Ellen Page announced new identity as Elliott Page

[Anonymous]

I’m curious what they will do with the next season of umbrella academy. Recast the character? Rewrite the character as a man or as trans? Have Eliot play female? I like the show so I hope they work it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m curious what they will do with the next season of umbrella academy. Recast the character? Rewrite the character as a man or as trans? Have Eliot play female? I like the show so I hope they work it out.

She dresses like a teenage boy in the Umbrella Academy already. They’ll just keep that going. Maybe switch the name from Vanessa to Vander.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

How much do you expect people to know about an unrelated to them topic?

Ellen is now Elliot and wants to referred as he/them. That's all I need to know.

I'd appreciate all the education and awareness campaign, but there is only so much time for me to be deeply engrossed into all the topics/minority issues. My kid has some special needs, and I don't expect people to learn about those issues on their volition or to know much about the condition. I talk, and explain, and try to educate. Thus, I appreciate the PPs and their labor.

Same. I have my hands full, and the last thing on my mind are LGBQT topics. While I’m vaguely supportive, I don’t follow any of it in detail. I don’t even know what binary is. I feel comfortable asking questions, though, and people should feel comfortable answering them. And if they don’t, oh well. I’ll go on with my day!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

The people on this thread asking questions are not people who give a fig about the Kardashians.

The truth is most of this gender stuff makes little sense. You are born with a biological sex. It is based on your chromosomes. What does it mean to be a man or a woman beyond that? What does it mean to say you know you are a different gender than what your chromosomes indicate? Separate from biological sex most ways we define gender are a bunch of made up bullshit that varies from culture to culture. People who pretend this is cut and dried are full of it.

The way I see it is that everything else in nature is a spectrum and we are now realizing that gender and sexuality are also on a spectrum.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:So is his spouse now ungay?

that's my question. The spouse was a lesbian, but is now married to a man?

They are queer.

What does queer mean anyways? I never understood that term. Gay and lesbian and bi make sense but what is queer?

Basically it's an umbrella term: Queerness encompasses an intersection of identities. The term queer indicates an “individual who self-identifies as either Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender, Queer (also sometimes called “questioning”), intersex, and or asexual, aka the LGBTQIA+ community.

Thank you for answering this question. I am sure the PPs appreciate it and I do too. These issues can be difficult for those of us of a certain age who want to be kind, respectful, and inclusive to wrap our minds around. Consequently, people ask questions which can be interpreted as rude or disrespectful. Generally people who ask questions aren't trying to ridicule. They just want to understand.

Nonetheless, the prevailing attitude of many "activists" is to respond: "it's not my job to educate you. Figure it out." It is so unproductive. I mean it's not like you can google "what category do you fall in if you are a lesbian who got married to a woman who is now a man?" It isn't easy to understand. Maybe the answer is that you don't categorize, but often the category is important if you want to understand and offer respect. The opposite of love is indifference. Interest demonstrates caring.

Actually, you can Google it. Even very niche topics have been discussed to death and written about extensively on the internet. It’s easy to find and spend your own time getting the information that already exists instead of demanding that someone take the time to tell you. Someone who genuinely seeks to understand will do that instead of dropping in to derail a discussion saying “What does queer mean anyway?”

Not all nuances are explained with google.

If I were straight and then my H came out as trans, and I don't want to be with a woman I might not want to remain married.

I think the original question was asked in a rude way, but the partner can not be ignored.

Nobody's trying to ignore the partner. My point is if you want to find out how partners feel about it when their spouse comes out as trans, Google it. You can find articles, forum discussions, advice columns. There's an entire subreddit dedicated to people whose partner's have come out of trans and what that experience is like. It's all there for you to find if you take a tiny bit of initiative.

I'm a partner. I ID as queer. We were in a non-het relationship when my partner came out as trans. So the fluidity, per PP, was less of a big deal. Not all queer people, but a good deal, are already more comfortable with not fitting into boxes.

New poster. I get the fluidity part of gender. But if you are lesbian and sexually/physically attracted to women's bodies, and a partner wants to physically transition to a male body, doesn't that present challenges?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

How much do you expect people to know about an unrelated to them topic?

Ellen is now Elliot and wants to referred as he/them. That's all I need to know.

I'd appreciate all the education and awareness campaign, but there is only so much time for me to be deeply engrossed into all the topics/minority issues. My kid has some special needs, and I don't expect people to learn about those issues on their volition or to know much about the condition. I talk, and explain, and try to educate. Thus, I appreciate the PPs and their labor.

Same. I have my hands full, and the last thing on my mind are LGBQT topics. While I’m vaguely supportive, I don’t follow any of it in detail. I don’t even know what binary is. I feel comfortable asking questions, though, and people should feel comfortable answering them. And if they don’t, oh well. I’ll go on with my day!

Bi is two (bicycle has 2 wheels, bisect means cut in 2). Binary is a system of only two options (binary code is using two symbols only). Non-binary means existing on a spectrum rather than a two option, either/or system.

[Anonymous]

This is the first time that I’ve seen someone go by 2 different pronouns: he/they.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m curious what they will do with the next season of umbrella academy. Recast the character? Rewrite the character as a man or as trans? Have Eliot play female? I like the show so I hope they work it out.

She will continue to play a cis woman, much as cis actors are called upon to play trans individuals all the time.

[Anonymous]

New poster. I get the fluidity part of gender. But if you are lesbian and sexually/physically attracted to women's bodies, and a partner wants to physically transition to a male body, doesn't that present challenges?

I don't know and don't care what physical transitions (if any!), Page is planning and what parts of their current body their wife finds sexy.

That's none of my business.

