What is going on with student loans?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You people don’t understand the CBO score. It doesn’t cost $400 Billion this year and won’t cost that much over 10 years either. It removes a $400 Billion accounting asset from the ledger, the amount of debt owed to the government that will be forgiven, but those loans would be repaid over a decade or more, not immediately, and a lot of them would be forgiven at least in part under current rules, but CBO has to assume that debts on the books will all be paid. The cost of loan forgiveness this year would be relatively minor to the economy and the federal budget because if the suspension is lifted everyone without total forgiveness will start paying again, even those with partial forgiveness.

Also CBO is only counting the revenue lost from loan payments, and not the economic activity of the borrowers spending that money elsewhere in the economy. When taxes are cut everyone accepts that the tax savings will be spent or invested elsewhere in the economy. The same is true for loan forgiveness. The money doesn’t disappear, it just doesn’t go to the government.

"You people" do understand what's going on...but thanks.

It doesn’t “spend” $400 billion, which is what you all are saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In addition, this is the costliest EO ever.

President Joe Biden’s plan for student debt cancellation will cost the federal government about $400 billion over the next 30 years, according to new estimates from the Congressional Budget Office.

The figures were released Monday in response to a request from Republican lawmakers who oppose Biden’s plan in large part because of its costs. They were quick to cite the estimates as evidence that the plan will “bury” taxpayers, passing along the costs to huge numbers of Americans who never went to college.

The Biden administration previously estimated the plan would cost about $24 billion a year over the next 10 years — about $240 billion for the decade — while other estimates put the total cost at $500 billion or more over the decade.

The office separately estimated that Biden’s latest extension of a student loan pause will cost an additional $20 billion. Monthly payments on federal student loans have been frozen since the first weeks of the pandemic. Biden in August continued the pause through the end of the year, calling that the final extension.

The $400 billion total notably does not include a separate loan payment plan that Biden proposed to help lower-income borrowers in the future. The new plan would be similar to existing plans that limit monthly bills based on a borrower’s income, but with more generous terms.

So $13 billion a year? That's a lot less than the pentagon wastes on projects they know will never go anywhere

[Anonymous]

Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

No, not it doesn't. While the administration can have the forgiveness be upon application or opt-in or opt-out rather than automatic, none of that gives the lawsuit standing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

Whatever a$$hat organization filed this lawsuit is just plain nasty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

"The plaintiff is Frank Garrison, an attorney who works at the foundation, who says he is in line to automatically receive $20,000 under the plan. But, he argues, he will be left worse off by Biden’s debt relief because it will trigger state income taxes where he lives in Indiana."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/27/bidens-student-debt-relief-faces-first-major-legal-challenge-00059050

Worse off? How? Before the forgiveness, he would have to earn more than $20k and pay federal and state taxes on that amount, and then use it to pay the loan. So he'd be about $25k in the hole (assuming a 15% federal tax rate and 3.23% Indiana rate). With forgiveness, he has to pay $646 in Indiana tax. So he comes out over $24k ahead. How is that worse off? Is this some sort of GOP math?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

"The plaintiff is Frank Garrison, an attorney who works at the foundation, who says he is in line to automatically receive $20,000 under the plan. But, he argues, he will be left worse off by Biden’s debt relief because it will trigger state income taxes where he lives in Indiana."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/27/bidens-student-debt-relief-faces-first-major-legal-challenge-00059050

Worse off? How? Before the forgiveness, he would have to earn more than $20k and pay federal and state taxes on that amount, and then use it to pay the loan. So he'd be about $25k in the hole (assuming a 15% federal tax rate and 3.23% Indiana rate). With forgiveness, he has to pay $646 in Indiana tax. So he comes out over $24k ahead. How is that worse off? Is this some sort of GOP math?

