What’s going on with the two bills?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard they're dropping Paid Leave from the BBB bill. Personally I think that and subsidized child care should go.

Focus on getting universal pre-school paid for which is formative for early education. I could take or leave community college. Child tax credits can stay but with an employment requirement and a limit on number of kids - I don't care of its a limit of 8 or 10 but SOME LIMIT in place.

I think the community college one is one of the most important. It gives people a path to save on university costs and builds up a hub to help the broader community. So much could be done with it long term if the base funding is fixed.

Yeah, im down for a four kid limit on the kids credit. Dont let it become a moneymaking scam like homeschool (some people take bigly advantage and give the legit homeschool parents a bad name). I dont think conditionality is ever a good idea.

Conditionality? You mean the employment requirement?

Yes. Employment requirement and means testing. If it's a public virtue then it should be universal. Adding complexity adds costs, degrades the meaning/purpose, and transforms it from a public policy to a government handout.

Its not a public virtue. The Democrats want to argue up-and-down that the Child Tax Credits are not unearned income. That its just a pre-payment on tax returns for the next year. Well if you're not working YOU GET NO RETURNS.

There should be an employment requirement just like there is for social security. P.S. - Its already a government handout.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard they're dropping Paid Leave from the BBB bill. Personally I think that and subsidized child care should go.

Focus on getting universal pre-school paid for which is formative for early education. I could take or leave community college. Child tax credits can stay but with an employment requirement and a limit on number of kids - I don't care of its a limit of 8 or 10 but SOME LIMIT in place.

I think the community college one is one of the most important. It gives people a path to save on university costs and builds up a hub to help the broader community. So much could be done with it long term if the base funding is fixed.

Yeah, im down for a four kid limit on the kids credit. Dont let it become a moneymaking scam like homeschool (some people take bigly advantage and give the legit homeschool parents a bad name). I dont think conditionality is ever a good idea.

Conditionality? You mean the employment requirement?

NP... 4 kid limit would work for me though I'd probably be more inclined to drop that to 2 or 3, plus means testing - nobody with HHI well into 6 figures should be eligible for any subsidies or credits whatsoever. As for employment requirements, I don't have an issue with households having a caregiver and a breadwinner but I don't think it's reasonable to force both parents to work particularly if there are young children involved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean yeah…we’ve been saying that for weeks. Meanwhile ACTUAL Infrastruture has a bill and it passed the Senate.

An ACTUAL infrastructure bill should also address energy but that part's been poisoned by Manchin and the Republicans in order to appease their fossil fuel donors so that we can continue clinging to crumbling 70-year-old coal plants.

Yeah well the progressives decided to laden down an energy proposal with unpassable social welfare junk so talk to them. Tell them to craft a Clean Energy and Climate Change only bill and whip the votes for it.

Republicans won't vote for an energy infrastructure bill unless it doubles down on antiquated, polluting coal technology

There's like 6 coal plants in the U.S. Republicans are about money. Give them a reason to support clean energy - like Tesla moving his production factories and a billion-dollar business to Texas - and they will.

No, there are over 400. And yes, some of them are 70+ years old, beyond their original design service life and should have been shut down decades ago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I heard they're dropping Paid Leave from the BBB bill. Personally I think that and subsidized child care should go.

Focus on getting universal pre-school paid for which is formative for early education. I could take or leave community college. Child tax credits can stay but with an employment requirement and a limit on number of kids - I don't care of its a limit of 8 or 10 but SOME LIMIT in place.

I think the community college one is one of the most important. It gives people a path to save on university costs and builds up a hub to help the broader community. So much could be done with it long term if the base funding is fixed.

Yeah, im down for a four kid limit on the kids credit. Dont let it become a moneymaking scam like homeschool (some people take bigly advantage and give the legit homeschool parents a bad name). I dont think conditionality is ever a good idea.

Conditionality? You mean the employment requirement?

NP... 4 kid limit would work for me though I'd probably be more inclined to drop that to 2 or 3, plus means testing - nobody with HHI well into 6 figures should be eligible for any subsidies or credits whatsoever. As for employment requirements, I don't have an issue with households having a caregiver and a breadwinner but I don't think it's reasonable to force both parents to work particularly if there are young children involved.

