How can anyone believe in god when there's so much evil in the world?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

You are missing a little detail after Adam and Eve sinned, God cursed the earth making it harsh against Adam and Eve.

In the beginning, the eye-burrowing worms were useful creatures but after the earth was cursed, it probably mutated into the harmful creature it became. And no, it did not evolve from anything, because mutations do NOT cause one kind of creature, say, a mouse, to change into another, say, a bird. Macro-evolution is bunky-junky science made up from fibs and fabricated nonsense.

Eye-burrowing worms, like viruses and parasites, are part of the curse, but one day God will lift this curse and make things anew.

Today's school shooting in TX with 8 dead courtesy of God, with honorable mention to Adam and Eve! I am sure the parents of those students will fully blame Adam and Eve for their children's death!

Gosh I hope that curse gets lifted soon. What is the holdup, BTW?

Many want God to stop the delay and get it over with.

Romans 8:22
For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now. And not only this, but also we ourselves, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our body. For in hope we have been saved, but hope that is seen is not hope; for who hopes for what he already sees?

Did God cause that person in TX to pick up a gun and kill people? Did God cause the pederast and homosexual Harvey Milk to molest teenage boys? Does God cause a person to pick up a bottle of booze and start a life of drunkenness? No, these are choices of individual will. Just as Adam and Eve chose to disobey God, so too do people continue to disobey, even when they have the bible (The Word of God) to explicitly and without any vagueness whatsoever instruct a person in the ways of righteousness.

God is allowing evil to run its course and will one day bring evil to an end. As long as there is one person who can be saved, even if it is 1,000 years from now, God will delay as long as necessary even for just that one person. That is how gracious Jesus our Lord and Great Shepherd is: he leaves none of his sheep behind.

Until then, we carry on as Paul instructed: "See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools but as wise, Redeeming the time because the days are evil." --Ephesians 5: 15

This leads me to a question I have no answer for but I have not searched the internets for it: In heaven, I assume we continue to have free will. When the earth is made anew, the New Earth people will have free will to do good or evil. Is it not logical to assume that one day, somewhere, somebody will do evil again and start the whole sordid process all over again? And when all that is “fixed” and God makes yet another New Earth, won’t this cycle continue of sin-curse-redemption-sin-curse…infinitely into the future? Or will these new sinners have Jesus to cover their sins as well?

It seems the only way to prevent evil is to take away a person’s free will so that person cannot make the choice to do evil, but then you don’t really have free will anymore but are a kind of programmed robot. And if we have free will in heaven, as did Satan, is it not it possible that some of those in heaven, perhaps becoming complacent or dissatisfied that others got more rewards than themselves, start hatching evil plots to stain the streets of gold with sin?

It is just a thought, and I’m sure God will have a fail-safe mechanism to prevent this but if God does, why did he not put that mechanism in the Garden of Eden in the first place? He could have placed a huge ditch around the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, or had it guarded by a T-Rex roaring at anyone who came near. Something, anything to allow this horrible disease and death to shellack the earth.

Then I have another thought (getting off topic): That tree of life: how many humans could it sustain? We know 2 but what about 2,000 or 2 million people? Then you plant a new tree? Would a point ever be reached that there were more humans on earth than fruit from the Tree of Life to let them live indefinitely? Would humans have to colonize the other planets with seeds from the Tree of Life so as to have enough trees to support all these people. Could it be God created creatures with the capacity to sin knowing that if too many lived forever they would have to die?

Just some thoughts, wondering, but I am sure God would have a perfect means to secure every person, even 100 trillion people. There is certainly enough space in the universe for them all.

——————-

If you think in terms of there not being a god, all these complicated questions go away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think Atheists are people who don't believe in art.

They are people who claim to not to believe in God but desperately seek every opportunity to talk about and debate about Him.

There are people who believe in god who feel a need to defend their beliefs

Nope. It's the atheists on this board desperately injecting themselves into every single thread. It screams of spirit deprivation.

