Has the Coalition for TJ (or any other groups) considered another lawsuit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

There is a reason people pay good money for these classes.

Yes, but you can also pay good money for SOL tutoring and frankly there are no free resources for that like there is for the PSAT.

Yikes. Do people really pay for SOL tutoring?

No, but if you start admitting students to TJ based on SOLs they will start paying for SOL prep.

The PSAT has free/cheap online options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

Most kids in 7th/8th are not disciplined enough to map out what they need to in Khan and stick to a schedule. The structure and accountability are one of the main reasons why parents pay for these test prep courses. They are much more effective for most kids, which is why parents shell out the big bucks for them. Plus, for TJ the test prep companies were "cracking the code" on the latest admissions tests giving those kids an even bigger advantage.

PP I agree that discipline is necessary but you can't drag a kid across the finish line at a high level with test prep unless they are disciplined and committed.
If that kid is just attending classes and hoping for top results, then their parents are wasting their money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

There is a reason people pay good money for these classes.

Yes, but you can also pay good money for SOL tutoring and frankly there are no free resources for that like there is for the PSAT.

If these prep places didn't provide real value people wouldn't invest thousands into it. They do this because they provide a significant advantage over these free resouces.

Exactly.

People overpay for all sorts of shit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

This. Most kids aren't disciplined enough to handle this on their own. For wealthier parents, the only benefit in paying $$$ for the prep course is that you can outsource all of the nagging that you would otherwise have to do to keep your kid on track. I'm sure that I could handle the prep for my kid just fine using khan academy. But I don't want to have to micromanage my kid and do all of the nagging. It's the same reason I outsourced driver's ed for my kid.

The easiest way to level the playing field is for the lower SES schools and/or Young Scholars programs to offer an afterschool 'TJ prep' club, where they go through khan academy psat 8/9 prep and practice writing essays. That would also help separate the kids who really want to attend TJ and are willing to put in the work from those who won't.

Princeton Review and Kaplan are not going to nag your kid.
They don't get paid based on your kid's results.

I think an afterschool TJ prep club is fine. They have something like that in NYC for the stuyvesant exam.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

No matter how many times you post these facts I'll simply pretend I never saw it.

And which of those "facts" say that people paid for test answers?

[Anonymous]

I just googled for sample Quant-Q questions, and they're basically standard math contest type questions. Any kid prepping for AMC 8, AMC 10, Mathcounts, Math Kangaroo, etc. would have already seen similar questions to those on the Quant-Q.

I'm not even seeing what the big deal is that places prepped for a "secured" exam. I thought the exam would be something special, but it was actually pretty generic. It would be really easy for prep companies to have similar problems without debriefing kids who took it, since they could just use AMC 8 and Mathcounts problems as prep. Even with this type of prep, there's a limit to how much the prep will even help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

Your claim was that families were paying for test answers.

The evidence provided is that people pay for test prep and test prep can provide an advantage.

Equating prep to paying for test answers is like equating baseball practice or watching game tape to paying off the umpires.

If you have to lie to make your point, you don't have much of a point.


As for "cracking the test," the more transparent a test is (see PSAT) the less impact expensive test prep has over cheap test prep.
If everyone has access to "test prep" then there is no real advantage to it and PSAT test prep ha s a lot of free/cheap options.

You are maybe confusing posters.

Affluent parents were paying for test prep that sometimes included questions/answers from previous tests.

Free/cheap prep is better than no prep but it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

No matter how many times you post these facts I'll simply pretend I never saw it.

The only one that was specifically about sharing Quant-Q questions was the facebook post. No matter how many times you post this list, it still doesn't contain an actual news article or any real proof that test prep companies had a question bank of actual Quant-Q questions or that affluent families basically "bought the test."

There are confusing posters.

I post these facts related to TJ admissions on the regular.

I did not claim there are news articles about quant-q.

Test prep companies were sharing previous test questions long before quant-q came around.

[Anonymous]

^ You are confusing posters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

There is a reason people pay good money for these classes.

