Divorce over chores and WOHM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel for you OP. I’m also a child of a low level hoarder. My kids have never spent the night at grandmas house because it’s not in any condition for them to stay there - and my oldest is in highschool. We also had lots of renovations the first few years in our house though not as dire as holes in the subfloor. I am fortunate that my DH does laundry and cook. Are you able to get your DH to take on some daily chores? I would phrase it as either or, like would he like laundry or cooking? Doing dishes or general cleanup of the kitchen(wipe down counters clean floor etc)?

... be on deck with the kids on Sunday and I could do my errands without the kids.

OP here: Thanks for the advice and actual descriptions of the processes. I’ll move the shredder from the library to the recycling center (near the mail). Since DS is curious, I’ll keep it on a high shelf. The positive advice has been helpful. I slowed down on the buying this weekend and put multiple sale items back on the shelf. Thanks again.

No, the apt. has not been rented; it is actually is the storage space (i.e., moving boxes are in the basement). My parents are old and it’s hatd to get rid of tenants in DC if they don’t want to go (previous experience). We finished renovating the previous home 6 months ago; it has been on the market. In the “new” home, we removed the old floor and cutout the hole in the bathroom floor to replace the sub flooring before Thanksgiving. Things have been busy since the holidays, and funds are tight. DH lost his job last May and started working again in November. DH probably would prefer we had fewer holiday events and spent more weekends working on the house. I want a fun, normal Christmas whether we have money or not. Gingerbread house making parties are actually a ton of fun and actually cost very little if you have the space. We have awesome pics, the kids have awesome memories, and the kids are not wiser that funds are tight.

To the PPs who are rude and are at least funny—please do keep posting! You’re adding humor to the world! Looking at you PP who posted: If you want to get out of the hole, then you first gotta put down the shovel. I’m going to put that on a magnet on my fridge.

As a Christian myself, I feel pretty strongly that many of these judgey PPs feel they are very “good” Christians. Thanks for doing God’s work by putting down a mom reaching out for help and advice. I hope your life is better than what is indicated by the bile you spread. There I said it.

[Anonymous]

OP, you really don’t get it.

[Anonymous]

OP, it sounds like you are an opportunistic shopper who buys things that aren't really needed in the present because they may be needed in the future or because the price is good. I would really try to break that habit. Remember, there will always be sales and coupons in the future. Costco will always have bulk prices, it's why Costco exists. You might be saving 50 cents or a dollar or two, but you're giving up space in your home and it's damaging your marriage. Try shopping from a list, no browsing and no checking for sales or buying things just to get free shipping. You'll save yourself time and money, and keep your focus on where it needs to be-- family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, you really don’t get it.

OP here: I get that I’m failing at this (tidy house as a WOHN job), so I am posting and listening. Thanks to the great people who posted their perspectives and shared ideas. I’m impressed that the PPs with similar experiences in both sides took time to post. I’m copying out all the information in a separate guide for myself. The negative comments aren’t bad; they are dose of reality.

Then again, you might be right: maybe verbal abuse by strangers is the right way to get people to listen. I also bet that if we yell really loudly at teens about abstainance, I’m sure it will work great. Sorry about the snark, but I really can’t inagine why PPs guess that’s better than education about the topic. If PPs keep tsk-tsking and berating me *why won’t I think of the children* then I am sure it will work great and make the conversation that much better. I’m prickling at the “her poor kids” comments—because even if the PPs feel that way, it’s not helpful to getting things done if there is nothing else offered.

If there’s more than that and anyone has time to clarify, then I’m all ears. I just want to get things done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, it sounds like you are an opportunistic shopper who buys things that aren't really needed in the present because they may be needed in the future or because the price is good. I would really try to break that habit. Remember, there will always be sales and coupons in the future. Costco will always have bulk prices, it's why Costco exists. You might be saving 50 cents or a dollar or two, but you're giving up space in your home and it's damaging your marriage. Try shopping from a list, no browsing and no checking for sales or buying things just to get free shipping. You'll save yourself time and money, and keep your focus on where it needs to be-- family.

+1

[Anonymous]

Get your stuff under control or stop asking him to help. Living amid someone else's constant clutter is horrid and hiring someone won't help if there's no system in place.

[Anonymous]

Your children deserve better than the disgusting environment you choose to create and maintain. Your stuff is more important to you than your marriage and your kids.

[Anonymous]

Does anyone think her DH is more a part of the problem though? They seem sort of codependent here...OP, what was your previous living situation like? Assuming you have some of the same tendencies, it seems weird that the DH was all in on buying this house that is a mess and needs so much work. I get the impression he’s maybe not realistic either about the projects they take on or something.

