Diversity and "Equity" are each other's enemies... discuss

[Anonymous]

How many of the people talking "equity" would like their economic outcome to be EXACTLY AVERAGE?

hmmmmm

[Anonymous]

This would be a fascinating question with DCUM’s obsessing over HHI, “how much house can I afford,” Early Decision @ colleges, and travel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP doesn’t understand the definition. Equity doesn’t mean equality. Here is a graphic I use to explain this to 12 year olds. Hope it helps!

https://www.diffen.com/difference/Equality-vs-Equity

This graphic is a cancer

No, the people who find fault with it are the cancers on society. They’re fundamentally bad people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that if you actually care about diversity - diversity of cultures and beliefs - then you can't also take the idea of "equity" seriously.

Different cultures prioritize different things in life, and not all of those choices translate into money at the same rate when comparing (artificial) groups to each other.

In fact, some may translate into other things that are much more valuable than money, but impossible to measure - like close families, robust friend networks, belief in an afterlife, etc.

This seems trivially simple & true, but you don't hear it much.

Am I missing something? It it wrong to apply logic to these ideas?

Diversity does, in fact, celebrate differences. This is why the “I don’t see color” retort is so misguided— it’s disingenuous and suggests people don’t want to be seen and appreciated for who the are.

But we all have the same basic needs, I.e. housing, food security, safety, education, etc. Equity is the pursuit of more equal outcomes (in the aggregate) inthe distribution of those things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that if you actually care about diversity - diversity of cultures and beliefs - then you can't also take the idea of "equity" seriously.

Different cultures prioritize different things in life, and not all of those choices translate into money at the same rate when comparing (artificial) groups to each other.

In fact, some may translate into other things that are much more valuable than money, but impossible to measure - like close families, robust friend networks, belief in an afterlife, etc.

This seems trivially simple & true, but you don't hear it much.

Am I missing something? It it wrong to apply logic to these ideas?

Diversity does, in fact, celebrate differences. This is why the “I don’t see color” retort is so misguided— it’s disingenuous and suggests people don’t want to be seen and appreciated for who the are.

But we all have the same basic needs, I.e. housing, food security, safety, education, etc. Equity is the pursuit of more equal outcomes (in the aggregate) inthe distribution of those things.

that sounds good at a very high level, but how much equality is the goal? and how can you measure equity? as I've seen it described it focuses very much on outcomes, not on equality of opportunity, and your description sounds like a bit of both

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that if you actually care about diversity - diversity of cultures and beliefs - then you can't also take the idea of "equity" seriously.

Different cultures prioritize different things in life, and not all of those choices translate into money at the same rate when comparing (artificial) groups to each other.

In fact, some may translate into other things that are much more valuable than money, but impossible to measure - like close families, robust friend networks, belief in an afterlife, etc.

This seems trivially simple & true, but you don't hear it much.

Am I missing something? It it wrong to apply logic to these ideas?

Diversity does, in fact, celebrate differences. This is why the “I don’t see color” retort is so misguided— it’s disingenuous and suggests people don’t want to be seen and appreciated for who the are.

But we all have the same basic needs, I.e. housing, food security, safety, education, etc. Equity is the pursuit of more equal outcomes (in the aggregate) inthe distribution of those things.

for example, why do employers have to talk about Equity when they're not involved in providing any of those things you listed?

and why do selective schools and colleges have to talk about Equity when their entire existence is geared towards providing services to some and not others?

[Anonymous]

The solution is all year schooling and longer days. Richer parents exploit gaps in the school schedule to accelerate their kids beyond others.

Why do schools close for the 2 weeks around Christmas and New Year? Both my parents work in the medical field and only got about 5 days vacation max in that time period so I wouldn’t have “ lost” family time by going to school on the days they worked. Schools should only be closed on the official federal holidays and stagger teachers shifts to provide full coverage.