So you think people who don't believe should just shut up and let you have the internet to yourself?

Are opinions that differ from your beliefs are that upsetting and threatening to you? I assure you that you will find very few atheists who are offended by your beliefs and think you should not post them. Most are happy to engage and respond because of the confidence in their position.

Nope. You could never change the mind on a believer. Coming here and stating that you don't believe or ridiculing believers is really not upsetting to any believers, most don't care. I just know that if I am 100% certain of something I don't have a deep spiritual need to constantly push a discussion about it. Atheists display that need constantly.

That's funny, because my doorbell rings once a week with someone pushing a religious belief, and not once has it been an Atheist. In fact, it's only been Christians.

You have a choice not to listen to them. You have a choice to not participate in anything Christian. The individuals that come to your door are part of some ministry and doing what they have been assigned to do. However, they do not have a deep need to prove it to you that God exists. They are not going to go home and think how they could convince you to believe. You don't matter the way you think you do.

You matter a great deal to the missionaries. They are trying to save souls for Christ. Apparently, God made us in such a way that many of us don’t automatically realize that we need Christ for redemption and many of us would never even hear about Christ if it weren’t for missionaries knocking on our doors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

You are missing a little detail after Adam and Eve sinned, God cursed the earth making it harsh against Adam and Eve.

In the beginning, the eye-burrowing worms were useful creatures but after the earth was cursed, it probably mutated into the harmful creature it became. And no, it did not evolve from anything, because mutations do NOT cause one kind of creature, say, a mouse, to change into another, say, a bird. Macro-evolution is bunky-junky science made up from fibs and fabricated nonsense.

Eye-burrowing worms, like viruses and parasites, are part of the curse, but one day God will lift this curse and make things anew.

Today's school shooting in TX with 8 dead courtesy of God, with honorable mention to Adam and Eve! I am sure the parents of those students will fully blame Adam and Eve for their children's death!

Gosh I hope that curse gets lifted soon. What is the holdup, BTW?

Many want God to stop the delay and get it over with.

Romans 8:22
For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now. And not only this, but also we ourselves, having the first fruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our body. For in hope we have been saved, but hope that is seen is not hope; for who hopes for what he already sees?

Did God cause that person in TX to pick up a gun and kill people? Did God cause the pederast and homosexual Harvey Milk to molest teenage boys? Does God cause a person to pick up a bottle of booze and start a life of drunkenness? No, these are choices of individual will. Just as Adam and Eve chose to disobey God, so too do people continue to disobey, even when they have the bible (The Word of God) to explicitly and without any vagueness whatsoever instruct a person in the ways of righteousness.

God is allowing evil to run its course and will one day bring evil to an end. As long as there is one person who can be saved, even if it is 1,000 years from now, God will delay as long as necessary even for just that one person. That is how gracious Jesus our Lord and Great Shepherd is: he leaves none of his sheep behind.

Until then, we carry on as Paul instructed: "See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools but as wise, Redeeming the time because the days are evil." --Ephesians 5: 15

This leads me to a question I have no answer for but I have not searched the internets for it: In heaven, I assume we continue to have free will. When the earth is made anew, the New Earth people will have free will to do good or evil. Is it not logical to assume that one day, somewhere, somebody will do evil again and start the whole sordid process all over again? And when all that is “fixed” and God makes yet another New Earth, won’t this cycle continue of sin-curse-redemption-sin-curse…infinitely into the future? Or will these new sinners have Jesus to cover their sins as well?

It seems the only way to prevent evil is to take away a person’s free will so that person cannot make the choice to do evil, but then you don’t really have free will anymore but are a kind of programmed robot. And if we have free will in heaven, as did Satan, is it not it possible that some of those in heaven, perhaps becoming complacent or dissatisfied that others got more rewards than themselves, start hatching evil plots to stain the streets of gold with sin?