I totally agree on doing a shopping fast or something. It will be good for your house and your bank account.

[Anonymous]

Slightly off-topic, but thank you to whoever posted the Organize365 podcast! This thread and the constructive advice inspired me to kick into high gear to declutter and get rid of things I have been holding onto “just in case”! The podcast is great! I saw you can sign up for her class, but I was too cheap to do it - but I am now thinking it might be worth it!

OP - just get started! I have a mini van-load of tho G’s getting ready to go to Goodwill just from clearing out starting this morning at 9. You can do this!

[Anonymous]

Previous poster here that asked about her apartment being rented. As you mentioned your DH’s period of unemployment and some more details, I would also add that you really think through why you buy and your relationship with material things. I started my journey when I first heard Peter Walsh talking about his book “it’s all too much” on Oprah (https://www.oprah.com/home/its-all-too-much-by-peter-walsh/all). I had to get a handle on the psychological reasons for my clutter to be willing to change my habits. I started a journal where I was answering questions from the book that examined my childhood memories, my hopes, and where I took a critical look as to why for my actions.

There is something there with your frantic socializing and shopping for deals - it could be avoiding dealing with something, repeating what you saw from childhood, I don’t know. As for having memories for the kids of the gingerbread party, being brutally honest, your under 2 won’t remember and my kids rarely ever want to look back at all the pictures. You are likely doing it for you and but saying it’s for them, so you can avoid dealing with everything else. But you have to keep your eyes on the prize and realize if you and your DH divorce over the clutter or constantly argue about it, no gingerbread party or hosting something every two weeks will make up for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel so bad for your kids.

Me too. I grew up like this and hated it. I have almost a visceral response to clutter now. I get I trouble with DH for donating stuff he still wanted (but to be fair never used.)[/quote

I am the opposite. I grew up with a mother like you who got rid of my stuff and hated any kind of clutter left around and I became a low level hoarder.
Neither are healthy. Getting rid of other people's stuff is no healthier than holding on to stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel for you OP. I’m also a child of a low level hoarder. My kids have never spent the night at grandmas house because it’s not in any condition for them to stay there - and my oldest is in highschool. We also had lots of renovations the first few years in our house though not as dire as holes in the subfloor. I am fortunate that my DH does laundry and cook. Are you able to get your DH to take on some daily chores? I would phrase it as either or, like would he like laundry or cooking? Doing dishes or general cleanup of the kitchen(wipe down counters clean floor etc)?

... be on deck with the kids on Sunday and I could do my errands without the kids.

OP here: Thanks for the advice and actual descriptions of the processes. I’ll move the shredder from the library to the recycling center (near the mail). Since DS is curious, I’ll keep it on a high shelf. The positive advice has been helpful. I slowed down on the buying this weekend and put multiple sale items back on the shelf. Thanks again.

No, the apt. has not been rented; it is actually is the storage space (i.e., moving boxes are in the basement). My parents are old and it’s hatd to get rid of tenants in DC if they don’t want to go (previous experience). We finished renovating the previous home 6 months ago; it has been on the market. In the “new” home, we removed the old floor and cutout the hole in the bathroom floor to replace the sub flooring before Thanksgiving. Things have been busy since the holidays, and funds are tight. DH lost his job last May and started working again in November. DH probably would prefer we had fewer holiday events and spent more weekends working on the house. I want a fun, normal Christmas whether we have money or not. Gingerbread house making parties are actually a ton of fun and actually cost very little if you have the space. We have awesome pics, the kids have awesome memories, and the kids are not wiser that funds are tight.

To the PPs who are rude and are at least funny—please do keep posting! You’re adding humor to the world! Looking at you PP who posted: If you want to get out of the hole, then you first gotta put down the shovel. I’m going to put that on a magnet on my fridge.

As a Christian myself, I feel pretty strongly that many of these judgey PPs feel they are very “good” Christians. Thanks for doing God’s work by putting down a mom reaching out for help and advice. I hope your life is better than what is indicated by the bile you spread. There I said it.

You should be buying nothing but produce, meat and milk until further notice. “Slowing down” the buying isn’t enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Slightly off-topic, but thank you to whoever posted the Organize365 podcast! This thread and the constructive advice inspired me to kick into high gear to declutter and get rid of things I have been holding onto “just in case”! The podcast is great! I saw you can sign up for her class, but I was too cheap to do it - but I am now thinking it might be worth it!

