Feds uncover large-scale college entrance exam cheating plot

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

I don't think that the schools did a poor job educating these kids. Some of the kids may just be lazy but others may be just be of average intelligence. I don't understand why people make the assumption that these kids are smart based on their parents or that access to a great education and working hard will raise your IQ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

The top privates here and in LA are incredible. They prep them just fine, even with AP’s and inflated grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I think this still falls more on the parents are to blame for their lackluster academic skills than the school. A school can only educate your child if your child is present. The kids of many celebs and high power people often miss tons of school to travel with their parents.

My good friend is a teacher at one of the big privates in the area. They've made special accommodations for students who need to be gone for 4+ weeks to travel with their parents. And it's even worse in the lower school according to her.

[Anonymous]

I can’t believe they were family friends with a freaking head trustee of USC and didn’t just ask him for help? Idiots.

[Anonymous]

https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/lori-loughlins-daughter-was-in-usc-officials-yacht-when-mother-was-charged

Lori Loughlin's daughter Olivia Jade was aboard USC official's yacht in Bahamas when mom was charged: reports

Lori Loughlin's daughter Olivia Jade Giannulli was spending spring break on a University of Southern California official's yacht when her mother was accused Tuesday of involvement in a college admissions scheme, reports said.

Giannulli, 19, was on Rick Caruso's luxury yacht Invictus in the Bahamas, a report said. Caruso is chairman of USC's Board of Trustees.


She still needed to cheat? LOL! Dumb bimbo!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Down falls another pillar of what used to make us better than many foreign lands.

This headline is THE definitive answer to all of those people who whine about affirmative action.

Affirmative action is for the poor to counter the bribes? Huh ?

This scandal shows that wealthy people are more than willing to use their privilege to cheat their way into institutions that they couldn't get into otherwise.

Black and Latino kids are usually assumed to have only gotten in because of their race.

But I can promise that no AA candidate's mom paid someone to boost their SAT score from 1020 to 1420 they way Huffman did.

Everybody that test preps is paying to boost their kids SAT score.

Come on, you can't seriously be comparing test prepping a student with someone fraudulently impersonating a student to take a test for them?

A test prepping student still needs to bust his ass! Prepping is hard work! How dare you equate that with cheating!

But what about the families that can't afford the prep. I went to one of those free "let me show you how we do this" seminars and it is dirty. Not illegal like this, but dirty. Showing kids every shortcut, what to look for, how to decipher and breakdown each question. Which passages to read, which ones to skip. How many X questions are on each test and how to learn those. The last 3 years trended this way. blah blah blah.

It is an upper hand to those that go to those prep courses. Not to mention the $100/hr tutors that come to your house to find every angle to get you a better score. Even families living her making $100K to $250K have no idea what the rest of the country is like. Maybe you didn't bribe people, but you allowed your child everything they needed. No working during the school year (my kid is "sooooo" busy!) You made sure they got into top private schools and paid for it. You went over all the forms 10X over and made sure your kids applied IB and magnet. You decided where you would live in relation to schools/education. You pushed until they got into the classes they needed for a inflated GPA. You paid for educational camps and clubs. You made their applications "well rounded" with tons of EC's. You have the money to allow the kids to take it multiple times and get tutors/prep between each one to micromanage it into a better score.

I mean even having the time to read to your kid is more than many poor and lower middle class families have time or event the means to do. Handing them activities as kids, money each week for doing nothing is entitlement. I mean how many seniors have never worked a job, but have cars in the school parking lot? Entitlement. YOU just don't see it that way because you have surrounded yourself with similar people.

Many kids can not do EC's because they work 30 hours a week while going to high school full time. This helps keep food on the table for their family. Many could never in a million years get test prep or tutors, let alone a book to help them study on their own. Many go home to no heat or electricity. Many are fosters or homeless. Or basically parentless with drugged out families.

College admissions will never be even be close to even unless they took every kid to a boarding school away from their families (for better or worse) and teach them there. No money given. They apply on their own to colleges. But that will never happen.

So at the very least, they need to stop inflated grades. Stop allowing so many retakes of standardized tests. Stop making EC's such a big deal. Stop allowing donations and legacy to have any merit on a child's worth into a college. And for the love of God, get rid of the ED and ED2 that are also for only the rich. So corrupt.

So, serious question - are you suggesting any of this is wrong?

I make a good living. Not private jet good living, but I do well. HHI is in the mid 6 figures. I am smart, and work hard. Really hard. And yes, I know that a lot of people who work hard and are smart don't do nearly as well as I do. I am also lucky and privileged. I get it. But . . . does that mean I shouldn't give my kid nice things, or things that will help her? She should have to work 30 hours a week, and turn over her earnings to pay for groceries? Should I structure her life so she has the same challenges as homeless kids?

