Anyone else surprised by a lack of interest in William & Mary?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:W&M is one of the top desired schools at my kid's FCPS high school--basically it's UVA and W&M. I'm glad to hear this isn't the case everywhere so it may be easier for DC to get in. It seems like most of the high achieving kids are either doing WM ED and UVA EA or UVA ED and WM EDII.

Not being snarky here I'm really asking... No Ivies or other Top 20 schools for these top students? Can you elaborate? Have the top kids realized what a crap shoot T20 schools are and saving their early pics for schools they have a better chance at, and will be affordable? My DS graduated two years ago (NOVA public) and most of the top kids did ED/EA top 20 school, and then an early action to either UVA or VT or UWM (maybe those didn't have EA but that was the general plan). I'm wondering with DC#2 if we should just skip the whole top 20 thing, and it seems like I'm not the only one thinking this. Of course it will be DC's decision, but still a family discussion.

VT and W&M have ED only. UVA brought back ED for the first time in a decade this year. UVA also offers EA. Ivies don’t have merit aid, only need based aid. If you are a top performing kid from a doughnut hole family, you aren’t getting any aid from any highly selective school. Our EFC for Penn was $50K+. We could pay that for our daughter to go to college, but not without wiping out savings, mortgaging our house, or forcing her to take out a jumbo loan. We are in state for Virginia so we have top rated schools that are well priced. Our daughter and her friends are a pragmatic bunch. They are all focused on getting the best education they can without burdening themselves with excessive student loan debt.

Thank you.

Yes, the Top20 are a crapshoot and expensive and W&M and UVA are so strong and competitive that it seems better to lock in whichever of these is more preferred. I think the kids with no financial constraints might throw their hat in for an Ivy especially if there's legacy or a hook of some kind but what I've seen is that kids who want more of a SLAC environment go for W&M and those who want a bigger U go for UVA. If they don't get in to either, the kids who want a SLAC often go for mid-tier SLACs as well (think ranked 40-80) where there's a lot of merit aid for high achievers. Kids who want a bigger U either go to a VA school (JMU, VT, GMU...) or an OOS U with not too bad costs or known aid for OOS kids with good stats. Many donut hole families in FCPS seem to set their own bar of total cost of attendance at 40k and they can only get that via these strategies.

Shorter version: it may be worth it for in state students with a strong interest in UVA or William and Mary to apply early.

[Anonymous]

FWIW- I have a freshman at W&M. He does not describe a pressure cooker at all. He has found the pre-med majors to be stressed out- but thinks that is just who they are- not a function of the school. So far, he seems happy and says his classes are incredible.

[Anonymous]

William and Mary graduate here. I loved my time at William and Mary. But I will say this... things may have changed since I graduated a while ago...

- the campus is beautiful
- the campus is historic but the college has invested in dorms, the library, the theatre, and most buildings on campus
- it has a small community feel
- most professors are fantastic ... every single professor I had was fantastic
- class sizes are small even the 100 lectures
- students encouraged to take senior seminars as juniors or sophomores
- safe campus
- really down to Earth people

- not much to do on weekends besides hang with friends
- no major sports teams
- harder grading/ more work
- career counseling/placement is lacking
- some segregation among diverse communities (not a lot of mixing outside of class)
- not too many options for social clubs/ intramural sports
- conservative leaning

The school is rigorous but prepares you well for the world outside of college because you are expected to perform at a higher level.

You need to know your child well before you decide if they will be
happy at W&M.

[Anonymous]

^^ Thanks for that analysis. After this thread I am thinking that my DC might be a better fit for W&M out of the VA schools. Of course if DC can get in.

Just an FYI, I have heard that it is super-liberal, so probably not in the Bob Jones U category of conservative schools?

[Anonymous]

My DC doesn’t find W&M hard academically. 4.0 average. Found the people friendlier, more opportunities because is a smaller school and much better merit aid than UVA. Chose W&M over UVA and couldn’t be happier. Those privates your DD likes are very expensive also.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

W&M has a greater no. of students participating in frats than UVA. Also, you can go to UVA for four years and never once step into a greek house - they are all off campus.

I am curious if anyone really turned down UVA to go to W&M if admitted to both?

Yes. UVA is very large and extremely competitive. Not everyone loves UVA contrary to popular opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:William and Mary graduate here. I loved my time at William and Mary. But I will say this... things may have changed since I graduated a while ago...

- the campus is beautiful
- the campus is historic but the college has invested in dorms, the library, the theatre, and most buildings on campus
- it has a small community feel
- most professors are fantastic ... every single professor I had was fantastic
- class sizes are small even the 100 lectures
- students encouraged to take senior seminars as juniors or sophomores
- safe campus
- really down to Earth people

- not much to do on weekends besides hang with friends
- no major sports teams
- harder grading/ more work
- career counseling/placement is lacking
- some segregation among diverse communities (not a lot of mixing outside of class)
- not too many options for social clubs/ intramural sports
- conservative leaning

The school is rigorous but prepares you well for the world outside of college because you are expected to perform at a higher level.

You need to know your child well before you decide if they will be
happy at W&M.

I agree with some of this, but my experience with intramural sports was different. There were many options. As for major sports, yes, the football team has been struggling for awhile. But it has been an amazing pipeline for future coaches, as embodied by the upcoming Bills-Steelers game, where W&M grads Tomlin and McDermott face off.

[Anonymous]

It is true that W&M is very expensive for a state school. By far the most expensive of VA state schools. $42k total cost quoted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

W&M has a greater no. of students participating in frats than UVA. Also, you can go to UVA for four years and never once step into a greek house - they are all off campus.

I am curious if anyone really turned down UVA to go to W&M if admitted to both?

Yes. UVA is very large and extremely competitive. Not everyone loves UVA contrary to popular opinion.

DD is not applying to UVA because in the tour, she found it to be too pretentious. It does not fit her personality. If she applied to both, she would turn down UVA for any number of schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's a good place for brainy kids who aren't into getting drunk several times a week. My Kid who went there liked to go hiking and camping, went to parties occasionally but preferred hanging out with friends, playing games or watching movies. I think my kid wished Williamsburg was more of a college town, like Charlottesville, but he was turned off by the fratty UVA culture.

W&M has a greater no. of students participating in frats than UVA. Also, you can go to UVA for four years and never once step into a greek house - they are all off campus.

I am curious if anyone really turned down UVA to go to W&M if admitted to both?

Yes. UVA is very large and extremely competitive. Not everyone loves UVA contrary to popular opinion.

I would say that it is not unreasonable to choose William and Mary for undergrad (if you wanted a smaller school) and UVA for grad school. You’ll be set.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is true that W&M is very expensive for a state school. By far the most expensive of VA state schools. $42k total cost quoted.

Cite your comparison figures.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake forest and W & L are heavily Greek and big party schools.W & M is quite the opposite.

Absurd characterization. Both are superb institutions filled with extremely bright students who also have fun. WVU is a big party school.

Wake Forest and Washington and Lee are popular with rejects from better schools, no?

HAHA Wake is a top school for professionals and W&L is a top rated SLAC. 9th in the country.

[Anonymous]

Years later, I still recall the beauty of the place and professors who challenged me, for my own good. YMMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wake forest and W & L are heavily Greek and big party schools.W & M is quite the opposite.

Absurd characterization. Both are superb institutions filled with extremely bright students who also have fun. WVU is a big party school.

Wake Forest and Washington and Lee are popular with rejects from better schools, no?

HAHA Wake is a top school for professionals and W&L is a top rated SLAC. 9th in the country.

Wake is behind three schools in its own state. It’s a good safety.

[Anonymous]

Wake has become much more competitive.