ACPS and TJ

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not all of us in Arlington understand why we participate, either.

Sending a kid to TJ on the public dime is more expensive than keeping the kid in town.

I would rather see that money go to funding science resources for a slightly larger swath of Arlington's students - those engaged and enthralled by science but for whom TJ wasn't the right choice.

They're starting some STEM program at Yorktown, I saw recently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What ancillaries? And why don't they offer the option without transportation -- make the families figure that out, as they do for private schools? There are plenty of carpools to and from TJ and all of its activities. The cost is not that crazy - like $14k per student I have heard? Far less than strong academic private school. Why not let families apply and pay for it themselves? An argument may be that only the more wealthy can afford these things but the same really is true for private school too. Or make the decision to fund the tuition on the basis of need. If an economically disadvantaged kid from Alexandria can pass the tests I am confident TJ would be happy to have him/her. I say that from the vantage point of a TJ parent. It's a great school. Very hard academically but engaging in both academics and ECs. And not THAT hard to get in if you have the proper base of education from grade school. That may also not be Alexandria's schools forte.

I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone is preventing someone from outside Fairfax County from applying and paying their own tuition.

But ACPS will never agree to pay $14,000 a year to send a handful of kids and have its own marginal test scores fall further as part of the bargain. Are you kidding me?

I think it's a fallacy to think allowing a handful of students attend TJ would hurt test scores in ACPS. Right now no one in ACPS is aspiring to attend TJ because it's not an option. So ACPS loses many families with high-achieving kids to Arlington and Fairfax, and achievement in ACPS ends up depressed.

Allow those kids to attend to TJ and you start getting more kids working harder in elementary and middle school. Even if they don't get into TJ, those kids don't stop working hard and taking advantage of the available opportunities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What ancillaries? And why don't they offer the option without transportation -- make the families figure that out, as they do for private schools? There are plenty of carpools to and from TJ and all of its activities. The cost is not that crazy - like $14k per student I have heard? Far less than strong academic private school. Why not let families apply and pay for it themselves? An argument may be that only the more wealthy can afford these things but the same really is true for private school too. Or make the decision to fund the tuition on the basis of need. If an economically disadvantaged kid from Alexandria can pass the tests I am confident TJ would be happy to have him/her. I say that from the vantage point of a TJ parent. It's a great school. Very hard academically but engaging in both academics and ECs. And not THAT hard to get in if you have the proper base of education from grade school. That may also not be Alexandria's schools forte.

I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone is preventing someone from outside Fairfax County from applying and paying their own tuition.

But ACPS will never agree to pay $14,000 a year to send a handful of kids and have its own marginal test scores fall further as part of the bargain. Are you kidding me?

I think it's a fallacy to think allowing a handful of students attend TJ would hurt test scores in ACPS. Right now no one in ACPS is aspiring to attend TJ because it's not an option. So ACPS loses many families with high-achieving kids to Arlington and Fairfax, and achievement in ACPS ends up depressed.

Allow those kids to attend to TJ and you start getting more kids working harder in elementary and middle school. Even if they don't get into TJ, those kids don't stop working hard and taking advantage of the available opportunities.

Be that as it may, it's still not going to happen. You're wasting your breath. ACPS isn't oriented to serve high achievers. Period.

[Anonymous]

Why should county's and cities participate in allowing a few to attend Thomas Jefferson?

Simply because it's THE STEM gem in our region, that's why. A future Noble Prize winner in Medicine or Physics or Engineering might be their product, that's why. Or one of many other global awards given in recognition of an individual who makes a huge contribution to humanity.

Why, because no local jurisdiction itself can top what TJ has too offer, which includes the very needed environment of STEM collaboration with incredible teachers and if not more importantly, collaboration in volume with fellow gifted STEM students.

At a time when the United States is crying out for STEM inventions and employers are begging, to the point where US legislation seeks global STEM students to come to America (Senators Warner and Kaine), why should OUR STUDENTS, right here in VA, not benefit from the TJ experience, except for collective arrogance of small minded school boards? ACPS has a responsibility to ALL students, which includes these gifted few.

No amount of STEM classes in ACPS equates to a school like TJ.

Wake up people! Please, for the sake of Virginia's future and beyond, wise and rise up to allow TJ in Alexandria City.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why should county's and cities participate in allowing a few to attend Thomas Jefferson?

Simply because it's THE STEM gem in our region, that's why. A future Noble Prize winner in Medicine or Physics or Engineering might be their product, that's why. Or one of many other global awards given in recognition of an individual who makes a huge contribution to humanity.

Why, because no local jurisdiction itself can top what TJ has too offer, which includes the very needed environment of STEM collaboration with incredible teachers and if not more importantly, collaboration in volume with fellow gifted STEM students.

At a time when the United States is crying out for STEM inventions and employers are begging, to the point where US legislation seeks global STEM students to come to America (Senators Warner and Kaine), why should OUR STUDENTS, right here in VA, not benefit from the TJ experience, except for collective arrogance of small minded school boards? ACPS has a responsibility to ALL students, which includes these gifted few.