I get that things are not equal. And I am all for this nirvana you describe where everything is exactly equal - she's smart as a whip, and will do as well as any other kid, and better than the vast majority of them. But, that's not the world in which we live. And like it or not, her primary competition for many of these college spots will be kids like her, who have educated parents who care about education and try to help their kids. So I'm not going to deny her things and put her at a disadvantage out of some pie-in-the-sky devotion to perfect justice. I'll give her all the support, encouragement and resources I have available. And I may even spoil her a bit. I won't resort to illegal activity, and we're not in a position to donate buildings to schools, but I'll give her every advantage that I can, and not lose a minute's sleep over it.

Are you suggesting I should act differently?

I agree with the PP 1000%. I get its unequal, and would like to see things change. This scandal is disgusting and I hope all these people are prosecuted and brought to task for the shameless privilege they exploited. However, I'm beyond sick and tired of having to make excuses, or have people TRY to make me feel guilty, for the things that I can provide for my child because we work and make a decent living.

What should people who have the means refrain from doing (outside of illegal activity obviously)? I can afford to get my child a tutor and take a prep course. Should I not do that? I can afford for my child to participate in EC activities. Should I not do that, tell her she can't play on the travel team she earned a spot on because she has to go get a job at age 16? Should I tell her she has to help pay for groceries? Not have a birthday party? Can't go to study group with her friends?

Things indeed need to be more equitable, but I should not have to bring my childs life down to the meet the experience of our country's poorest kids in order to make things more equitable. That is just not reality. What can we do to help level the playing field that doesn't involve some superhuman level of taking vows of poverty or agreeing to not enjoy any benefit for things we work for? I honestly want to know.

When I was 16 in the 90s, most middle class teens did have a part time job. I want my younger children to have one also when they are old enough. It’s hardly bringing them down to the poverty level by expecting them to earn some money. I think travel sports are a racket that have arisen as part of this separation of the well off from the rest of society. Why not bring back real Rec teams so kids from all economic backgrounds can compete? That’s more equitable and doesn’t make the parents beholden to such absurd time commitments. I never did test prep and don’t plan to with my kids - but thats far off since my oldest is nine. Never say never.

I have a professional degree from Harvard, but have soured on the school in recent times. I took a class from a Pulitzer Prize winning genocide expert who couldn’t muster the courage to call a military takeover in Egypt a coup when she was a high level USG official. I was also in national security at the time and disgusted by the hypocrisy of what was taught vs practiced, but these profs are the darlings to many who go in and out of govt and back to HYP to leverage their experiences and cash in. Not the Hollywood and business elite of the recent scandal, and yes more intellectual in general, but not often better people overall. Kind of a big circle jerk. One example of many where political expedience and money trump ethics. I think it’s time for a sea change in thinking about can make our society great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

I don't think that the schools did a poor job educating these kids. Some of the kids may just be lazy but others may be just be of average intelligence. I don't understand why people make the assumption that these kids are smart based on their parents or that access to a great education and working hard will raise your IQ.

Yep, they're lazy or entitled. Loughlin's daughter even said she didnt' care about school. She probably missed a lot of school to be an "influencer" and travel with her parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

I don't think that the schools did a poor job educating these kids. Some of the kids may just be lazy but others may be just be of average intelligence. I don't understand why people make the assumption that these kids are smart based on their parents or that access to a great education and working hard will raise your IQ.

It’s pure idle rich laziness. These kids are healthy, good diet, outgoing personalities, with access to every creature comfort and school assistance. If they had *any* work ethic they could easily get into freaking USC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

I don't think that the schools did a poor job educating these kids. Some of the kids may just be lazy but others may be just be of average intelligence. I don't understand why people make the assumption that these kids are smart based on their parents or that access to a great education and working hard will raise your IQ.

It’s pure idle rich laziness. These kids are healthy, good diet, outgoing personalities, with access to every creature comfort and school assistance. If they had *any* work ethic they could easily get into freaking USC.

Lol I (briefly) attended school with one Paris Hilton. She missed a ton of school, and when she did show up, it was late.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe they were family friends with a freaking head trustee of USC and didn’t just ask him for help? Idiots.

Sounds like they became friends after admissions. And a USC trustee isn't going to get you out of a mess with the FBI.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder how much of this panic from the parents is that when PSAT scores come out in 9th or 10th grade, they realize that their kids' private schools may not have given them the education they need to actually achieve strong results, or that they haven't really worked hard.

The PSAT/SAT are no longer solely tests of (supposed) aptitude or likeliness to succeed in college. There is specific content you need to master.

There is little to no standardized testing at these privates that cater to the wealthy. maybe they truly didn't know they kids were dim.

I would say "they haven't really worked hard" would be the credited response for most of these kids.

Even non-top-tier privates in the LA and SF/Silicon Valley areas have decent test prep programs.

I don't think that the schools did a poor job educating these kids. Some of the kids may just be lazy but others may be just be of average intelligence. I don't understand why people make the assumption that these kids are smart based on their parents or that access to a great education and working hard will raise your IQ.

