Pay-to-Play Sport at Private HS employing club coach - what's normal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"What's normal?" or "what's acceptable?" Reading through these posts I have no doubt that there are lots of schools where coaches show favoritism to players who play for their club/travel/AAU teams. So that seems normal, even if it also seems wrong. But some posters are describing something different about the St Johns baseball program. If the coach there is in fact not letting kids play high school baseball (as opposed to starting other kids over them) because they don't play for his travel program in the offseason, then that is not normal or acceptable. Can anyone confirm that this is really what's happening? It's hard for me to imagine it is.

I can confirm that the St. John’s baseball coach, with approval from the St. John’s athletic director and administration, has told several players that they are not allowed to play baseball at St. John’s because they did not pay the coach to play on his summer travel team. I understand that there are other players who chose to not pay the coach for his side business and are awaiting their fate. I am told the administration is fully aware of the baseball coach’s personal financial requirement to be eligible to play baseball at St. John’s and have no issues with it. Someone figured out that the yearly costs for the coach’s outside baseball team is in excess of $5,000 so multiply that by 50 or 60 kids and you get a pretty penny in the coach’s pocket.

NP here. I have no inside information, but it appears SJC soccer players are being benched (not cut) due to lack of participation in coach’s club program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a Bullis parent whose kids play on varsity teams for each season in different sports. I can tell you that there aren't any coaches or sports who are doing what the OP described at Bullis. Also, could people please just stop randomly stop slamming Bullis when it's not even being discussed? THere's already a 30+ page thread full of nonsense and half truths. It's tiresome.

Perhaps not in the sports your child plays, but I can tell you we experienced exactly what has been described the original poster at Bullis. What is most tiresome are the Bullis boosters' knee-jerk reaction to anything negative revealed about the school.

This was our experience at Bullis too. If the kid is connected to a coach either due to being on club team and recruited or comes from a family that donates big time they get the attention. It’s true. Both in basketball and track from our experience. I’m sure other sports too. I also know that coaches get commission on his much money they bring in from full pays. The school is a total disgrace.

UNTRUE.

This was OUR experience and we have friends who are still there dealing with it. Recruiting kids in from all over the world trying to win championships on top of the other favoritism.

Can this ONE Bullis booster just stop?! Nobody is saying that the athletes they get are bad. What normal people are saying is that the process is unfair. They recruit from all over the world and even if it the caliber of student academics is below par they are accepted. You can’t recruit a kid and not start them even though a another kid is better. Bullis has superior athletes and nobody is questioning it. What is shady and unfair is how they treat kids who don’t PAY to PLAY!! Every sport there from basketball, lacrosse and track. The school is a mess and desperate for students which shows by the last few US classes. I’ve lost respect for the school and yes still bitter although kid is thriving at a highly regarded school. We wanted to like it and stay as it is super convenient to home. I want to warn prospective students and parents to spend time on campus to get the real feel and don’t get lured by a coach only to be fooled into paying full freight with no playing time!!!

Are you actually describing playing the best player as "favoritism"?

[Anonymous]

As a former SJC baseball player and grad, good for these 2 players for not giving in. Triantos was at IMG for a year prior to SJC. He’ll be fine without SJC...not so sure the reverse is true.
https://www.novabaseballmagazine.com/news/triantos-oconnor-transferring-from-6-time-wcac-champion-st-johns

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a former SJC baseball player and grad, good for these 2 players for not giving in. Triantos was at IMG for a year prior to SJC. He’ll be fine without SJC...not so sure the reverse is true.
https://www.novabaseballmagazine.com/news/triantos-oconnor-transferring-from-6-time-wcac-champion-st-johns

Parent of a former SJC baseball player here and couldn't agree more. When you talk to the head coach you realize it's all about him. "My program." "My team." "My way or the highway." He only cares about winning championships for his own legacy. The family name is on the baseball field so he thinks he owns the program and if you send your son there to play for him, he'll own your son for four years too. The really good high school coaches care first and foremost about the players and what is best for them, but not this guy. We all know those athletes who peaked in high school. Most baseball players at SJC peak in high school because setting them up for success beyond is an after thought. I know parents of recent graduate players and just about all of them look back and regret their decision to play year round for Gibbs. At least our sons have their WCAC championship rings in a desk drawer somewhere.

