Real Concern: Does Hazing still happen in the Greek system?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rest of the world sends their kids to university for an education. Here, it seems a certain class of parents pays a premium for what amounts to a four-year networking seminar with beer, with crimes committed here and there. This is the great aspiration of the parvenu, the social climber who believes access can be bought.

You are not just paying dues, you are investing in the hope that your children will acquire what Bourdieu called "habitus".

The whole idea of Greek for us non Americans it that it is simply an enterprise sold to middle income americans as a sort of middle-management incubator, a place for those who need a pre-built structure to succeed. Americans have bought into this dream…..

“Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive”

I’m no fan of the Greek system but you’re clearly showing your ignorance if you believe that upper income students aren’t involved.

I come from a “middle income” family and none of us have ever had the desire to go Greek. Meanwhile, many upper income families have deep legacies with various sororities and fraternities. M

It’s really best not to generalize.

What is your definition of upper income? The whole point Euro mom was making was that the “real upper class” dont aspire to get a leg up on hiring for a $150k job after college….

No, but many of the "real upper class" absolutely join Greek life. The PP was claiming only a "certain class" (read: low/middle) would ever join. That's simply false.

That is not what euro mom said. She said “middle income” Americans. I’m sorry. But you cant tell me that the average of ALL Greek students at every single university in the US is not from a middle income family. Please…..she never said “low” and she never said “that upper class” doesnt join….read it again….

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just had dinner with a friend. Her kid rushed last year and shared some things. Sounded similar to my day. One thing he shared was 8 pledges locked in a shed with four cases of beer and a bucket and couldn’t leave until gone. We drank way too much in our day too with activities. That’s the big part I don’t like, I had hoped the healthier lifestyle many kids have embraced would have changed this.

Couldn't this be considered attempted murder? Certainly complicit. That is 12 beers each. A locked shed.

People sometimes die.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The rest of the world sends their kids to university for an education. Here, it seems a certain class of parents pays a premium for what amounts to a four-year networking seminar with beer, with crimes committed here and there. This is the great aspiration of the parvenu, the social climber who believes access can be bought.

You are not just paying dues, you are investing in the hope that your children will acquire what Bourdieu called "habitus".

The whole idea of Greek for us non Americans it that it is simply an enterprise sold to middle income americans as a sort of middle-management incubator, a place for those who need a pre-built structure to succeed. Americans have bought into this dream…..

“Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive”

44% or US presidents belonged to fraternities, and I’d guess a similar percentage of senators and top executives of Fortune 500 companies — more if you include societies like skull and bones.

In many chapters (like the one I belonged to briefly), your pedigree is the only thing that matters. Excluding the riff raff is the point. There is zero effort to “sell” anything to middle income Americans, merely an effort to exclude them.

Your entire post was what Caray famously referred to as “a swing and a miss.”

[Anonymous]

*44% of

[Anonymous]

I'm not reading through this thread, but I will say that when you look at the hazing deaths, serious injuries, assaults, etc., you will notice that the vast majority of victims are NOT the super wealthy, connected kids. they are the ones whose hopes and dreams were tied up into making the kind of connections Greek life is supposed to bring. any college or university that has not done way with these elitist, intentionally exclusive, often abusive organizations is complicit in a socioeconomic, often racial/ethnic, tiered hierarchy at their school. they allow it and they enforce it. anything else you have to say about it is, frankly, just noise. did you make lifelong friendships? were you in each other's weddings? did you get each other jobs? of course you did.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The rest of the world sends their kids to university for an education. Here, it seems a certain class of parents pays a premium for what amounts to a four-year networking seminar with beer, with crimes committed here and there. This is the great aspiration of the parvenu, the social climber who believes access can be bought.

You are not just paying dues, you are investing in the hope that your children will acquire what Bourdieu called "habitus".

The whole idea of Greek for us non Americans it that it is simply an enterprise sold to middle income americans as a sort of middle-management incubator, a place for those who need a pre-built structure to succeed. Americans have bought into this dream…..

“Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive”

I think you posted this basically word for word in another thread (is repetition somehow a refuge of the imaginative?)

Also you seem to be confusing Bourdieu’s habitus with that of his concept of capital. But that’s a different conversation.

[Anonymous]

Yes, hazing happens and I think it’s fair to say it’s much more prevalent in fraternities than sororities. I was in a sorority in the 90s. Our hazing consisted of being given a curfew and then kidnapped and walked through campus and a frat party in our pjs. No nakedness and no sex list. If anything the older members of our chapter were the purity police and very focused on the chapter’s campus image. Outrageous behavior or sleeping around earned you a visit to the standards committee. No robes in our chapter, we wore our own white dresses for ceremonies. Yes, we’re all sworn to secrecy but honestly who gives a crap after you graduate.

My son pledged a frat when he went to school and was locked in a room with fellow pledges, a puke bucket, and a ton of alcohol they were forced to drink. The pledges were also expected to spend a lot of money on things for older brothers - food, alcohol, party supplies, etc. DS was practically broke before first semester ended. DS ended up dropping out. According to him the chapter did nothing but drink - no philanthropy, intramurals, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The rest of the world sends their kids to university for an education. Here, it seems a certain class of parents pays a premium for what amounts to a four-year networking seminar with beer, with crimes committed here and there. This is the great aspiration of the parvenu, the social climber who believes access can be bought.

You are not just paying dues, you are investing in the hope that your children will acquire what Bourdieu called "habitus".

The whole idea of Greek for us non Americans it that it is simply an enterprise sold to middle income americans as a sort of middle-management incubator, a place for those who need a pre-built structure to succeed. Americans have bought into this dream…..

“Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive”

well said.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The rest of the world sends their kids to university for an education. Here, it seems a certain class of parents pays a premium for what amounts to a four-year networking seminar with beer, with crimes committed here and there. This is the great aspiration of the parvenu, the social climber who believes access can be bought.

You are not just paying dues, you are investing in the hope that your children will acquire what Bourdieu called "habitus".

The whole idea of Greek for us non Americans it that it is simply an enterprise sold to middle income americans as a sort of middle-management incubator, a place for those who need a pre-built structure to succeed. Americans have bought into this dream…..

“Conformity is the last refuge of the unimaginitive”

well said.

It's a misquote. Oscar Wilde said that consistency, not conformity, is the last refuge of the unimaginative.