APS DHMS walk zone nuclear option

[Anonymous]

I had heard from some families that didn’t choose immersion middle school that they thought the school was a bit rough. I’m not sure whether they were referring to the immersion middle school program or Gunston middle

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

Yes but is a secondary option program really going to fail because you move it from one side of the county to another? Neither are convenient locations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My child is at an option school, and I actually agree that the option schools should be the first ones APS considers moving when they need to make changes. The option schools are, by design, not neighborhood schools. Move them if you need to. We would be sad for our school to move but we’d understand.

which school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Why is your complaint any more valid than their complaints in this situation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Gunston and WMS are 1 hour and 9 minutes apart by public transit, at a minimum. The majority of immersion students live in the Gunston boundaries.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the real reason no one wants to be in WMS is the administration and culture. They should start with fixing that.

How do you fix affluenza?

oh it's not just that. you can fix the principal.

What’s wrong with him?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Gunston and WMS are 1 hour and 9 minutes apart by public transit, at a minimum. The majority of immersion students live in the Gunston boundaries.

So we plan option programs near where students live???? Go for that idea. That’s a winner. You won’t get any pushback on that. Smartie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Why is your complaint any more valid than their complaints in this situation?

APS is a neighborhood based school boundary system. Your comment doesn't even make sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Gunston and WMS are 1 hour and 9 minutes apart by public transit, at a minimum. The majority of immersion students live in the Gunston boundaries.

Why in the world are you talking about public transit? They will be taking school buses. These are middle school kids, they take the bus home or they take the late bus home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Why is your complaint any more valid than their complaints in this situation?

APS is a neighborhood based school boundary system. Your comment doesn't even make sense.

APS also has many long-established option programs. They see themselves as an equal part of the school system and in fact most public school systems have option programs and schools. They’re not going anywhere.

My kids don’t go to them but I’m not dumb enough to take them on. Especially not if my main argument is but I don’t want my kid to take the bus a short distance to another perfectly good school because they used to walk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Gunston and WMS are 1 hour and 9 minutes apart by public transit, at a minimum. The majority of immersion students live in the Gunston boundaries.

Why in the world are you talking about public transit? They will be taking school buses. These are middle school kids, they take the bus home or they take the late bus home.

Not all parents drive or own a car.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Why is your complaint any more valid than their complaints in this situation?

APS is a neighborhood based school boundary system. Your comment doesn't even make sense.

APS also has many long-established option programs. They see themselves as an equal part of the school system and in fact most public school systems have option programs and schools. They’re not going anywhere.

My kids don’t go to them but I’m not dumb enough to take them on. Especially not if my main argument is but I don’t want my kid to take the bus a short distance to another perfectly good school because they used to walk.

I don’t think anyone here said: let’s abolish the option programs. What I read was, there appears to be an imbalance in our school system —- too many kids in the South for capacity and not enogh in the North. Rather than forcing children—ES and MS—away from their neighborhood schools, which have been the hallmark of public school in Arlington for the last 50 years, why not start with moving programs which parents opt their children into? This sees imminently logical to me, particularly where APS has been so bad at predicting the ebb and flow of where seats are really needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Why is your complaint any more valid than their complaints in this situation?

APS is a neighborhood based school boundary system. Your comment doesn't even make sense.

APS also has many long-established option programs. They see themselves as an equal part of the school system and in fact most public school systems have option programs and schools. They’re not going anywhere.

My kids don’t go to them but I’m not dumb enough to take them on. Especially not if my main argument is but I don’t want my kid to take the bus a short distance to another perfectly good school because they used to walk.

I don’t think anyone here said: let’s abolish the option programs. What I read was, there appears to be an imbalance in our school system —- too many kids in the South for capacity and not enogh in the North. Rather than forcing children—ES and MS—away from their neighborhood schools, which have been the hallmark of public school in Arlington for the last 50 years, why not start with moving programs which parents opt their children into? This sees imminently logical to me, particularly where APS has been so bad at predicting the ebb and flow of where seats are really needed.

This conversation is going in circles.

This is what they are doing and why they are moving the immersion program. So neighborhood-based kids in the South have a school that is not overcrowded. However, moving immersion to Williamsburg is very bad for their program moving forward and the kids currently enrolled in it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why don’t they just let the Hamm walk zone stay at Hamm and bus everyone else to Williamsburg? Wouldn’t this keep everyone happy?

Yes. And it's consistent with APS diversity goals.

I don’t see how recreating the Rosslyn Island to Williamsburg is fine but moving immersion to Williamsburg is a nonstarter. It’s the exact same issues.

No, it's not. Immersion is a countywide program and you need to get students to Williamsburg from all over the County. Rosslyn island to Williamsburg is just a few buses of kids from the NE quadrant to the NW quadrant. Also, those Rosslyn students would be assigned to WMS; whereas immersion students have to choose to continue in the program and many have a far more convenient default and therefore more likely to opt-out....defeating the purpose (alleviating crowding in south Arlington) of moving the program.

Immersion runs busses all over the county no matter where it’s located. Also, why should we care that immersion students have to choose between an inconvenient special program and a more convenient neighborhood option? It’s optional! We should be prioritizing the default. It’s not like Gunston is convenient for people who live near Rosslyn and Courthouse but according to the map they still attend. Williamsburg is projected to be at 65% in a few years. We could just move immersion there and be done without adding bus runs for walk zone kids or creating islands.

OK. Go ahead with that plan and see how it works. I'll put my money down on "it isn't going to play out the way you think it will."

Yes, we already heard this. “Moving Key will kill the school. Families won’t be willing to travel to a new location.”

And yet. 92% of the students moved to the new location. Of the 49 that didn’t, 20 moved out of the county entirely. If the program is truly strong and valuable, people will follow it.

It’s not just about current families moving to a new location. It’s about needing native Spanish speakers for the model to work moving forward. Been to Williamsburg lately? How do you think that will work out?

For those of you rabid to put a stop to any change, this idea isn’t it.

If Spanish speakers don’t want to enroll their children in Immersion, moving to closer won’t work either. I have heard exactly 0 parents IRL say the reason they don’t want Immersion is location. And even telling them that their children’s outcomes will be better isn’t doing the trick. Maybe they don’t want the program? And it’s a bit patronizing to try to make them want it because it’s for their own good.

Option programs need to go where there is space and that’s that. The rest of the county shouldn’t be shuffled around and disrupted for an OPTIONAL program.

APS is not going to run option programs in a way in which they are likely to fail because you don’t want your kid to take a bus. You don’t think there’s a whole contingent of people that will surface to speak up against that if APS staff is dumb enough to suggest it?

Some of these arguments are just such a waste of time. It’s like toddlers tantruming.

If moving a program across a 5 mile wide county is its demise, it never had strong support. It just makes sense to put option schools where we have capacity — that’s how they actually got started back in 70s when APS had empty schools and thought of using them for options. The only contingent to speak up will the white parents in immersion using the program to avoid their neighborhood schools — they wanted a convenient “better” school rather than actual commitment to immersion.

Calling people “toddlers” — I see you ad hominem attack.

Gunston and WMS are 1 hour and 9 minutes apart by public transit, at a minimum. The majority of immersion students live in the Gunston boundaries.

Why in the world are you talking about public transit? They will be taking school buses. These are middle school kids, they take the bus home or they take the late bus home.

DP But everyone keeps citing the difficulty for parents - and the poor parents - to get across the County to pick up their kid, meet with the teacher, attend school events, etc. Parents without cars would have to rely on public transit.