OP - just get started! I have a mini van-load of tho G’s getting ready to go to Goodwill just from clearing out starting this morning at 9. You can do this!

OP here: +1

Thanks. I looked at clutterbug too, and it’s a very helpful way of thinking of organizing by preferred style. I like that it identifies a default setting. I’m trying to see how to improve stuff, but I took a (mini) step today and finally put away the second Christmas tree. The first was packed away quickly but this one lingered in the formal living room because we don’t go in there much...but I hear how y’all say that actually is not okay. It’s stupid to pitch a fit over fairness and leave the house crazy looking so that everyone suffers. I thought it was so unfair that I was doing all the daily cleaning. I’m going to suck it up for a bit longer and see if DH contributes more if the clutter stays at bay in the main floor and master. The garage and basement have to be lost causes for now.

I also want to thank the PP who said she has an inability to “see” the clutter (walk by and say “later”). I think I’m the same. I asked a neat friend over to point out some issues (stray baby sock under piano, one children’s book poking out from under credenza, head phones on dining room floor, guitar on dining room bench...not counting Christmas crafts on table). I guess I saw that clutter (if I recognized it at all) as inert and not harming anyone and that I would get it sorted the next time we cleaned up for a party. PPs say clutter is stressful, so I can do that as a habit like some PPs are suggesting. My take was that if it bothered DH then he can damn well pick it up himself...we both work. I don’t know if you are a bunch of soft hearts (maybe?) but i guess it just sounds fair to listen to how DH may just be emotionally reacting to clutter as a stressor because maybe he hates it that much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:...There is something there with your frantic socializing and shopping for deals - it could be avoiding dealing with something, repeating what you saw from childhood, I don’t know. As for having memories for the kids of the gingerbread party, being brutally honest, your under 2 won’t remember and my kids rarely ever want to look back at all the pictures. You are likely doing it for you and but saying it’s for them, so you can avoid dealing with everything else. But you have to keep your eyes on the prize and realize if you and your DH divorce over the clutter or constantly argue about it, no gingerbread party or hosting something every two weeks will make up for that.

OP: You’re very right that the littlest one is not going to remember, so I am doing it more for me. I want to nurture a close relationship between the kids, the cousins and grandparents. Is it considered frantic socializing in DC to see family and friends once a week on Sat and Sun (any given individual is visited only once a month or so, except one cousin for play dates)? DH is an introvert and would always prefer to see no one but us (immediate family = kids and me). In States south of DC, you just spend your time with family. Honest question—I’m not being obnoxious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Slightly off-topic, but thank you to whoever posted the Organize365 podcast! This thread and the constructive advice inspired me to kick into high gear to declutter and get rid of things I have been holding onto “just in case”! The podcast is great! I saw you can sign up for her class, but I was too cheap to do it - but I am now thinking it might be worth it!

OP - just get started! I have a mini van-load of tho G’s getting ready to go to Goodwill just from clearing out starting this morning at 9. You can do this!

OP here: +1

Thanks. I looked at clutterbug too, and it’s a very helpful way of thinking of organizing by preferred style. I like that it identifies a default setting. I’m trying to see how to improve stuff, but I took a (mini) step today and finally put away the second Christmas tree. The first was packed away quickly but this one lingered in the formal living room because we don’t go in there much...but I hear how y’all say that actually is not okay. It’s stupid to pitch a fit over fairness and leave the house crazy looking so that everyone suffers. I thought it was so unfair that I was doing all the daily cleaning. I’m going to suck it up for a bit longer and see if DH contributes more if the clutter stays at bay in the main floor and master. The garage and basement have to be lost causes for now.

I also want to thank the PP who said she has an inability to “see” the clutter (walk by and say “later”). I think I’m the same. I asked a neat friend over to point out some issues (stray baby sock under piano, one children’s book poking out from under credenza, head phones on dining room floor, guitar on dining room bench...not counting Christmas crafts on table). I guess I saw that clutter (if I recognized it at all) as inert and not harming anyone and that I would get it sorted the next time we cleaned up for a party. PPs say clutter is stressful, so I can do that as a habit like some PPs are suggesting. My take was that if it bothered DH then he can damn well pick it up himself...we both work. I don’t know if you are a bunch of soft hearts (maybe?) but i guess it just sounds fair to listen to how DH may just be emotionally reacting to clutter as a stressor because maybe he hates it that much.

How much of the crap/clutter/“sale” items are purchased by your husband? I’ll bet he just wants you to stop.