How to fit school days into Gov Larry Hogan's ridiculous policy on school start and stop dates

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't seem that crazy. In NY, we started school the Wednesday after labor day and then finished in late June (22 or 23 ish) and that included a week off in February for 'mid-winter recess'. Since they don't have that down here, it doesn't seem crazy.

Also the case where I went to school in NJ. They were still able to fit in the -80 Days.

OK, then you propose a calendar. MCPS gave you all of the information you need for it.

[Anonymous]

We have family who live in NJ and this is their calendar

http://www.trschools.com/calendar/docs/20171708_082856_42_Revised%202017_2018%20school%20calendar.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers do not get paid in summer in MoCo

Teachers DO work more than 8 hours a day / every day

If parking lots are empty on teacher work days, that is because the union negotiated that teachers be able to work from home on those days- not because they are not working

Having all teacher planning and professional development occur in summer would be ineffective. You can't anticipate in August the changes you need to make to your lesson plans in February... planning time, collaboration with colleagues, using data from current students to drive the next unit- teachers need time periodically to reflect and plan.

School is not daycare

Teachers have the week between Christmas and New Years and the week of Spring break to have professional in service days in addition to summer. There are 261 non-weekend days in a year. Most of us get 10 federal holidays a year and do not get a week off at Christmas and a week off in March. Accounting for the 9 federal holidays (July 4 is not in teh school year), that leaves 252 weekdays a year. Take off 180 days for school and there are still 71 week days. The teachers can have their professional days on those 71 week days. That's typically 5 days at Christmas, 5 days for Spring break and 61 days spread across the summer. They need to handle their in-service days on those days. And if the issue is the pay, then the union needs to negotiate an appropriate payment level to compensate the teachers. However, that is a discussion outside the scheduling of the school year. There are 185 days between 4 Sep 2018 and 14 Jun 2019 that are not any of the federal holidays, the week between Christmas and New Year and one week for spring break. There should not be a problem fitting in 180 days of school. There's even some leeway if you need snow days (up to 5).

False, according to the following MCPS e-mail snippet:

Next year, we will have even fewer days to work with than in years past to accommodate our instructional traditions, such as having 184 instructional days, and our non-instructional traditions, such as a full week for Spring Break. As we design next year’s calendar, we start with several requirements from the State:

September 4–June 14: the permissible time frame for instruction
180: the minimum number of instructional days required
15: the number of State mandated days that schools must be closed
3: the number of snow make-up days required at the end of the year (before June 14)

Once the calendar accounts for these State required elements, a total of six days remain that can be programmed for other, non-required educational or operational priorities, such as Spring Break or instructional days above the state minimum of 180. How to allocate these days among our multiple calendar priorities is our challenge.

QED. You have been defeated.

You don't have to put the 3 make-up days at the end of year like MCPS is doing. The state NEVER said, MCPS chose to use that wording because that is what they are choosing to do. Why are they ending school on June 11 when school doesn't needs to be done until June 14? You can end school on June 14th, have 183 days on the calendar and put those 3 days BACK into the school calendar and use them as snow make-up days. That is what most districts do.

Hogan has already said if a bill came to his desk asking for President's Day and Easter Monday to be used for make-up days, he would.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:


You don't have to put the 3 make-up days at the end of year like MCPS is doing. The state NEVER said, MCPS chose to use that wording because that is what they are choosing to do. Why are they ending school on June 11 when school doesn't needs to be done until June 14? You can end school on June 14th, have 183 days on the calendar and put those 3 days BACK into the school calendar and use them as snow make-up days. That is what most districts do.

Hogan has already said if a bill came to his desk asking for President's Day and Easter Monday to be used for make-up days, he would.

It is?

[Anonymous]

Can we all just be happy we don't live in Fairfax County where they started school on Aug 28th and will finish on June 15th while giving Dec 18th -Jan 2nd off. I would honestly cry if my kids were off that long for winter break.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Teachers do not get paid in summer in MoCo

Teachers DO work more than 8 hours a day / every day

If parking lots are empty on teacher work days, that is because the union negotiated that teachers be able to work from home on those days- not because they are not working

Having all teacher planning and professional development occur in summer would be ineffective. You can't anticipate in August the changes you need to make to your lesson plans in February... planning time, collaboration with colleagues, using data from current students to drive the next unit- teachers need time periodically to reflect and plan.