But I can tell you that, in general, a queer woman in a same sex relationship with someone already presenting as fairly androgynous is probably better equipped to gracefully handle this transition than a cishet person whose partner is already a dudely dude or a womanly woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

The people on this thread asking questions are not people who give a fig about the Kardashians.

The truth is most of this gender stuff makes little sense. You are born with a biological sex. It is based on your chromosomes. What does it mean to be a man or a woman beyond that? What does it mean to say you know you are a different gender than what your chromosomes indicate? Separate from biological sex most ways we define gender are a bunch of made up bullshit that varies from culture to culture. People who pretend this is cut and dried are full of it.

The way I see it is that everything else in nature is a spectrum and we are now realizing that gender and sexuality are also on a spectrum.

Gender expression is on a spectrum. Sex is binary in human beings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

The people on this thread asking questions are not people who give a fig about the Kardashians.

The truth is most of this gender stuff makes little sense. You are born with a biological sex. It is based on your chromosomes. What does it mean to be a man or a woman beyond that? What does it mean to say you know you are a different gender than what your chromosomes indicate? Separate from biological sex most ways we define gender are a bunch of made up bullshit that varies from culture to culture. People who pretend this is cut and dried are full of it.

The way I see it is that everything else in nature is a spectrum and we are now realizing that gender and sexuality are also on a spectrum.

Gender expression is on a spectrum. Sex is binary in human beings.

That's generally true, but not always. There are many variations. There are people born with three chromosomes -XXY. There was a TED Talk by a woman who presents as a woman and was born with a vagina, but she has XY chromosomes. If people exist outside of the binary, then by definition, there is not a binary.

[Anonymous]

Reading this thread made me go to Amazon to buy Robert Galbraith's "Troubled Blood".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

The people on this thread asking questions are not people who give a fig about the Kardashians.

The truth is most of this gender stuff makes little sense. You are born with a biological sex. It is based on your chromosomes. What does it mean to be a man or a woman beyond that? What does it mean to say you know you are a different gender than what your chromosomes indicate? Separate from biological sex most ways we define gender are a bunch of made up bullshit that varies from culture to culture. People who pretend this is cut and dried are full of it.

The way I see it is that everything else in nature is a spectrum and we are now realizing that gender and sexuality are also on a spectrum.

Gender expression is on a spectrum. Sex is binary in human beings.

That's generally true, but not always. There are many variations. There are people born with three chromosomes -XXY. There was a TED Talk by a woman who presents as a woman and was born with a vagina, but she has XY chromosomes. If people exist outside of the binary, then by definition, there is not a binary.

Those are disorders of sexual development - genetic mutations. Some people are born missing limbs. That doesn’t change the fact that human beings have two arms and two legs. That is not a spectrum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of the wide-eyed responses here are just wild. If you can read at an 8th grade level or name all the Kardashians, you sure as hell have the mental capacity to comprehend gender identity.

To pretend otherwise is just willful ignorance.

The people on this thread asking questions are not people who give a fig about the Kardashians.

The truth is most of this gender stuff makes little sense. You are born with a biological sex. It is based on your chromosomes. What does it mean to be a man or a woman beyond that? What does it mean to say you know you are a different gender than what your chromosomes indicate? Separate from biological sex most ways we define gender are a bunch of made up bullshit that varies from culture to culture. People who pretend this is cut and dried are full of it.

The way I see it is that everything else in nature is a spectrum and we are now realizing that gender and sexuality are also on a spectrum.

Gender expression is on a spectrum. Sex is binary in human beings.

That's generally true, but not always. There are many variations. There are people born with three chromosomes -XXY. There was a TED Talk by a woman who presents as a woman and was born with a vagina, but she has XY chromosomes. If people exist outside of the binary, then by definition, there is not a binary.

Those are disorders of sexual development - genetic mutations. Some people are born missing limbs. That doesn’t change the fact that human beings have two arms and two legs. That is not a spectrum.

Exactly. As for “assigned at birth,” this makes it sound like doctors arbitrarily pick someone’s gender. No, they don’t assign a “gender” at all. They observe the newborn’s biological sex and record it. The push for this new language denies science & facts. We can be respectful of all types of people without doing that.

Regarding the “deadname” article— that stance is ridiculous. Continuing to call someone by a name they don’t prefer is rude. But mentioning what someone used to be called for informational purposes should be a non-issue. People change their names for all sorts of reasons— marriage, divorce, adoption, Prince, etc. I’ve never heard any of these other groups get upset about the mere mention of their former name.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Exactly. As for “assigned at birth,” this makes it sound like doctors arbitrarily pick someone’s gender. No, they don’t assign a “gender” at all. They observe the newborn’s biological sex and record it. The push for this new language denies science & facts. We can be respectful of all types of people without doing that.

Regarding the “deadname” article— that stance is ridiculous. Continuing to call someone by a name they don’t prefer is rude. But mentioning what someone used to be called for informational purposes should be a non-issue. People change their names for all sorts of reasons— marriage, divorce, adoption, Prince, etc. I’ve never heard any of these other groups get upset about the mere mention of their former name.

You're being deliberately disingenuous. You say they don't assign a "gender" but rather "observe a newborn's biological sex and record it." Why didn't you use the word gender in the second sentence as well? You know that gender and sex are not the same thing as demonstrated in your own language choices.

And for your commentary on the deadname article, again, you're being dismissive just to be smug. No one is getting upset "about the mere mention of their former name." It's not simply about "mentioning what someone used to be called for informational purposes." It's about continuing to use a former name as a way to not recognize and diminish the significance of the person's transition and new name.

You understand all the "new language" as you call it but because you have problems with the people using it you cloak your bigotry in a sanctimonious criticism of the nuances of the language.