Yes, but you can also pay good money for SOL tutoring and frankly there are no free resources for that like there is for the PSAT.

Yikes. Do people really pay for SOL tutoring?

No, but if you start admitting students to TJ based on SOLs they will start paying for SOL prep.

The PSAT has free/cheap online options.

Which sadly pale before the superior paid options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

No matter how many times you post these facts I'll simply pretend I never saw it.

The only one that was specifically about sharing Quant-Q questions was the facebook post. No matter how many times you post this list, it still doesn't contain an actual news article or any real proof that test prep companies had a question bank of actual Quant-Q questions or that affluent families basically "bought the test."

Despite the many posts and links that show the opposite I also choose to ignore facts because I preferred the old system which gave people with $$$ an edge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

Your claim was that families were paying for test answers.

The evidence provided is that people pay for test prep and test prep can provide an advantage.

Equating prep to paying for test answers is like equating baseball practice or watching game tape to paying off the umpires.

If you have to lie to make your point, you don't have much of a point.


As for "cracking the test," the more transparent a test is (see PSAT) the less impact expensive test prep has over cheap test prep.
If everyone has access to "test prep" then there is no real advantage to it and PSAT test prep ha s a lot of free/cheap options.

You are maybe confusing posters.

Affluent parents were paying for test prep that sometimes included questions/answers from previous tests.

Free/cheap prep is better than no prep but it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

There is a big difference between test prep that teaches how to approach questions and use your time wisely, and test prep that gives the actual questions.

To truly measure ability and intelligence, you need questions that the student has never seen. The tests used to be under lock and key and before the internet and copy machines, no one had access to the questions--except cheaters.
Something new needs to be developed to prevent this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just googled for sample Quant-Q questions, and they're basically standard math contest type questions. Any kid prepping for AMC 8, AMC 10, Mathcounts, Math Kangaroo, etc. would have already seen similar questions to those on the Quant-Q.

I'm not even seeing what the big deal is that places prepped for a "secured" exam. I thought the exam would be something special, but it was actually pretty generic. It would be really easy for prep companies to have similar problems without debriefing kids who took it, since they could just use AMC 8 and Mathcounts problems as prep. Even with this type of prep, there's a limit to how much the prep will even help.

The format was new.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. Reposting what we do know about TJ test prep...


There was enough concern in the community about test prep companies "cracking the test" that they changed the test/process multiple times over the years. Affluent families who could afford these programs were buying their kids an unfair advantage in admissions.

In fact, back in 2017 the SB switched to quant-q, which intentionally didn’t share prep, in an effort to reduce this unfair advantage.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2017/04/26/is-the-no-1-high-school-in-america-thomas-jefferson-fairfax-discrimination/
“ “Is it gonna once again advantage those kids whose parents can pay to sign them up for special prep camps to now be prepping for science testing as well?” Megan McLaughlin [FCPS School Board] asked when presented with the new plan.

Admissions director Jeremy Shughart doesn’t think so. The firm that markets the math portion of the test, Quant-Q, doesn’t release materials to the public, a practice that should make them harder for test-prep schools to crack.”


TJ students and others have publicly acknowledged the unfair advantage that money can buy and that test prep companies have a "cache of previous and example prompts".

https://www.tjtoday.org/23143/showcase/the-children-left-behind/
“ Families with more money can afford to give children that extra edge by signing them up for whatever prep classes they can find. They can pay money to tutoring organizations to teach their children test-taking skills, “skills learned outside of school,” and to access a cache of previous and example prompts, as I witnessed when I took TJ prep; even if prompts become outdated by test changes, even access to old prompts enables private tutoring pupils to gain an upper edge over others: pupils become accustomed to the format of the writing sections and gain an approximate idea of what to expect.”


