and while we speak fluent Hungarian and were raised in the Hungarian community, we are fully Americanized and we both have non-Hungarian spouses. We are definitely glass half full people who believe that if you only look for the negative, that's all you'll find!

[Anonymous]

Men get crotchety when they get old.

[Anonymous]

Hi OP. I have a different perspective for you- not better, just different. My father was also from Hungary. He came to the US as a political refugee after escaping through Austria (he was a scholar, and the government made it clear that he would not be permitted to leave freely). His experiences were so traumatic that he never discussed them with me- ever. He never taught me Hungarian because he wanted no reminders of what he had been through. The only Hungarian history I learned was on visits there with family who took me to monuments, etc and explained what they meant.

My dad was a complex, isolated, paranoid person until he died. I was his best friend. When I did learn some of the things he had been through (on his deathbed, from his sister as she spoke with him) I understood him more fully and wished I had known those things about him before, and what he had gone through.

I guess what I'm saying is: try very hard to appreciate your dad and what he's come through, while ignoring the noise. Try not to let the extra stuff impact your relationship. It's a rough history- Budapest was destroyed and rebuilt 11 times, and so were other areas. I have family who also feel like Hungarian history is ignored/ not discussed because it's such a small country. Maybe you can reach a peace accord- we discuss _____ when only family is around, or ___ members of family who are good at diverting him, or something?

Thanks for reading, anyone who read- it just felt good to type all that out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:He's always been very passionate and nationalistic, and the Hungarian national character is known to be pretty pessimistic and melancholy (hence the rate of suicide and alcohol abuse in Hungary). But as he's gotten older, and more Internet-savvy, he's had more time to read his right-wing conspiracy theory websites and blogs.

That's a pretty common Eastern European thing--alcohol and suicide:
http://themoscownews.com/society/20111011/189114308.html

[Anonymous]

OP,

It's a common form of dementia.
(I know, I know, your father seems cognitively alert.)

Here's the biology behind it: the frontal lobe of the brain, responsible for critical thinking, judgement, and inhibition of deep-seated impulses, is the last to develop during adolescence and the first to give way in old age. Hence the general observation that old people "lose their filter". Quite literally so, in fact, because the prefrontal cortex IS the filter of the brain. Thus any politically incorrect, xenophobic, paranoid thought that would not have been formed earlier because the prefrontal cortex would have halted the process by using internal critical thinking and external awareness of societal pressure, can rise up unhindered in old people's brains.

A good question would be: does the prefrontal cortex merely lift inhibitions to reveal opinions that were always there (some adults would just be excellent hypocrites), or does the prefrontal cortex shape our very opinions, and without its action, our actual personality and self changes into something else?

The latter seems to be true, but more research is underway to tease things out. It's fascinating.

To get back to your problem, OP, you can say bluntly:
"Dad, every time you start on one of your rants, it will be the end of the conversation."
Being direct is crucial to brains like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. I have a different perspective for you- not better, just different. My father was also from Hungary. He came to the US as a political refugee after escaping through Austria (he was a scholar, and the government made it clear that he would not be permitted to leave freely). His experiences were so traumatic that he never discussed them with me- ever. He never taught me Hungarian because he wanted no reminders of what he had been through. The only Hungarian history I learned was on visits there with family who took me to monuments, etc and explained what they meant.

My dad was a complex, isolated, paranoid person until he died. I was his best friend. When I did learn some of the things he had been through (on his deathbed, from his sister as she spoke with him) I understood him more fully and wished I had known those things about him before, and what he had gone through.

I guess what I'm saying is: try very hard to appreciate your dad and what he's come through, while ignoring the noise. Try not to let the extra stuff impact your relationship. It's a rough history- Budapest was destroyed and rebuilt 11 times, and so were other areas. I have family who also feel like Hungarian history is ignored/ not discussed because it's such a small country. Maybe you can reach a peace accord- we discuss _____ when only family is around, or ___ members of family who are good at diverting him, or something?

Thanks for reading, anyone who read- it just felt good to type all that out.

Thank you, PP, for that excellent perspective. My dad is a good man. He wasn't the best husband to my mom (largely because of his extremism) but he was a good father, and now I think he's found his true calling as a grandpa. There's an old saying that true love doesn't come until the first grandchild is born, and I think that applies to him. I will do my best to focus on his good qualities and ignore the noise.