School is not daycare

Teachers have the week between Christmas and New Years and the week of Spring break to have professional in service days in addition to summer. There are 261 non-weekend days in a year. Most of us get 10 federal holidays a year and do not get a week off at Christmas and a week off in March. Accounting for the 9 federal holidays (July 4 is not in teh school year), that leaves 252 weekdays a year. Take off 180 days for school and there are still 71 week days. The teachers can have their professional days on those 71 week days. That's typically 5 days at Christmas, 5 days for Spring break and 61 days spread across the summer. They need to handle their in-service days on those days. And if the issue is the pay, then the union needs to negotiate an appropriate payment level to compensate the teachers. However, that is a discussion outside the scheduling of the school year. There are 185 days between 4 Sep 2018 and 14 Jun 2019 that are not any of the federal holidays, the week between Christmas and New Year and one week for spring break. There should not be a problem fitting in 180 days of school. There's even some leeway if you need snow days (up to 5).

False, according to the following MCPS e-mail snippet:

Next year, we will have even fewer days to work with than in years past to accommodate our instructional traditions, such as having 184 instructional days, and our non-instructional traditions, such as a full week for Spring Break. As we design next year’s calendar, we start with several requirements from the State:

September 4–June 14: the permissible time frame for instruction
180: the minimum number of instructional days required
15: the number of State mandated days that schools must be closed
3: the number of snow make-up days required at the end of the year (before June 14)

Once the calendar accounts for these State required elements, a total of six days remain that can be programmed for other, non-required educational or operational priorities, such as Spring Break or instructional days above the state minimum of 180. How to allocate these days among our multiple calendar priorities is our challenge.

QED. You have been defeated.

You don't have to put the 3 make-up days at the end of year like MCPS is doing. The state NEVER said, MCPS chose to use that wording because that is what they are choosing to do. Why are they ending school on June 11 when school doesn't needs to be done until June 14? You can end school on June 14th, have 183 days on the calendar and put those 3 days BACK into the school calendar and use them as snow make-up days. That is what most districts do.

Hogan has already said if a bill came to his desk asking for President's Day and Easter Monday to be used for make-up days, he would.

Howard County has President's Day as it's first snow make-up day this year. So I guess he signed it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Teachers have the week between Christmas and New Years and the week of Spring break to have professional in service days in addition to summer. There are 261 non-weekend days in a year. Most of us get 10 federal holidays a year and do not get a week off at Christmas and a week off in March. Accounting for the 9 federal holidays (July 4 is not in teh school year), that leaves 252 weekdays a year. Take off 180 days for school and there are still 71 week days. The teachers can have their professional days on those 71 week days. That's typically 5 days at Christmas, 5 days for Spring break and 61 days spread across the summer. They need to handle their in-service days on those days. And if the issue is the pay, then the union needs to negotiate an appropriate payment level to compensate the teachers. However, that is a discussion outside the scheduling of the school year. There are 185 days between 4 Sep 2018 and 14 Jun 2019 that are not any of the federal holidays, the week between Christmas and New Year and one week for spring break. There should not be a problem fitting in 180 days of school. There's even some leeway if you need snow days (up to 5).

False, according to the following MCPS e-mail snippet:

Next year, we will have even fewer days to work with than in years past to accommodate our instructional traditions, such as having 184 instructional days, and our non-instructional traditions, such as a full week for Spring Break. As we design next year’s calendar, we start with several requirements from the State:

September 4–June 14: the permissible time frame for instruction
180: the minimum number of instructional days required
15: the number of State mandated days that schools must be closed
3: the number of snow make-up days required at the end of the year (before June 14)

Once the calendar accounts for these State required elements, a total of six days remain that can be programmed for other, non-required educational or operational priorities, such as Spring Break or instructional days above the state minimum of 180. How to allocate these days among our multiple calendar priorities is our challenge.

QED. You have been defeated.

I beg to differ. Here's the 2018-2019 calendar with notes

MONTH SCH.DAYS TOTAL NOTES Sep 19 19 Start 9/4 Oct 22 41 Off 10/8 Columbus Day Nov 20 61 Off 11/22-23 Thanksgiving Dec 15 76 Winter break 12/24-1/1 Jan 21 97 Start 1/2, off MLK day 1/21 Feb 19 116 Off 2/18, President's Day Ma 16 132 5 days off for Spring break Apr 20 152 2 Days off for Easter (Good Friday, Easter Monday) May 22 174 Off 5/27 for Memorial Day Jun 10 184 School ends 6/14

This includes 15 days off (Columbus Day, 2 Thanksgiving days, 7 days for Christmas/New Years, MLK day, President's day, 2 days for Easter, Memorial Day).

There are 184 possible days of instruction including 4 days at the end of the school year to handle snow days without compromising holidays.

What the school district doesn't want to do it give up teacher paid days without students. However, while you need to have a winter break and spring break for students, employees aren't required to get those breaks. Take a teacher in-service day the week between Christmas and New Years and another one during the Spring break week. They can take one or more days the week before school opens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:


You don't have to put the 3 make-up days at the end of year like MCPS is doing. The state NEVER said, MCPS chose to use that wording because that is what they are choosing to do. Why are they ending school on June 11 when school doesn't needs to be done until June 14? You can end school on June 14th, have 183 days on the calendar and put those 3 days BACK into the school calendar and use them as snow make-up days. That is what most districts do.