TJ students admitted that they shared quant-q test questions with a test prep company or they saw nearly identical questions on the test.
https://www.facebook.com/tjvents/posts/pfbid0jKy4hotXF8AxKwfHm2MAVi7e2yYoCqtrTTXPYsszAdQg6uMoTmReMidqyM1mpu9Bl

Examples of various test prep companies harvesting test questions and sharing with others.
https://katedalby.com/get-tj-update/
The math required for the test is basic math, algebra, and geometry. In the past, we have used old SAT tests from 30 years ago augmented with select problems to mimic the Quant Q. In order to adapt to the changes, we will increase the number of permutation and combination problems in response to students’ observations about the math last fall.

https://www.optimaltjprep.com/
““M. said that the  math questions were very similar to the challenge problems she did with you in classes.” - C.R. (Mother, after 2018-19 test)
“E. said that the  math questions were very close to what she did with you during the last 2 sessions. To quote her exactly: 'Dr, Tripathi's math problems were dead on point.'  We really appreciate your help with her preparation for the test!” - L.R. (Father, after 2017-18 test)”

Many videos showing how to solve actual SIS math questions on TJ admissions tests:
https://www.youtube.com/@katedalbysinspiringtestpre864/videos
https://www.youtube.com/@EduAvenuesTJTestPrep
https://www.youtube.com/@principiatutorsconsultants4395/videos



Kids from affluent families who attend these test prep programs have an unfair advantage. The test prep companies are constantly trying to "crack the test". They ask students to share details/questions about the tests and then share that info with other students.

Your claim was that families were paying for test answers.

The evidence provided is that people pay for test prep and test prep can provide an advantage.

Equating prep to paying for test answers is like equating baseball practice or watching game tape to paying off the umpires.

If you have to lie to make your point, you don't have much of a point.


As for "cracking the test," the more transparent a test is (see PSAT) the less impact expensive test prep has over cheap test prep.
If everyone has access to "test prep" then there is no real advantage to it and PSAT test prep ha s a lot of free/cheap options.

You are maybe confusing posters.

Affluent parents were paying for test prep that sometimes included questions/answers from previous tests.

Free/cheap prep is better than no prep but it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PP
I see the DP now.
I don't think things that are true for the general population are true for the kids that are going to bury the needle on test scores.

You can't really carry a kid to a 1500 sat with sat classes. Those classes were honestly not built for that.
The kids at the far right hand side of the curve are figuring out the test largely on their own and need a little guidance here and there to understand nuanced or subtle questions.
The kids at TJ were averaging 1535 on their SAT, they were certainly getting academic enrichment but it wasn't the test prep that got them there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Agree that adding a FARMS bonus to the MS allotment is too much weighting toward underprivileged. I would also like to see them keep the latter and do away with or lessen the former.

I don't know if the system is already so weighted in favor of wealth and privilege that it seems necessary. Up until recently people even bought early access to the entrance test for years to game the process.

I am the poster at 14:04 and I believe in FARM preferences and holistic admissions and I also believe you are full of shit. I think you are a false flag trying to make anyone that supports the current admissions process sound like a dishonest idiot

+1

Kids from affluent families had access to previous test questions via test prep classes. They didn’t have “early access to the entrance test”. Although I do vaguely remember something that happening for CogAT years ago.

You don't have to be "affluent" to have test prep.

And if they adopt the PSAT as their entrance exam, test prep is available from Khan academy.

Just give every 8th grader the PSAT and use that.

Khan Academy is a great resource, it doesn’t compare to live instruction.

PSAT would be more of the same. SOLs would be more fair.

At least there is khan academy for PSAT. What free resource is there for SOLs? You think SOL's are not preppable?

I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.I taught kaplan and princeton review for years. The test taking strategies are probably about 6-12 hours at most. The rest of it is taking practice tests and being disciplined about reviewing the tests and answers. A disciplined kid with khan academy will do better than a kid that has to have their hand held through Kaplan.

There is a reason people pay good money for these classes.

Yes, but you can also pay good money for SOL tutoring and frankly there are no free resources for that like there is for the PSAT.

Yikes. Do people really pay for SOL tutoring?

No, but if you start admitting students to TJ based on SOLs they will start paying for SOL prep.

The PSAT has free/cheap online options.

Which sadly pale before the superior paid options.

Not really.