[Anonymous]

Equity is about equal opportunity, but that doesn’t necessarily translate to equal outcomes. Not everyone is the same, and not everyone wants the same thing. That doesn’t mean people shouldn’t be afforded whatever necessary for them to have equal access and opportunity to attain those outcomes. In the U.S. specifically, race and ethnicity plays a large role in all facets of life due to systemic racism and implicit bias. Those factors need to be addressed and mitigated in order for there to be equity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Equity is about equal opportunity, but that doesn’t necessarily translate to equal outcomes. Not everyone is the same, and not everyone wants the same thing. That doesn’t mean people shouldn’t be afforded whatever necessary for them to have equal access and opportunity to attain those outcomes. In the U.S. specifically, race and ethnicity plays a large role in all facets of life due to systemic racism and implicit bias. Those factors need to be addressed and mitigated in order for there to be equity.

you need to take a closer look at that softball game graphic

everything I've read about "equity" as a social justice term seems to suggest that it is about allocating resources differently based on people's different needs & situations, so that everyone ENDS UP in the same (or similar) place

makes sense in the thought space of five-year-old playground fairness
but the devil's in the details
which is why it's fun to pick apart

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP doesn’t understand the definition. Equity doesn’t mean equality. Here is a graphic I use to explain this to 12 year olds. Hope it helps!

https://www.diffen.com/difference/Equality-vs-Equity

This graphic is a cancer

+1. Equity means every getting what they need. But current attempts at “equity” hold the advanced kids back to make the gap appear smaller. I have no problem with kids who need extra aides, supports, pullouts, etc. But stop eliminating honors/AP/enrichment activities for other kids. And yes this is happening at our school right before our eyes, all in the name of “equity.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP doesn’t understand the definition. Equity doesn’t mean equality. Here is a graphic I use to explain this to 12 year olds. Hope it helps!

https://www.diffen.com/difference/Equality-vs-Equity

This graphic is a cancer

+1. Equity means every getting what they need. But current attempts at “equity” hold the advanced kids back to make the gap appear smaller. I have no problem with kids who need extra aides, supports, pullouts, etc. But stop eliminating honors/AP/enrichment activities for other kids. And yes this is happening at our school right before our eyes, all in the name of “equity.”

+1,000 to this. School systems are not giving all kids what they need. They are purposely not always providing challenges to kids who are ready for them because then the disadvantaged kids will never catch up. So they are deliberately not acting in an equitable manner, they just don’t want to admit it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It seems to me that if you actually care about diversity - diversity of cultures and beliefs - then you can't also take the idea of "equity" seriously.

Different cultures prioritize different things in life, and not all of those choices translate into money at the same rate when comparing (artificial) groups to each other.

In fact, some may translate into other things that are much more valuable than money, but impossible to measure - like close families, robust friend networks, belief in an afterlife, etc.

This seems trivially simple & true, but you don't hear it much.

Am I missing something? It it wrong to apply logic to these ideas?

No, you are not missing anything.

Except perhaps that "logic" and "thinking" are the enemies of the woke mentality...which explains the apparent paradox.

[Anonymous]

Equity demands equality of outcomes, which is not a realistic goal. The only way to achieve that would be to reassign kids with lousy parents to better parents, beginning at conception.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Disagree. The first step is understanding the racism built into our systems and worldview.

Diversity values all people and cultures, even though the system favors some. Equity seeks to redress imbalances based on those systemic biases. Focusing on equity naturally increases and fosters diversity.

Equity devalues many people and cultures, on the grounds that they belong to advantaged groups. It encourages people to view themselves as members of oppressed groups rather than as individuals capable of success on their own merits. It nurtures resentment and fosters hate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP doesn’t understand the definition. Equity doesn’t mean equality. Here is a graphic I use to explain this to 12 year olds. Hope it helps!

https://www.diffen.com/difference/Equality-vs-Equity

This graphic is a cancer

+1. Equity means every getting what they need. But current attempts at “equity” hold the advanced kids back to make the gap appear smaller. I have no problem with kids who need extra aides, supports, pullouts, etc. But stop eliminating honors/AP/enrichment activities for other kids. And yes this is happening at our school right before our eyes, all in the name of “equity.”

+1,000 to this. School systems are not giving all kids what they need. They are purposely not always providing challenges to kids who are ready for them because then the disadvantaged kids will never catch up. So they are deliberately not acting in an equitable manner, they just don’t want to admit it.

+ 1 million