His argument is that he plans to/wants to/is eligible for PSLF at some point in the future, which would not be taxable. So the benefit of loan forgiveness would harm him compared to the benefit of PSLF. But that's not how benefits work - they are not considered harm. And he only has a potential future benefit anyway, the PSLF stuff may or may not ever happen for him. And taxes are also not considered harm. This isn't standing - he doesn't have it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

"The plaintiff is Frank Garrison, an attorney who works at the foundation, who says he is in line to automatically receive $20,000 under the plan. But, he argues, he will be left worse off by Biden’s debt relief because it will trigger state income taxes where he lives in Indiana."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/27/bidens-student-debt-relief-faces-first-major-legal-challenge-00059050

Worse off? How? Before the forgiveness, he would have to earn more than $20k and pay federal and state taxes on that amount, and then use it to pay the loan. So he'd be about $25k in the hole (assuming a 15% federal tax rate and 3.23% Indiana rate). With forgiveness, he has to pay $646 in Indiana tax. So he comes out over $24k ahead. How is that worse off? Is this some sort of GOP math?

It only makes sense if he is saying he was never planning to repay his debts or would somehow have his payments deferred forever. Dept of Education should call their bluff and add an option to refuse debt forgiveness and see if these fools would actually refuse it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

"The plaintiff is Frank Garrison, an attorney who works at the foundation, who says he is in line to automatically receive $20,000 under the plan. But, he argues, he will be left worse off by Biden’s debt relief because it will trigger state income taxes where he lives in Indiana."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/27/bidens-student-debt-relief-faces-first-major-legal-challenge-00059050

Worse off? How? Before the forgiveness, he would have to earn more than $20k and pay federal and state taxes on that amount, and then use it to pay the loan. So he'd be about $25k in the hole (assuming a 15% federal tax rate and 3.23% Indiana rate). With forgiveness, he has to pay $646 in Indiana tax. So he comes out over $24k ahead. How is that worse off? Is this some sort of GOP math?

Basically Republicans had to find a rich attorney looking to grift student loans through a different program in order to challenge the $10k. Quite a lot of high effort trolling for something that will make GOP less electable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

Whatever a$$hat organization filed this lawsuit is just plain nasty.

This poster is a great example of why college isn’t for everybody. The dumbs wash out with debt they can’t service because they never should have enrolled in the first place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

"The plaintiff is Frank Garrison, an attorney who works at the foundation, who says he is in line to automatically receive $20,000 under the plan. But, he argues, he will be left worse off by Biden’s debt relief because it will trigger state income taxes where he lives in Indiana."

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/27/bidens-student-debt-relief-faces-first-major-legal-challenge-00059050

Worse off? How? Before the forgiveness, he would have to earn more than $20k and pay federal and state taxes on that amount, and then use it to pay the loan. So he'd be about $25k in the hole (assuming a 15% federal tax rate and 3.23% Indiana rate). With forgiveness, he has to pay $646 in Indiana tax. So he comes out over $24k ahead. How is that worse off? Is this some sort of GOP math?

His argument is that he plans to/wants to/is eligible for PSLF at some point in the future, which would not be taxable. So the benefit of loan forgiveness would harm him compared to the benefit of PSLF. But that's not how benefits work - they are not considered harm. And he only has a potential future benefit anyway, the PSLF stuff may or may not ever happen for him. And taxes are also not considered harm. This isn't standing - he doesn't have it.

That is some convoluted logic right there. In any case, the Biden program lets you opt out, so why doesn't he just do that instead of suing? Seems that would remedy all his harm (but would take away the fun of keeping everyone else from participating).

[Anonymous]

Ha! They opted the plaintiff out. Problem solved!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ha! They opted the plaintiff out. Problem solved!

That's a serious case of f&ck around and find out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

Whatever a$$hat organization filed this lawsuit is just plain nasty.

Bummer that your free money government handout is in jeopardy. God forbid you behave like a fiscally responsible adult and pay your own bills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Federal lawsuit just filed and, unfortunately, it sets forth a not unreasonable basis for standing and argument on the merits. I hope I’m wrong, but I see an injunction coming soon. Why the administration didn’t stand a refund application sooner is beyond me. I doubt a court would have ordered people to pay anything back even while ruling the order was unconstitutional. But this lawsuit will move fast and the whole thing will likely be enjoined without anyone seeing relief.

Whatever a$$hat organization filed this lawsuit is just plain nasty.

Bummer that your free money government handout is in jeopardy. God forbid you behave like a fiscally responsible adult and pay your own bills.

yea god forbid these people have to pay their bills. I pour everything in paying my student loans because its MY DAMN RESPONSIBLITY.