It is just a thought, and I’m sure God will have a fail-safe mechanism to prevent this but if God does, why did he not put that mechanism in the Garden of Eden in the first place? He could have placed a huge ditch around the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, or had it guarded by a T-Rex roaring at anyone who came near. Something, anything to allow this horrible disease and death to shellack the earth.

Then I have another thought (getting off topic): That tree of life: how many humans could it sustain? We know 2 but what about 2,000 or 2 million people? Then you plant a new tree? Would a point ever be reached that there were more humans on earth than fruit from the Tree of Life to let them live indefinitely? Would humans have to colonize the other planets with seeds from the Tree of Life so as to have enough trees to support all these people. Could it be God created creatures with the capacity to sin knowing that if too many lived forever they would have to die?

Just some thoughts, wondering, but I am sure God would have a perfect means to secure every person, even 100 trillion people. There is certainly enough space in the universe for them all.

Christian belief is that when we are raised again to life through belief in Christ, we are perfected through Christ's death and resurrection. Once we have trusted in Christ and put our belief in Him, we are destined for a sinless existence in the new heavens and earth. Our present bodies must die, but we will be resurrected as He was. This is what any true Christian looks forward to, the time when we have finally conquered sin through Christ. We don't want to sin, but we are in sinful bodies that must die a death to this world. This is covered very fully in Romans 6 and 7.

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

He is. He sent his Son to die for our redemption. He gave us a chance to live forever in a place beyond human suffering, fillled with joy.

The better option? Fade into blackness? Extinguish like a candle that has burned down?

I don’t understand why people who don’t believe come to the religion forum and express disbelief. Nobody is forcing you to believe. You don’t believe, fine. But those that do or want to know more are not wrong to express belief in the religion forum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

He is. He sent his Son to die for our redemption. He gave us a chance to live forever in a place beyond human suffering, fillled with joy.

The better option? Fade into blackness? Extinguish like a candle that has burned down?

I don’t understand why people who don’t believe come to the religion forum and express disbelief. Nobody is forcing you to believe. You don’t believe, fine. But those that do or want to know more are not wrong to express belief in the religion forum.

Why are you wasting your time explaining anything to an atheists? You summarize the Biblical knowledge, which is a treasure in itself, and waste it on people who just keep parroting how they don't believe and how God should somehow conform to their understanding of reality. They are here to play out their role in rebellion against God. Let them have it. We know how it ends.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

He is. He sent his Son to die for our redemption. He gave us a chance to live forever in a place beyond human suffering, fillled with joy.

The better option? Fade into blackness? Extinguish like a candle that has burned down?

I don’t understand why people who don’t believe come to the religion forum and express disbelief. Nobody is forcing you to believe. You don’t believe, fine. But those that do or want to know more are not wrong to express belief in the religion forum.

The forum's title is not "expressions of faith". It is "Religion" and like "Politics", opinions may vary. Freedom of expression and all that.

The "better option" would be to give us that "place beyond human suffering" now. The current option is cruel, inhuman, and frnakly, un-godlike.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

He is. He sent his Son to die for our redemption. He gave us a chance to live forever in a place beyond human suffering, fillled with joy.

The better option? Fade into blackness? Extinguish like a candle that has burned down?

I don’t understand why people who don’t believe come to the religion forum and express disbelief. Nobody is forcing you to believe. You don’t believe, fine. But those that do or want to know more are not wrong to express belief in the religion forum.

The forum's title is not "expressions of faith". It is "Religion" and like "Politics", opinions may vary. Freedom of expression and all that.

The "better option" would be to give us that "place beyond human suffering" now. The current option is cruel, inhuman, and frnakly, un-godlike.

“Who are you to speak for god? “. That’s what a diehard Christian would say,,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Until then, yes, God is being gracious toward mankind and allowing all men a chance to repent. God is patient with us. You think God isn't good? He could strike you dead at your sin, but He allows you many chances to come to Him. If you refuse, that's on you, not on Him.

Oh yeah, he sounds wonderful.