No amount of STEM classes in ACPS equates to a school like TJ.

Wake up people! Please, for the sake of Virginia's future and beyond, wise and rise up to allow TJ in Alexandria City.

It's still not going to happen. There's too much cultural resistance built into the ACPS system. You need to move into the next stage and starting planning your departure or choosing your private school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not all of us in Arlington understand why we participate, either.

Sending a kid to TJ on the public dime is more expensive than keeping the kid in town.

I would rather see that money go to funding science resources for a slightly larger swath of Arlington's students - those engaged and enthralled by science but for whom TJ wasn't the right choice.

So what do we do with the kids capable of taking classes only offered at TJ now? There aren't enough of them in Arlington to justify offering all those classes, only with the regional school do you get the critical mass to make the investments in teachers and equipment.

[Anonymous]

"Under the proposal, ACPS would pay the Fairfax County district about $213,000 for the initial 14-student enrollment, a portion of which would go toward school renovation costs. By 2018, ACPS would pay upward of $943,000 for 53 students. School officials say transportation of students — an expense not included in the payment estimates — may add $22,000 to $46,000 a year to the final cost."

[Anonymous]

We have a gorgeous home we are renting and considering buying from our landlord. But every time I get close to pushing it, I realize that the schools are such an issue here. I even like our zoned elementary (Barret) but still worry about middle school. It seems like such a mess.

[Anonymous]

One of the ACPS school board members actually graduated from TJ. I doubt he is ideologically opposed to sending ACPS students to TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Under the proposal, ACPS would pay the Fairfax County district about $213,000 for the initial 14-student enrollment, a portion of which would go toward school renovation costs. By 2018, ACPS would pay upward of $943,000 for 53 students. School officials say transportation of students — an expense not included in the payment estimates — may add $22,000 to $46,000 a year to the final cost."

That is a totally reasonable amount to invest in the best and brightest. ACPS is spending multiples of that per student for lots of kids who will not go on to college, high school aged students who are not proficient in English, and kids at the satellite campus.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What ancillaries? And why don't they offer the option without transportation -- make the families figure that out, as they do for private schools? There are plenty of carpools to and from TJ and all of its activities. The cost is not that crazy - like $14k per student I have heard? Far less than strong academic private school. Why not let families apply and pay for it themselves? An argument may be that only the more wealthy can afford these things but the same really is true for private school too. Or make the decision to fund the tuition on the basis of need. If an economically disadvantaged kid from Alexandria can pass the tests I am confident TJ would be happy to have him/her. I say that from the vantage point of a TJ parent. It's a great school. Very hard academically but engaging in both academics and ECs. And not THAT hard to get in if you have the proper base of education from grade school. That may also not be Alexandria's schools forte.

I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone is preventing someone from outside Fairfax County from applying and paying their own tuition.

But ACPS will never agree to pay $14,000 a year to send a handful of kids and have its own marginal test scores fall further as part of the bargain. Are you kidding me?

I think it's a fallacy to think allowing a handful of students attend TJ would hurt test scores in ACPS. Right now no one in ACPS is aspiring to attend TJ because it's not an option. So ACPS loses many families with high-achieving kids to Arlington and Fairfax, and achievement in ACPS ends up depressed.

Allow those kids to attend to TJ and you start getting more kids working harder in elementary and middle school. Even if they don't get into TJ, those kids don't stop working hard and taking advantage of the available opportunities.

Be that as it may, it's still not going to happen. You're wasting your breath. ACPS isn't oriented to serve high achievers. Period.

Every year TC Williams graduates kids who have taken multiple APs and been admitted to top schools. So I don't think this it's accurate to say that ACPS doesn't serve high achievers. It just doesn't graduate as many of those kids as it could.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:"Under the proposal, ACPS would pay the Fairfax County district about $213,000 for the initial 14-student enrollment, a portion of which would go toward school renovation costs. By 2018, ACPS would pay upward of $943,000 for 53 students. School officials say transportation of students — an expense not included in the payment estimates — may add $22,000 to $46,000 a year to the final cost."

First, what is the source? Second, know that ACPS will highball the TJ numbers surely as they low ball other numbers as suits them.

The Alexandria City School Board recently (November 2014) voted to transfer over half a million dollars from newly found unused or finished facility budget to CIP dedicated for the installation of TCW HS foot ball field lights: "Installing lights alone at the football stadium would cost between $700,000 and $800,000, but in conjunction with other upgrades to the facility, the total price tag could reach $3.5 million, officials have said (total cost estimated 2.43 million with field upgrade)." http://alextimes.com/2014/10/school-board-moves-forward-on-t-c-lights/

Struggle, struggle, boil and trouble. Serve the mass, ignore select students at your own peril, ACPS. The backlash momentum is building as City residents see their tax dollars misspent not on academic focus. City revenue is tight, incomes are flat and year to date prices of residential real estate is down from last year. Bad time to not be focusing on basic necessities: improving ACPS rigor, accreditation and reputation will go a long way to bringing in new families and urban employers (whose employees demand an excellent academic public school system).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Under the proposal, ACPS would pay the Fairfax County district about $213,000 for the initial 14-student enrollment, a portion of which would go toward school renovation costs. By 2018, ACPS would pay upward of $943,000 for 53 students. School officials say transportation of students — an expense not included in the payment estimates — may add $22,000 to $46,000 a year to the final cost."