No one's forcing both parents to work. The tax credit is given to the household and whoever claims the dependents on their tax returns. Which means one person can work and file as head and get the credit. Or they can file jointly - either way, as long as some one in the household is working - the credit remains under employment requirements.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean yeah…we’ve been saying that for weeks. Meanwhile ACTUAL Infrastruture has a bill and it passed the Senate.

An ACTUAL infrastructure bill should also address energy but that part's been poisoned by Manchin and the Republicans in order to appease their fossil fuel donors so that we can continue clinging to crumbling 70-year-old coal plants.

Yeah well the progressives decided to laden down an energy proposal with unpassable social welfare junk so talk to them. Tell them to craft a Clean Energy and Climate Change only bill and whip the votes for it.

Republicans won't vote for an energy infrastructure bill unless it doubles down on antiquated, polluting coal technology

There's like 6 coal plants in the U.S. Republicans are about money. Give them a reason to support clean energy - like Tesla moving his production factories and a billion-dollar business to Texas - and they will.

No, there are over 400. And yes, some of them are 70+ years old, beyond their original design service life and should have been shut down decades ago.

Same difference. The U.S. has 10,000+ electrical power plants. 2,300 hydroelectric dams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I mean yeah…we’ve been saying that for weeks. Meanwhile ACTUAL Infrastruture has a bill and it passed the Senate.

An ACTUAL infrastructure bill should also address energy but that part's been poisoned by Manchin and the Republicans in order to appease their fossil fuel donors so that we can continue clinging to crumbling 70-year-old coal plants.

Yeah well the progressives decided to laden down an energy proposal with unpassable social welfare junk so talk to them. Tell them to craft a Clean Energy and Climate Change only bill and whip the votes for it.

Republicans won't vote for an energy infrastructure bill unless it doubles down on antiquated, polluting coal technology

There's like 6 coal plants in the U.S. Republicans are about money. Give them a reason to support clean energy - like Tesla moving his production factories and a billion-dollar business to Texas - and they will.

No, there are over 400. And yes, some of them are 70+ years old, beyond their original design service life and should have been shut down decades ago.

Same difference. The U.S. has 10,000+ electrical power plants. 2,300 hydroelectric dams.

There needs to be 6. And then zero.

[Anonymous]

Some developments: (thread)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some developments: (thread)

Much much better.

1-year extension on Child Tax Credit
4-week Paid Leave
No Community college
Medicare expansion included
ACA expansion included
Universal pre-K included
No mention of subsidized childcare

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some developments: (thread)

Much much better.

1-year extension on Child Tax Credit
4-week Paid Leave
No Community college
Medicare expansion included
ACA expansion included
Universal pre-K included
No mention of subsidized childcare

Falls short but at least moves in the right direction.

This is COMPROMISE. Continuing to oppose it is pure bad faith.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some developments: (thread)

Much much better.

1-year extension on Child Tax Credit
4-week Paid Leave
No Community college
Medicare expansion included
ACA expansion included
Universal pre-K included
No mention of subsidized childcare

Falls short but at least moves in the right direction.

This is COMPROMISE. Continuing to oppose it is pure bad faith.

YESSSS!!!!

The child tax credit will also likely be means tested, keeping with what West Virginia Democratic Sen. Joe Manchin had wanted.

No more $400,000 households. No more households without employment long-term. Fingers crossed for limits on kids - 8 would be acceptable, not foolish enough to ask for 6.

[Anonymous]

The democratic base isn't being rewarded for our hard work constraining and then ousting the Trump regime (and continuing to live in fear that lunatics will steal the '24 election).

These fools on the hill need to stop feuding with each other and pass the two bills STAT.

[Anonymous]

Work it Manchin! You've got them begging for a deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Work it Manchin! You've got them begging for a deal.

They need to put Manchin on the spot for specifics. Yes or no. And if no then specifically what? And if the Dems have to give something up, what is Manchin willing to give up in return?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Work it Manchin! You've got them begging for a deal.

They need to put Manchin on the spot for specifics. Yes or no. And if no then specifically what? And if the Dems have to give something up, what is Manchin willing to give up in return?

Manchin is a Dem. I know it pains you to admit it.

[Anonymous]

Pelosi being coy. Manchin already said they won’t be done before Halloween,