He is. He sent his Son to die for our redemption. He gave us a chance to live forever in a place beyond human suffering, fillled with joy.

The better option? Fade into blackness? Extinguish like a candle that has burned down?

I don’t understand why people who don’t believe come to the religion forum and express disbelief. Nobody is forcing you to believe. You don’t believe, fine. But those that do or want to know more are not wrong to express belief in the religion forum.

Why are you wasting your time explaining anything to an atheists? You summarize the Biblical knowledge, which is a treasure in itself, and waste it on people who just keep parroting how they don't believe and how God should somehow conform to their understanding of reality. They are here to play out their role in rebellion against God. Let them have it. We know how it ends.

Someday they might need God. They should know he’s there. He does love them. They are my fellow humans, and worthy of redemption.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:“Who are you to speak for god? “. That’s what a diehard Christian would say,,

I don't speak for him. If he existed I'd like very much to speak to him. Maybe then he could explain WTF. No one else seems to be able to, no matter how hard they try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:“Who are you to speak for god? “. That’s what a diehard Christian would say,,

I don't speak for him. If he existed I'd like very much to speak to him. Maybe then he could explain WTF. No one else seems to be able to, no matter how hard they try.

The Bible is God’s word. You can read it and maybe find clarity.

[Anonymous]

If you think the existence of evil negates the existence of God, perhaps you need to study the topic a little more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
The Bible is God’s word. You can read it and maybe find clarity.

I've read it. Lots. No clarity. Just the opposite. Makes no sense to me at all.

Anonymous wrote:
If you think the existence of evil negates the existence of God, perhaps you need to study the topic a little more.

That's not any kind of answer. In fact it is 100% evasive.

I've studied it plenty, and the existence of evil does in fact negate the existence of god. Let's say you are made god today. What's the first thing you do?

I bet you do something.

I know I would. The hard part would be deciding where to start. Pediatric Cancer? Gone. School shootings? Gone. All suffering - gone. I wouldn't need man to prove anything, because I frickin' created him just the way he is and I know exactly what he will choose because I am omniscient.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The Bible is God’s word. You can read it and maybe find clarity.

I've read it. Lots. No clarity. Just the opposite. Makes no sense to me at all.

Anonymous wrote:
If you think the existence of evil negates the existence of God, perhaps you need to study the topic a little more.

That's not any kind of answer. In fact it is 100% evasive.

I've studied it plenty, and the existence of evil does in fact negate the existence of god. Let's say you are made god today. What's the first thing you do?

I bet you do something.

I know I would. The hard part would be deciding where to start. Pediatric Cancer? Gone. School shootings? Gone. All suffering - gone. I wouldn't need man to prove anything, because I frickin' created him just the way he is and I know exactly what he will choose because I am omniscient.

Ok, when you can do any of those things, holler. Maybe the creator who did and can do all those things has a deeper purpose behind it all? I believe He does. I think humans get frustrated when they don’t KNOW everything. Being a Christian isn’t about knowing everything. It’s about trusting Gods word and plan. It’s faith.

There are some awesome study Bibles that do have explanations and word origins and can illuminate confusing or nonsensical parts of the Bible. It’s an ancient text and it takes a lot to understand and process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
The Bible is God’s word. You can read it and maybe find clarity.

I've read it. Lots. No clarity. Just the opposite. Makes no sense to me at all.

Anonymous wrote:
If you think the existence of evil negates the existence of God, perhaps you need to study the topic a little more.

That's not any kind of answer. In fact it is 100% evasive.

I've studied it plenty, and the existence of evil does in fact negate the existence of god. Let's say you are made god today. What's the first thing you do?

I bet you do something.

I know I would. The hard part would be deciding where to start. Pediatric Cancer? Gone. School shootings? Gone. All suffering - gone. I wouldn't need man to prove anything, because I frickin' created him just the way he is and I know exactly what he will choose because I am omniscient.

People will believe in evil but not good?