Hogan has already said if a bill came to his desk asking for President's Day and Easter Monday to be used for make-up days, he would.

It is?

Howard County last day June 14th
Frederick County last day June 15th
PG County last day June 15th
Baltimore County last day June 15th
Anne Arundel County last day June 15th
Baltimore City last day June 14th

Don't feel like looking any more up. I would assume most of the others don't have Jewish or Muslim holidays for days off and may get out a little earlier.

[Anonymous]

What calendar are you looking at? There's no day off for Columbus Day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What calendar are you looking at? There's no day off for Columbus Day.

I tossed that in looking for a 15th state-mandated closure date. The 2016 public school calendar only had 12 required closure dates. Not sure where they get 15 state-mandated closure date. Substitute Columbus Day for whatever the 15th mandated closure date that MCPS is using.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What calendar are you looking at? There's no day off for Columbus Day.

I tossed that in looking for a 15th state-mandated closure date. The 2016 public school calendar only had 12 required closure dates. Not sure where they get 15 state-mandated closure date. Substitute Columbus Day for whatever the 15th mandated closure date that MCPS is using.

Consider finding that out first?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's political because the Board of Ed sends out info to inform their constituency about a change that will affect them/the school calendar? Get a grip! If they sent nothing and just made the change you'd consider them corrupt for not making the process public.

What exactly would you preferred they have done, given that the calendar will change considerably next year?

I would also like people to answer that question. Would you have preferred for the Board of Education to not inform you about the calendar?

Normally the BOE sends out a notice once the calendar is set. They have never before sent out an email like this. I want an email saying what the final calendar is and that’s it.

They didn’t even send out an email to all parents when there was an incident where guns were brought to a school. They did not send out a universal email when the RM Security Team Leader was found to have been having a sexual relationship with a student. Why did the BOE choose to send out this particular email? Maybe it’s just random but it does seem slightly political to me. But maybe I’m wrong. They’ve also been known to make these calendar issue a political issue in the past. They sent Hogan several letters last year about the calendar, etc.

I live in the RM Cluster. I don't think it's appropriate to send out an email to every mcps parent about serious incidents that occur in one specific school. Would it be appropriate to send an email to you about the weapon that was brought to a Bethesda school if you live in Potomac? Other than curiousity, probably not.

The school calendar affects EVERY mcps school, hence they sent it out to everyone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't seem that crazy. In NY, we started school the Wednesday after labor day and then finished in late June (22 or 23 ish) and that included a week off in February for 'mid-winter recess'. Since they don't have that down here, it doesn't seem crazy.

Also the case where I went to school in NJ. They were still able to fit in the -80 Days.

OK, then you propose a calendar. MCPS gave you all of the information you need for it.

I wasn’t saying that I want to propose a calendar. I was just pointing out that other districts/states make this work.

First of all, it’s the BOE’s job to do that. They’ve been able to do it for years and should be able to make it work this time, without sending out a whiny email complaining about the new ‘challenge’ due to Hogan.

Several people have given examples of possibilities and the BOE has given it’s own options. Pick one and go with it.

What’s the point of an email like the one they sent out other than to make it political.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What calendar are you looking at? There's no day off for Columbus Day.

I tossed that in looking for a 15th state-mandated closure date. The 2016 public school calendar only had 12 required closure dates. Not sure where they get 15 state-mandated closure date. Substitute Columbus Day for whatever the 15th mandated closure date that MCPS is using.

Consider finding that out first?

I find it amusing that your retorts are asking people to find info when you can easily do that yourself. So far, everyone has answered your little questions but yet you still want to believe the BOE has no other options. There is no changing your mind. No big deal. You can agree to disagree with the PP, who I am not by the way. But I did show you all the other counties that do know how to use make-up snow days when you smartly asked "it is?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Doesn't seem that crazy. In NY, we started school the Wednesday after labor day and then finished in late June (22 or 23 ish) and that included a week off in February for 'mid-winter recess'. Since they don't have that down here, it doesn't seem crazy.

Also the case where I went to school in NJ. They were still able to fit in the -80 Days.

OK, then you propose a calendar. MCPS gave you all of the information you need for it.

I wasn’t saying that I want to propose a calendar. I was just pointing out that other districts/states make this work.

First of all, it’s the BOE’s job to do that. They’ve been able to do it for years and should be able to make it work this time, without sending out a whiny email complaining about the new ‘challenge’ due to Hogan.

Several people have given examples of possibilities and the BOE has given it’s own options. Pick one and go with it.

What’s the point of an email like the one they sent out other than to make it political.

Not only political but the BOE is making it seem like you either have to be for Jewish holidays or for Spring Break. But then again, I think that was their point to start the complaints.