First, what is the source? Second, know that ACPS will highball the TJ numbers surely as they low ball other numbers as suits them.

The Alexandria City School Board recently (November 2014) voted to transfer over half a million dollars from newly found unused or finished facility budget to CIP dedicated for the installation of TCW HS foot ball field lights: "Installing lights alone at the football stadium would cost between $700,000 and $800,000, but in conjunction with other upgrades to the facility, the total price tag could reach $3.5 million, officials have said (total cost estimated 2.43 million with field upgrade)." http://alextimes.com/2014/10/school-board-moves-forward-on-t-c-lights/

Struggle, struggle, boil and trouble. Serve the mass, ignore select students at your own peril, ACPS. The backlash momentum is building as City residents see their tax dollars misspent not on academic focus. City revenue is tight, incomes are flat and year to date prices of residential real estate is down from last year. Bad time to not be focusing on basic necessities: improving ACPS rigor, accreditation and reputation will go a long way to bringing in new families and urban employers (whose employees demand an excellent academic public school system).

No, it's not. There's no backlash because what happens is families just throw up their hands and leave. You have to understand that the demographics you want to see come in is not the same one that the government there wants to serve. Ask anyone involved in ACPS and government about the schools and the first thing you hear is the high relative level of poverty. They really are committed to teaching to the masses there -- drop-out rate is a huge problem at TC. So is teenage pregnancy, drugs, and gangs. THIS is where their priorities are. They're not at all interest in spending a million bucks to send a few high-achievers to a neighboring school system.

What you have here, is a misalignment of your interest with the majority interest of the city. This is not a new phenomenon -- it's been this way for about 20 years. And, your vision doesn't align with their vision, either.

So, no, there's no backlash, except in small circles of frustrated parents who want more for their kids. And most of them just end up leaving. A few rationalize staying by believing surviving TC will somehow boost college applications (being the best in a disadvantaged school, etc). But in general, folks just leave. Spend some time in Arlington or Falls Church schools, e.g. and you will be stunned at the number of people you encounter who left Alexandria because of the schools. I'm sure it's similar in Fairfax, but that school system is so much bigger that it's not quite as noticeable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What ancillaries? And why don't they offer the option without transportation -- make the families figure that out, as they do for private schools? There are plenty of carpools to and from TJ and all of its activities. The cost is not that crazy - like $14k per student I have heard? Far less than strong academic private school. Why not let families apply and pay for it themselves? An argument may be that only the more wealthy can afford these things but the same really is true for private school too. Or make the decision to fund the tuition on the basis of need. If an economically disadvantaged kid from Alexandria can pass the tests I am confident TJ would be happy to have him/her. I say that from the vantage point of a TJ parent. It's a great school. Very hard academically but engaging in both academics and ECs. And not THAT hard to get in if you have the proper base of education from grade school. That may also not be Alexandria's schools forte.

I could be wrong, but I don't think anyone is preventing someone from outside Fairfax County from applying and paying their own tuition.

But ACPS will never agree to pay $14,000 a year to send a handful of kids and have its own marginal test scores fall further as part of the bargain. Are you kidding me?

I think it's a fallacy to think allowing a handful of students attend TJ would hurt test scores in ACPS. Right now no one in ACPS is aspiring to attend TJ because it's not an option. So ACPS loses many families with high-achieving kids to Arlington and Fairfax, and achievement in ACPS ends up depressed.

Allow those kids to attend to TJ and you start getting more kids working harder in elementary and middle school. Even if they don't get into TJ, those kids don't stop working hard and taking advantage of the available opportunities.

Be that as it may, it's still not going to happen. You're wasting your breath. ACPS isn't oriented to serve high achievers. Period.

Every year TC Williams graduates kids who have taken multiple APs and been admitted to top schools. So I don't think this it's accurate to say that ACPS doesn't serve high achievers. It just doesn't graduate as many of those kids as it could.

I didn't say TC doesn't serve high achievers. I said it's not oriented to serve them. They're not a priority.

Yes, there's always a handful of kids who graduate and go on to good colleges. But it's not really a high-achievement culture at TC. To get that experience, you sort of have to segregate from the masses, and the demographics of who is in that segregated group make claims of diversity look less virtuous.

[Anonymous]

If anyone would like to see the most recent, formal discussion regarding participation in TJ participation, you can view the relevant documents on the ACPS website.

Go to the "Electronic School Board"
http://esbpublic.acps.k12.va.us/

You will see a calendar in the upper right corner of your screen. Select May, 12 2014. You will be taken to a page with links that bring up documents that summarize the deliberations regarding this issue.