It’s pure idle rich laziness. These kids are healthy, good diet, outgoing personalities, with access to every creature comfort and school assistance. If they had *any* work ethic they could easily get into freaking USC.

That still doesn't mean that the kids are of average intelligence: regression towards the mean iq

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Found this on the ASU thread:


Loughlin's first husband, Michael R. Burns, graduated from ASU. Burns is now the vice chairman of film company Lionsgate. Giannulli went to USC, but does not appear to have graduated.

How can Loughlin sit and bash ASU when her ex went there and is worth 10 million now. I guess an USC drop-out who makes more, but is a cheat, is what they wanted their ditz daughter to strive for.

Have they fired her from Hallmark yet? Has Target dropped him yet?

Yeah. I just don’t hate these people that much.
Sure what they did was wrong, but I don’t really want them to loose everything because of it. I hope They aren’t dropped from their respective careers.

So you think a slap on the wrist should suffice? That will get the people cirrrupting admissions to stop.

Sorry, they need to lose their jobs. They are worth plenty. Their kid could have gone to any college and would still be rich. Enough with these idiots.

Parents fined.
Kids... if they were complicit, expulsion. If not, I think they review the quality of the person’s work.

Don't you think a fine is too easy? This is a set of people used to buying their way into and out of everything. I think they should all have some jail time, frankly.

It seems like for many of them the absolute humiliation they are dealing with now would be more of a deterrent than a fine or a jail sentence, though the latter would certainly add to the humiliation. I do not personally see why someone like Felicity Huffman ought to serve hard time for this, but I feel differently about the ringleaders and some of the coaches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I can’t believe they were family friends with a freaking head trustee of USC and didn’t just ask him for help? Idiots.

Sounds like they became friends after admissions. And a USC trustee isn't going to get you out of a mess with the FBI.

Ah. Is the daughter in a sorority? I thought every rich gal at USC was in a sorority.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Found this on the ASU thread:


Loughlin's first husband, Michael R. Burns, graduated from ASU. Burns is now the vice chairman of film company Lionsgate. Giannulli went to USC, but does not appear to have graduated.

How can Loughlin sit and bash ASU when her ex went there and is worth 10 million now. I guess an USC drop-out who makes more, but is a cheat, is what they wanted their ditz daughter to strive for.

Have they fired her from Hallmark yet? Has Target dropped him yet?

Yeah. I just don’t hate these people that much.
Sure what they did was wrong, but I don’t really want them to loose everything because of it. I hope They aren’t dropped from their respective careers.

So you think a slap on the wrist should suffice? That will get the people cirrrupting admissions to stop.

Sorry, they need to lose their jobs. They are worth plenty. Their kid could have gone to any college and would still be rich. Enough with these idiots.

Parents fined.
Kids... if they were complicit, expulsion. If not, I think they review the quality of the person’s work.

Don't you think a fine is too easy? This is a set of people used to buying their way into and out of everything. I think they should all have some jail time, frankly.

It seems like for many of them the absolute humiliation they are dealing with now would be more of a deterrent than a fine or a jail sentence, though the latter would certainly add to the humiliation. I do not personally see why someone like Felicity Huffman ought to serve hard time for this, but I feel differently about the ringleaders and some of the coaches.

For starters all parents committed tax fraud. Not sure what the penalties are there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Found this on the ASU thread:


Loughlin's first husband, Michael R. Burns, graduated from ASU. Burns is now the vice chairman of film company Lionsgate. Giannulli went to USC, but does not appear to have graduated.

How can Loughlin sit and bash ASU when her ex went there and is worth 10 million now. I guess an USC drop-out who makes more, but is a cheat, is what they wanted their ditz daughter to strive for.

Have they fired her from Hallmark yet? Has Target dropped him yet?

Yeah. I just don’t hate these people that much.
Sure what they did was wrong, but I don’t really want them to loose everything because of it. I hope They aren’t dropped from their respective careers.

So you think a slap on the wrist should suffice? That will get the people cirrrupting admissions to stop.

Sorry, they need to lose their jobs. They are worth plenty. Their kid could have gone to any college and would still be rich. Enough with these idiots.

Parents fined.
Kids... if they were complicit, expulsion. If not, I think they review the quality of the person’s work.

Don't you think a fine is too easy? This is a set of people used to buying their way into and out of everything. I think they should all have some jail time, frankly.

It seems like for many of them the absolute humiliation they are dealing with now would be more of a deterrent than a fine or a jail sentence, though the latter would certainly add to the humiliation. I do not personally see why someone like Felicity Huffman ought to serve hard time for this, but I feel differently about the ringleaders and some of the coaches.

For starters all parents committed tax fraud. Not sure what the penalties are there.

I'm not sure they all committed tax fraud. They have been charged with "conspiracy to commit mail and wire fraud," which is a catchall for a lot of alleged fraudulent behavior. Some of them may have written off the bribes/corrupt payments on their taxes, but I haven't read that they all did.