Such an interesting and sad story about your dad. Did he leave Hungary during the 1956 revolution, or before? My dad was only 17 years old and a student during the revolution. He escaped into Yugoslavia in the late 1960s but was caught, so later on he tried again and made it to Italy, and from there he came to the U.S. and made arrangements for my mom to follow him. They pretty much isolated themselves in the Hungarian community and never really assimilated. My mom's boyfriend was in his mid 20s and he was directly involved in the revolution, and he had to escape Hungary after the revolution ended because they were looking for him. He would have been executed if he stayed. So he came to the U.S., was married to a Polish woman for over 40 years, had two children (who don't speak Hungarian) and ran a successful business. He doesn't talk much about his experiences either. In contrast to my dad, he is completely assimilated, never really associated with any Hungarians here until recently, and doesn't hold the extreme views that my dad holds. When his wife passed away from cancer, he mourned her for several years and then ventured out to the Hungarian social club where he met my mom. He is the polar opposite of my dad and my mom has finally found happiness!

[Anonymous]

That is a nice story, OP.

[Anonymous]

PARAGRAPH. Look up definition and use as appropriate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Hi OP. I have a different perspective for you- not better, just different. My father was also from Hungary. He came to the US as a political refugee after escaping through Austria (he was a scholar, and the government made it clear that he would not be permitted to leave freely). His experiences were so traumatic that he never discussed them with me- ever. He never taught me Hungarian because he wanted no reminders of what he had been through. The only Hungarian history I learned was on visits there with family who took me to monuments, etc and explained what they meant.

My dad was a complex, isolated, paranoid person until he died. I was his best friend. When I did learn some of the things he had been through (on his deathbed, from his sister as she spoke with him) I understood him more fully and wished I had known those things about him before, and what he had gone through.

I guess what I'm saying is: try very hard to appreciate your dad and what he's come through, while ignoring the noise. Try not to let the extra stuff impact your relationship. It's a rough history- Budapest was destroyed and rebuilt 11 times, and so were other areas. I have family who also feel like Hungarian history is ignored/ not discussed because it's such a small country. Maybe you can reach a peace accord- we discuss _____ when only family is around, or ___ members of family who are good at diverting him, or something?

Thanks for reading, anyone who read- it just felt good to type all that out.

Thank you, PP, for that excellent perspective. My dad is a good man. He wasn't the best husband to my mom (largely because of his extremism) but he was a good father, and now I think he's found his true calling as a grandpa. There's an old saying that true love doesn't come until the first grandchild is born, and I think that applies to him. I will do my best to focus on his good qualities and ignore the noise.

Such an interesting and sad story about your dad. Did he leave Hungary during the 1956 revolution, or before? My dad was only 17 years old and a student during the revolution. He escaped into Yugoslavia in the late 1960s but was caught, so later on he tried again and made it to Italy, and from there he came to the U.S. and made arrangements for my mom to follow him. They pretty much isolated themselves in the Hungarian community and never really assimilated. My mom's boyfriend was in his mid 20s and he was directly involved in the revolution, and he had to escape Hungary after the revolution ended because they were looking for him. He would have been executed if he stayed. So he came to the U.S., was married to a Polish woman for over 40 years, had two children (who don't speak Hungarian) and ran a successful business. He doesn't talk much about his experiences either. In contrast to my dad, he is completely assimilated, never really associated with any Hungarians here until recently, and doesn't hold the extreme views that my dad holds. When his wife passed away from cancer, he mourned her for several years and then ventured out to the Hungarian social club where he met my mom. He is the polar opposite of my dad and my mom has finally found happiness!

Hi OP,

My father left in 1963. He graduated college in Budapest, worked a bit, then went to Austria for 2 years or so before he came here (that was the plan all along). He was sponsored by distant family friends in the US and then when he got here, applied for refugee status/ citizenship and changed his name immediately in case the government came after him. (My mother and I have always had his assumed last name.) His sense of paranoia never left- our curtains were drawn all the time. We didn't open the door unless we knew someone was coming over. He never met any of my friends' parents or came to school stuff- my mom dealt with all that.

My parents divorced, and in his last 15 or so years, my dad had a very nice ladyfriend. His boundaries never failed though- he never let her get too close.

I am sorry to interrupt your thread with my own story. I'm glad your family seems to have found their own comfort zones, even though your dad's does sound like it imposes on others. I just feel like his history/ experience must play a huge part in his extremism now, and maybe I'm missing my dad when I say this (he died in 2004) but I would try very hard to work it out with your dad. Just my $.02, from one Hungarian-American to another.