[Anonymous]

So does anyone actually say anything thing to anyone about this IRL? Why do people put up with this if it is so bad?

[Anonymous]

There’s plenty of baseball talent in the area. A good portion of them could play at SJC but won’t because of the requirement to play diamond skills as a prerequisite. That’s the way the Gibbs family has worked ever since the father was the head coach. If you weren’t recruited or a “favorite” it was evident and they would do very little to help get you to the next level.

What families need to realize is that you don’t need a program like SJC to get your child a college scholarship. Nowadays it’s all about how you perform on the showcase circuit, which is why these kids that are leaving the program prefer to play on more prominent/nationally recognized travel programs. That and kids are committing to colleges as early as their Freshman year so you don’t need to play on the “best” area team. I’d much rather have my child play at a program where the head coach measures his worth on how his least talented player is developing not just the chosen few.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So does anyone actually say anything thing to anyone about this IRL? Why do people put up with this if it is so bad?

Fear. No one wants to sacrifice their kids chances on team by challenging the pay-to-play culture. So everyone goes along to get along. It works for these coaches till one day it doesn’t - they do something too shady, lose too many games, whatever, and then they are gone. The smart ones that know the limits and know how to win can stay forever and make a fortune.

[Anonymous]

Well, if no one is willing to stand up, then they shouldn’t complain. Good lesson for the players. Not.

[Anonymous]

The people who can afford to push back are the ones like these whose kids are going to do well anywhere and already have committed or have the attention of college coaches.

[Anonymous]

If you're going to have your kids play team sports, then STFU. You should not be complaining. In team sports, coaches have all the powers and can decide who can play and who can sit on the bench. Coaches's decisions can not be challenged.

If you or your kids don't want to be put into that situation, play individual sports like tennis, golf, swimming or squash. The best players get to start and they settle this through match play. Those with the best record during the trial out will be starters. DS played varsity tennis for Flint Hill last year and the top player on the team was an absolute a hole but the coach couldn't do anything about it because he earned his top spot on the team by beating everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you're going to have your kids play team sports, then STFU. You should not be complaining. In team sports, coaches have all the powers and can decide who can play and who can sit on the bench. Coaches's decisions can not be challenged.

If you or your kids don't want to be put into that situation, play individual sports like tennis, golf, swimming or squash. The best players get to start and they settle this through match play. Those with the best record during the trial out will be starters. DS played varsity tennis for Flint Hill last year and the top player on the team was an absolute a hole but the coach couldn't do anything about it because he earned his top spot on the team by beating everyone

This is also a great lesson for young people to learn. Not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The people who can afford to push back are the ones like these whose kids are going to do well anywhere and already have committed or have the attention of college coaches.

This is on point. I think this is the first time Gibbs ever had two players this young (freshmen) recognized nationally and already committed to great baseball programs. Usually kids toe the line because they think they need Gibbs to get that college scholarship offer. I've heard that no player in this year's senior class has committed to play scholarship baseball after SJC. Ask them how toeing the line worked out for them. But as another poster said, at least they have WCAC championship rings they can show their grandkids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you're going to have your kids play team sports, then STFU. You should not be complaining. In team sports, coaches have all the powers and can decide who can play and who can sit on the bench. Coaches's decisions can not be challenged.

If you or your kids don't want to be put into that situation, play individual sports like tennis, golf, swimming or squash. The best players get to start and they settle this through match play. Those with the best record during the trial out will be starters. DS played varsity tennis for Flint Hill last year and the top player on the team was an absolute a hole but the coach couldn't do anything about it because he earned his top spot on the team by beating everyone.

You're delusional. What is being described at SJC is kids not being allowed to play on the school baseball team because they won't pay the coaches' private travel program in the offseason. These are kids who are already paying $20K per year to go to SJC. Do you really not see a problem with that?

[Anonymous]

Does Prep have a similar issue with Diamond Skills baseball? The Prep coach seems like a good guy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you're going to have your kids play team sports, then STFU. You should not be complaining. In team sports, coaches have all the powers and can decide who can play and who can sit on the bench. Coaches's decisions can not be challenged.
[b]
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I think that’s how we got Penn State, MSU, LSU, UMD, UNC fake classes, etc. You go from having coaching autonomy to 100% autonomy in all things. These coaches aren’t gods - they need to be supervised. If they screw up, its the kids and the institution that gets damaged.